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Glurp
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  Reply # 1510909 10-Mar-2016 21:12
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ockel:

 

 

 

Thats complete rubbish.  Netflix is the modern bootlegger.  Exactly analogous to the DVD replicator that makes a few extra copies on the side and sells them at full price without the content producer knowing about it.  

 

You believe that by paying full price to the DVD replicator that you're not hurting anyone and that the issue is between the DVD replicator and the producer.  So not your problem.  Now that the producer is trying to prevent the replicator making those extra unauthorised copies on the side you are siding with the replicator.  The money never went into any legal channel just into the replicators pocket.

 

Netflix does not have the legal right to distribute the content in New Zealand.  You are aware of their terms and conditions.  You are deliberately lying about your location to allow Netflix to sell you content that it does not have the legal right to sell to you.  How can this be a grey area?  It is directly analogous the bootlegger - not the pirate copy selling bootlegger making a copy of a copy but the one selling you copies directly from their master copy.  

 

 

I don't see how you can compare Netflix to a bootlegger. Are you accusing them of purposely and knowingly selling content beyond their license conditions? Better be prepared for a libel suit. 

 

Your logic is also flawed regarding the customer. No-one would knowingly pay full price for an illegal DVD. If the customer doesn't know it has been copied, then the customer has bought it in good faith and can hardly be held accountable. You can say what you like about geo-unblocking but this analogy does not even begin to hold up.

 

As far as lying about my location goes, I would argue that it is a matter of personal privacy. Where I live is no-one else's business and hiding one's IP address is a legitimate and accepted practice. It is outrageous to me that anyone thinks they have a right to that information, and that they would use it for something as silly as denying me my right to access information. The idiot who thought that one up needs to be taken out and spanked.

 

 

 

 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


Glurp
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  Reply # 1510915 10-Mar-2016 21:17
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tdgeek:

 

 

 

 

 

Your right, as is the sale of geo unblockers.  So it is a good comparison as we can buy products to allow us to break the law as in radar detectors or break civil law as in geo unblockers. So, in the first world, the Rule of Law, its right to allow means to break the law? Criminal or Civil. Note that i disagree with breaking civil law, aka torts, being classified as criminal.

 

 

There you go with the radar detector thing again. Radar detectors are not illegal in New Zealand. Moreover, they are not used to 'break the law'. Anyone with a radar detector who hears it go off will immediately check their speed and slow down if they are over the limit. Radar detectors are in fact safety devices that reinforce obedience of the speed law.

 

 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


Glurp
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  Reply # 1510917 10-Mar-2016 21:20
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tdgeek:

 

 

 

Agree. If an entity cannot sell to me as they sold to someone else for a better return thats life. I can't turn around and say , hey that doesnt suit me Many threads talk about entitlement. Usually younger ones. Its basically saying, I don't believe in business. Its saying I want this, and I want it now. Certainly, the old business model of content needs to change, but not for the charity of those who feel entitled, but to a new model, which doesnt include FREE 

 

 

No-one here is talking about free. The discussion is about how to get them to accept our money.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


Glurp
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  Reply # 1510918 10-Mar-2016 21:23
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tdgeek:

 

 

 

 

 

As Ockel recites repeatedly thats not the case. You are contributing the NF, not the content rights holder

 

 

As has repeatedly been explained, that's NF's problem, not the subcriber's.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1510920 10-Mar-2016 21:24
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Rikkitic:

 

tdgeek:

 

 

 

Agree. If an entity cannot sell to me as they sold to someone else for a better return thats life. I can't turn around and say , hey that doesnt suit me Many threads talk about entitlement. Usually younger ones. Its basically saying, I don't believe in business. Its saying I want this, and I want it now. Certainly, the old business model of content needs to change, but not for the charity of those who feel entitled, but to a new model, which doesnt include FREE 

 

 

No-one here is talking about free. The discussion is about how to get them to accept our money.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quite clearly the content providers do not appear to want to accept your money on the US contracts otherwise they would have done so already.  They may allow it once the relevant incumbents contracts are expiring and assuming Netflix wins the rights for NZ but then you'll be expected to use Netflix NZ no doubt or it will be a general global offering for that content.


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  Reply # 1510921 10-Mar-2016 21:25
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Rikkitic:

 

tdgeek:

 

 

 

 

 

As Ockel recites repeatedly thats not the case. You are contributing the NF, not the content rights holder

 

 

As has repeatedly been explained, that's NF's problem, not the subcriber's.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And they are dealing with their obligations (problem?) by enforcing the geoblocks.


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  Reply # 1510923 10-Mar-2016 21:25
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tdgeek:

 

 

 

Wrong. Its copyrighted. Don't you read the fine print?? (I don't either), but its copyrighted. Give it 50 years at last look, and its public domain

 

 

Don't you read the posts? Yes, it is copyrighted, and it is being paid for.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


Glurp
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  Reply # 1510929 10-Mar-2016 21:30
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MikeB4: You know what ever we say here means squat, this needs to go to Court so a definitive answer is provided.

 

Agreed, and I am retiring from this discussion unless someone says something that really annoys me. I think we have all made the points we wanted to. 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1510930 10-Mar-2016 21:32
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Rikkitic:

 

ockel:

 

 

 

Thats complete rubbish.  Netflix is the modern bootlegger.  Exactly analogous to the DVD replicator that makes a few extra copies on the side and sells them at full price without the content producer knowing about it.  

