Solar options for home in 2022.

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128 posts

Master Geek

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#3046135 5-Mar-2023 21:42

evcc.io

Just set up evcc.io to try it out, and wanted to report back how well it integrates with the SMA gear. You can even add it as a load in Sunny Portal to allow for graphing or hand-off control to HM2.0.

I’m waiting for a better scheduling feature that’s being worked on so I can control the evening charge with more granularity. PV charging would still be handled by HM2.0 as it’s working well. Until then, evcc isn't as useful but the potential is there.

The downside, for me at least, is that there’s no integration with MG ZS EV so the SoC can’t be read to stop the charge at a set level. Also, having a SMA EV Charger require one to sponsor the project by paying a small fee.

Demo:
https://demo-next.evcc.io

Documentation is in German only, I use the Firefox translations add-on:
https://docs.evcc.io/docs/Home

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billgates

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#3046352 6-Mar-2023 16:42

@Newtown looks like the AC chargers cannot talk back with any EV models. The charge level needs to be set in the EV if it supports it.

Do whatever you want to do man.

HarmLessSolutions

546 posts

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#3046425 6-Mar-2023 18:17

This interview by Kathryn Ryan of Gavin Shoebridge from Ecotricity this morning keeps thing simple for the masses but great to hear this sort of information being spelled out in support of EVs and their ability to support their owners' homes during times of grid outage. Anything that puts more pressure on TPTB to make V2H & V2G more accessible for the public will benefit all EV owners and the adoption of these vehicles.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

Newtown

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#3046546 6-Mar-2023 21:38

@billgates – evcc bypasses this by getting the SoC from the car maker's cloud api/interface as most EVs come with apps anyway. Just need to find a way to integrate the MG to evcc. Here's a list of all cars evcc supports out of the box (page is in German).

@HarmLessSolutions – Thanks for sharing, it's a great interview. I think the industry is going through a Betamax vs VHS moment where CHAdeMO supports bidirectional loading by design while CCS is yet to gain that feature (reference).

Newtown

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#3046634 7-Mar-2023 08:57

billgates:

I am budgeting $50k for 2 x SMA Sunny Island 08H-13, 2 sets of 16kWh minimum BYD LV Flex to cover each phase and SMA 7.2kW EVSE.

Are you planning to go fully off-grid, or at least having the option?

I know that the PV system will stop functioning when the grid is offline, but is there a way to create a system that still works in a power cut without feeding the grid? Can this be done without batteries, or is a battery a must to 'offload' the charge somewhere?

billgates

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#3046728 7-Mar-2023 10:39

Newtown:

Are you planning to go fully off-grid, or at least having the option?

I know that the PV system will stop functioning when the grid is offline, but is there a way to create a system that still works in a power cut without feeding the grid? Can this be done without batteries, or is a battery a must to 'offload' the charge somewhere?

I want to have the option to go off-grid and that is mainly down to extended power outages/blackouts as predicted in earlier pages that parts of Auckland recently experienced for up to 50+ hours after flooding even though the houses in some of these areas suffered no damage but the local substation was flooded. Quite a lot of Hawkes Bay & Gisborne areas are still without power even for houses that suffered no damage from the cyclone and will not have power restored for weeks. Leamington, which is in Cambridge, suffered a 12-hour outage due to trees falling down on overhead power lines. Although our suburb is all underground power, water and fibre connections, a substation outage can still affect us and ofcourse a dry Karapiro lake.

SMA Sunny Island creates a private grid to power your home even without batteries. It can connect directly to a generator only and power your home. It is one of the very few inverters that can do this. The power rating of the generator should ideally at least be 80% of the power rating the Sunny Island model so you know that house loads can run without issues even if you power ON multiple appliances. The generator connection in the Sunny Island can also charge the batteries if you have them connected incase the batteries run out at night and your AC connection to Sunny Boy inverters also loses power. Even if the sun was out next day, the panels will not be able to charge up your batteries if Sunny Boy has no AC power going to it in which case the Sunny Island's generator connection will provide that power and you can turn off the generator once Sunny Boy is powered ON and sun is charging batteries with excess while powering your loads.

You just need say a 2kW generator with an ATS connection as emergency backup if you think batteries will not last long enough for a day. 16kWH of battery backup per phase should last us ok as our ducted aircon once it reaches ambient temperature only uses about 400W of power in cooling.

