LED Lighting

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3141 posts

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#645548 24-Jun-2012 20:32

oxnsox:
robjg63: Took the dud viribright LED bulb back to Bunning and they exchanged it.
This is the warm white 8w bulb.

Installed it in a different location and away it went. Had it running for around 30 minutes. Turned it off and on a couple of times - all fine.

Left it turned off and came back an hour later - dead!

I dont know if there is something seriously wrong with these things (the cool white one still works), but I cant say that I am impressed. $17 for 30 minutes of light?????

I dont think its worth the petrol taking another one back again to be honest.

Has quite put me off LED lights for now.....

What sort of installation is/was it?

Downlights fittings, for example, where lamps are vertical and well vented may run more reliably????

The one that is still working (the cool white 8w) is in a bedside lamp - so I guess thats standing upright.
The ones that failed have both been in downlights and well ventilated - though what heat they could produce in a couple of mintes (for the first one) and 20 minutes for the second I couldnt really say...

Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

richms

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#645553 24-Jun-2012 20:36

I have taken the working ones out of the downlight to see how hot they were, and the plastic shell was barely above room temperature when they had been running for about 4 hours, so clearly not heat related. Whereas the CFLs in the same fittings the case of them gets hot enough to be uncomfortable to hold (20 watts) - there also ends up being a gap around the top of the LED whereas the fatter base of the CFL blocks the hole up entirely. I actually had to find some narrower CFL's to fit into the reflectors of these downlights.

Richard rich.ms

switchlighting

18 posts

Geek

#645554 24-Jun-2012 20:43

Hello robjg63,

Do you want to send one of the lights to us to disect and find what has gone faulty?

Cheers.

oxnsox

1923 posts

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#645565 24-Jun-2012 21:21

I've certainly noticed the heat differences' as I run a mix of CFL and LED lamps in mainly downlight fittings. So far no failures. Some run for only a few minutes each day, others for up-to 6 hours.

timmmay

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#645640 25-Jun-2012 07:36

Well ventilated downlights sounds good for LED life, but not for insulation.

robjg63

3141 posts

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#645661 25-Jun-2012 08:25

switchlighting: Hello robjg63,

Do you want to send one of the lights to us to disect and find what has gone faulty?

Cheers.

Sure - Probably interesting to know why I suppose.
If there is something inherently wrong with them I dont know if Bunnings would take notice or not.
Do you want to PM me your details?

Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

switchlighting

18 posts

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#645680 25-Jun-2012 09:10

Hi Robjgb63,

Please send to:

Switch Lighting
Atten: Jon
74/4 Quarantine Rd
Nelson

Cheers.

Technofreak

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#645681 25-Jun-2012 09:12

robjg63:
Installed it in a different location and away it went. Had it running for around 30 minutes. Turned it off and on a couple of times - all fine.

Left it turned off and came back an hour later - dead!

Has quite put me off LED lights for now.....

Well at least your experience with LED lights has been slightly better than my experience with CFL's, several never worked right out of the box and these were brands names like Philips, several others lasted only a few days. Then you add in the delay in lighting up and the initial dim output, CFL's never again for me.

I think LED's are the way of the future.

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oxnsox

1923 posts

Uber Geek

#645748 25-Jun-2012 10:41

timmmay: Well ventilated downlights sounds good for LED life, but not for insulation.

But if the downlight fittings are already there.....

As they produce less heat than conventional, or CFL's, the convected heat loss (air-flow) thru the fitting should be lower resulting in reduced losses thru the fitting.
And one should be able to insulate up to the fitting further minimising losses thru the large uninsulated areas surrounding them?

timmmay

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#645754 25-Jun-2012 10:46

oxnsox: But if the downlight fittings are already there.....

As they produce less heat than conventional, or CFL's, the convected heat loss (air-flow) thru the fitting should be lower resulting in reduced losses thru the fitting.
And one should be able to insulate up to the fitting further minimising losses thru the large uninsulated areas surrounding them?

Four downlights in a room increases the heating required by around 200-300% (ie up to triple the money spent), according to consumer tests. After reading that I replaced my downlights with standard ceiling dome lights, and where that was impossible I used Fozz lights that are sealed, F rated, and you can insulate over. So the money you save in power you lose many many times over in heating in winter.

Even sealed downlights aren't actually sealed, they're just no more than 5% open.

robjg63

3141 posts

Uber Geek

#645776 25-Jun-2012 11:24

I am wondering if the suggestion I saw on (I think) the consumer website might be true.

China uses 220v apparently.
Our voltage is 230-240v (or officially 230v +/- 6%) - which could be up to 243v

If we are sourcing 'native' chinese products and labelling them as ok for 220-240v when in fact they were just designed for 220v then perhaps they are cooking themselves?

I dont generally have problems with appliances etc. I presume that suppliers would 'normally' make sure they are ok for the voltage range in NZ.

Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

Jimmy22

375 posts

Ultimate Geek

#645787 25-Jun-2012 11:39

More likely they are cutting corners making the bulbs, don’t understand them and are trying to make a back door knock off one without knowing the critical issues with sourcing and mounting the components. There are some incomprehensibly dodgy suppliers in China right next door to state of the art ones. some brands will rise to the top of the market over time based on the exp of early adopters , i think Philips will be up there and anyone using Cree leds and the like with the right background ;)

robjg63

3141 posts

Uber Geek

#645800 25-Jun-2012 11:54

switchlighting: Hi Robjgb63,

Please send to:

Switch Lighting
Atten: Jon
74/4 Quarantine Rd
Nelson

Cheers.

Will do Jon - Will try and post it tomorrow.

Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

CYaBro

3325 posts

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#645827 25-Jun-2012 12:34

timmmay:
oxnsox: But if the downlight fittings are already there.....

As they produce less heat than conventional, or CFL's, the convected heat loss (air-flow) thru the fitting should be lower resulting in reduced losses thru the fitting.
And one should be able to insulate up to the fitting further minimising losses thru the large uninsulated areas surrounding them?

Four downlights in a room increases the heating required by around 200-300% (ie up to triple the money spent), according to consumer tests. After reading that I replaced my downlights with standard ceiling dome lights, and where that was impossible I used Fozz lights that are sealed, F rated, and you can insulate over. So the money you save in power you lose many many times over in heating in winter.

Even sealed downlights aren't actually sealed, they're just no more than 5% open.

I don't see a problem with some airflow into the ceiling, it could be a good thing as new houses seem to be getting more and more airtight so not getting enough fresh air into them regularly.

My sister's place, which is about 3 years old, has recessed downlights everywhere that don't even have the insulation abuted right up to them and their place is always warm inside even in winter.
They had a heat pump installed originally as well but they have only ever used it a few times.

stuzzo

534 posts

Ultimate Geek

#645869 25-Jun-2012 13:28

I think you have to place a caveat on the thermal issues related to downlights. It is well known that there are large variances when laboratory results are applied back into housing, existing housing in particular. This is generally because the particular conditions in a house may vary greatly from the lab. I haven't been able to notice any changes in thermal performance when removing downlights, whereas closing curtains can be clearly measured as a temperature difference.

A house can not be too tightly sealed. That is a fundamental building principle, in particular the ceiling boundary. Then it has to be ventilated either by the conventional means of opening windows and extracting or having a mechanical ventilation system.

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