 

You believe that by paying full price to the DVD replicator that you're not hurting anyone and that the issue is between the DVD replicator and the producer.  So not your problem.  Now that the producer is trying to prevent the replicator making those extra unauthorised copies on the side you are siding with the replicator.  The money never went into any legal channel just into the replicators pocket.

 

Netflix does not have the legal right to distribute the content in New Zealand.  You are aware of their terms and conditions.  You are deliberately lying about your location to allow Netflix to sell you content that it does not have the legal right to sell to you.  How can this be a grey area?  It is directly analogous the bootlegger - not the pirate copy selling bootlegger making a copy of a copy but the one selling you copies directly from their master copy.  

 

 

I don't see how you can compare Netflix to a bootlegger. Are you accusing them of purposely and knowingly selling content beyond their license conditions? Better be prepared for a libel suit. 

 

 

 

Yes, except instead of a libel suit its a "please adhere to the terms and conditions that we gave you and that you gave to your customers" Which is the crackdown.

 

Your logic is also flawed regarding the customer. No-one would knowingly pay full price for an illegal DVD. If the customer doesn't know it has been copied, then the customer has bought it in good faith and can hardly be held accountable. You can say what you like about geo-unblocking but this analogy does not even begin to hold up.

 

As far as lying about my location goes, I would argue that it is a matter of personal privacy. Where I live is no-one else's business and hiding one's IP address is a legitimate and accepted practice. It is outrageous to me that anyone thinks they have a right to that information, and that they would use it for something as silly as denying me my right to access information. The idiot who thought that one up needs to be taken out and spanked

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hee, ok then , what you really mean is I want my privacy protected so I can buck the terms and conditions of my contract with Netflix. Fixed that for you.


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  Reply # 1510932 10-Mar-2016 21:35
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Rikkitic:

 

tdgeek:

 

 

 

Wrong. Its copyrighted. Don't you read the fine print?? (I don't either), but its copyrighted. Give it 50 years at last look, and its public domain

 

 

Don't you read the posts? Yes, it is copyrighted, and it is being paid for.

 

 

 

 

 

 

No its not, did you make payment that will go to the owners of the content, no, it goes 100% to Netflix only. But you got what you required. 

 

And yes I do.


Glurp
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  Reply # 1510935 10-Mar-2016 21:37
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Dugimodo:

 

So unotelly on the PC has been working fine up until this week and now I've started getting the error message about turning off the proxy etc. Anyone have any updates on this, googling just finds old threads like this one as far as I can tell and anything current is lost in a sea of it.

 

 

Thank goodness, someone who doesn't want to talk about the law. The proxy issue has been going on for awhile now and developments seem to be ongoing. I am not a Netflix subscriber so I don't know exactly what people are experiencing. I think your best bet is to contact Unotelly. I have always found their technical support to be very helpful. They ought to be able to explain to you what the current situation is and what you can do about it.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1510939 10-Mar-2016 21:44
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Rikkitic:

 

tdgeek:

 

 

 

Agree. If an entity cannot sell to me as they sold to someone else for a better return thats life. I can't turn around and say , hey that doesnt suit me Many threads talk about entitlement. Usually younger ones. Its basically saying, I don't believe in business. Its saying I want this, and I want it now. Certainly, the old business model of content needs to change, but not for the charity of those who feel entitled, but to a new model, which doesnt include FREE 

 

 

No-one here is talking about free. The discussion is about how to get them to accept our money.

 

 

 

 

 

 

They don't want your money as they made other deals with other providers. otherwise there is no need to restrict right now. When those licences expire, there will be other options to send the content elsewhere. 

 

 

 

Why is EPL and Golf and F1 (love F1) and anything else cool, not on TV1 and Sky and Choice and Hulu and Netflix and Quickflix and Kazakstan channels? Licences. 

 

Then they expire after giving the content owners good revenue, and the content buyers good exposure and status and subscribers, then us plebs can have a watch.

 

Its business pure and simple. We are in a transitional phase. This evolvement from linear to streaming, or more relevantly, from traditional to global will occur. It wont happen overnight but it will happen (TM) (Thanks CBRPILOT for that quote)


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  Reply # 1510941 10-Mar-2016 21:46
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Rikkitic:

 

Dugimodo:

 

So unotelly on the PC has been working fine up until this week and now I've started getting the error message about turning off the proxy etc. Anyone have any updates on this, googling just finds old threads like this one as far as I can tell and anything current is lost in a sea of it.

 

 

Thank goodness, someone who doesn't want to talk about the law. The proxy issue has been going on for awhile now and developments seem to be ongoing. I am not a Netflix subscriber so I don't know exactly what people are experiencing. I think your best bet is to contact Unotelly. I have always found their technical support to be very helpful. They ought to be able to explain to you what the current situation is and what you can do about it.

 

 

 

 

Most of us are not talking about the law, or being happy to break it when it suits. Sorry Rikki could not resist that, but its a key part of this discussion


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  Reply # 1510979 10-Mar-2016 22:55
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 I swear a decent number of people on this thread must work for big media companies, Lightbox, Quickflix, Sky, etc.

 

 

 

 

 

 





Information wants to be free. The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it.


Meow
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  Reply # 1510984 10-Mar-2016 23:24
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Lias:

 

 I swear a decent number of people on this thread must work for big media companies, Lightbox, Quickflix, Sky, etc.

 

 

I know a few people around here associated with them however not going to name them for the sheer fun of making them sign a non-disclosure waiver if they're ever wanting to join the private unblocking discussions ;)





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