Do whatever you want to do man.

Ge0rge

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#3046732 7-Mar-2023 10:49

I think, from what I have read, that the Victron Quattro will do the same thing - it has two AC inputs. One is for the grid, and the other is for a generator input. It also has two AC outputs - one for "sheddable loads", which get dropped when grid AC is lost, and the other for critical loads which will run from the batteries and generator.

It is able to create its own micro-grid, isolated from the mains, running on solar, batteries and a generator if present, to keep the lights on during an outage.

billgates

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#3046740 7-Mar-2023 11:07

@Ge0rge Only issue with Victron Quattro is that it not allowed/certified to be grid tied so it's purely for a 100% off grid setup so that's why you do not see it much in NZ as most houses are grid connected anyway. Only the 5kW Victron MultiPlus II is certified/allowed to be grid tied which you can very easily join multiple units to double the power output.

Do whatever you want to do man.

Ge0rge

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#3046743 7-Mar-2023 11:14

Oh that's very disappointing to hear! Where have you seen that? The downside to the multiplus is that it does not have a second AC input.

billgates

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#3046763 7-Mar-2023 11:42

As of mid to late 2020 when the new AS4777-2 2020 rule was brought in, only the below Victron gear is approved for use in grid tie situation in Australia & NZ. Any previous installs of Quattro or other models done prior to ruling came into place are fine though but any new installs have to meet the AS4777-2 2020 compliance unless your lines company agrees to an exemption.

I imagine the MultiPlus II likely satisfies most users requirements specially that don't use a lot of power anyway in that they will be happy with a battery backup only and do not require a generator so 2nd AC input would go unnoticed.

https://www.cleanenergycouncil.org.au/industry/products/inverters/approved-inverters

Do whatever you want to do man.

Ge0rge

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#3046770 7-Mar-2023 12:03

I see that the Sunny Island is off-grid only as well, or am I reading that wrong?

Gutted about the Quattro II - our local solar guy and I were talking about it just this morning, and he's off to do some research for me about one to fit here. Guess that answers that question pretty quickly.

neb

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#3046798 7-Mar-2023 13:03

Newtown:
I know that the PV system will stop functioning when the grid is offline, but is there a way to create a system that still works in a power cut without feeding the grid? Can this be done without batteries, or is a battery a must to 'offload' the charge somewhere?

I asked this earlier in the thread somewhere, there's two options, some hybrid inverters offer an isolated output that you can use to power essential loads like WiFi and your broadband router, so a certain amount of power can be sent to those on isolated circuits and the rest goes to the house and gets cut when the power goes out.

The other option is to use an automatic transfer switch (ATS) which is shown in the high-tech CAD drawing I posted here a week or so back, this isolates the house from the grid in the case of an outage.

My initial plan was to run a hybrid like a Fronius on the assumption that outages would be short and if I don't have power overnight I can live with that, but in the light of recent events I've gone to an SMA-based system with battery backup that can keep going over extended periods.

neb

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#3046799 7-Mar-2023 13:06

Ge0rge: I see that the Sunny Island is off-grid only as well, or am I reading that wrong?

Sunny Island + Sunny Boy are OK, but one of the other Sunny's that would seem like an obvious solution isn't approved for that use yet, see the diagram I posted earlier.

Ge0rge

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#3046802 7-Mar-2023 13:14

neb:
Ge0rge: I see that the Sunny Island is off-grid only as well, or am I reading that wrong?
Sunny Island + Sunny Boy are OK, but one of the other Sunny's that would seem like an obvious solution isn't approved for that use yet, see the diagram I posted earlier.

From the SMA Australia website for the Sunny Island: *In Australia, Sunny Island can only be used for off-grid applications at this stage. Sunny Island on-grid version is projected to be available soon.

Might just go buy a generator and put a transfer switch and an external plug in.

neb

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#3046855 7-Mar-2023 13:39

Ge0rge:
From the SMA Australia website for the Sunny Island: *In Australia, Sunny Island can only be used for off-grid applications at this stage. Sunny Island on-grid version is projected to be available soon.

Had a scan back to see what the other Sunny Boy I mentioned was, it's the SMA Sunny Boy Storage (Hybrid) inverter that isn't currently approved, thus the split design of Island+Boy with ATS that I was looking at, although there were other reasons for that as well.

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