Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | ... | 70
1366 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 143

Subscriber

  Reply # 1472877 16-Jan-2016 21:48
Send private message

TeaLeaf:
Benoire:
I've bolded the bit of your post which I believe is wrong.

You're not entitled to any content you don't own. 


ummmm arent you bolding exactly what im saying, i can go elsewhere, as in another provider


If you meant that moving to another provider that had the rights to the content you wanted in New Zealand then yes, I am repeating what you're saying... Depends on how you meant it :)

2259 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 676

Trusted

  Reply # 1472881 16-Jan-2016 21:57
Send private message

ockel: Lets say the 20,000-30,000 unblockers in NZ cut Netflix completely.


I'm not sure where that number came from.... as I suspect it's much smaller than that by some of the numbers I have seen.





 
 
 
 


1700 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 72


  Reply # 1472883 16-Jan-2016 21:59
Send private message

Benoire:
If you meant that moving to another provider that had the rights to the content you wanted in New Zealand then yes, I am repeating what you're saying... Depends on how you meant it :)


i dont know how else i could mean it mate, sorry but you lost me. there are other content owners providing to nz as well just as a side note.

1354 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 694


  Reply # 1472884 16-Jan-2016 21:59
One person supports this post
Send private message

networkn:
shk292:
networkn:
shk292:
networkn:

That's just fine, but consumers like me will therefore just pirate the content and the producers will get nothing instead of a fair price. No skin off my nose. Exactly the same as I refuse to be ripped off for global days roaming and use a local sim instead


So when the new iPhone comes out, and it doesn't meet your price and availability, do you intend to break in and steal that as well?

Let's be clear. Pirating is THEFT. You are STEALING when you do this. 

Access to Content is not your RIGHT, it's a privilege same way anything you don't get for free is.


Not strictly true, theft is defined as depriving someone of something which is theirs, which applies to your iPhone analogy, but not to making a copy of digital material. You'll never be charged with theft for copyright beach, because it isn't theft


Err I hate to break it to you sport, but you are depriving them of something they value considerably, that would be INCOME!



That still doesn't make it theft. If I take the bus home instead of driving, I'm depriving a taxi driver of income, but I'm not stealing from him. You may have swallowed the piracy is theft line, but that doesn't make it true
I'm not saying it's not illegal, but it's not theft


LOL What? I'll let you just think about how nonsensical that comparison was.

No less valid than your assertion that copyright beach is theft
Theft is defined as taking something from someone, so after the act, the victim no longer has something that he previously had. This plainly doesn't apply to the act of someone downloading a movie. It may deprive the owner of the chance to make income, but he still had exactly the same property before and after the act. Just like if I hang around in my car at the airport offering lifts to people, I'm depriving taxi drivers their income, but I'm not stealing from them
If you really can't understand the difference just say so and I'll move on, don't be embarrassed about it

1700 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 72


  Reply # 1472886 16-Jan-2016 22:02
Send private message

i personally found nz netflix fine. but they need to update content faster. they may well just move quicker with enabling larger libraries. either way i think its the best service in nz.

6433 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1570


  Reply # 1472887 16-Jan-2016 22:03
Send private message



Anyway, all this discussion is very interesting so here's my prediciton on what Netflix will 'do'


They will do enogh to make most people stop bypassing geoblocking.  this means putting in sufficient barriers that a workaround is either too hard or complex.

my bet is they will do some combination of the following:

1) force people to use Credit Cards registered local to the region they are registered in (i.e. you sign up for NZ netflix, you must use NZ credit card.  That on it's own wouldn't be enough - since NZers can sign up for NZ service then use US netflix via unblock-us etc.  that's why they will also put something like part 2 in place
2) put some sort of rule set in where if you use regions outside your 'home' region more than, a certain amount of the time, (e.g. 50%) then you MUST change your account to that region.

so basically, in order to consistently access USA netflix you would HAVE to use a US based credit card.
Yes, there are ways around this - but this extra barrier alone would be enough to put most people off from trying to get around it.  Most people don't want to be faffing around switching regions all the time or using overseas credit cards.

note that none of those first two things have ANYTHING to do with geo-unblocking services. There will be literally nothing those services could do about it.

finally, they will probably do something like this:
3) block IP ranges known to be used by the major unblocking services.  it wouldn't be too hard to figure these out - lots of people coming from a narrow range of IPs, customers on IPs where a bizarrely high number of region switches happen, unusually high latency on their requests (because they are coming from overseas!) etc.  Yes, these services can shift IPs and try and stay ahead of the game, but if Netflix do it often enough, it will mean a lot of disruptions to their services, which means a lot of people will just give up and go back to something that works consistently.


for those of us who have more than a passing knowledge about the internet, (i.e. people on this forum) these things will prove pretty easy to get around, and we will continue to enjoy USA netflix with little disruption.
But Netflix won't care.  they aren't trying to stop everybody from doing it, just enough people to keep the studios happy.

1366 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 143

Subscriber

  Reply # 1472888 16-Jan-2016 22:03
Send private message

TeaLeaf:
Benoire:
If you meant that moving to another provider that had the rights to the content you wanted in New Zealand then yes, I am repeating what you're saying... Depends on how you meant it :)


i dont know how else i could mean it mate, sorry but you lost me. there are other content owners providing to nz as well just as a side note.


The general assertion I read on many sites it is that people are entitled to any content and be damned with who owns the rights and what they have agreed; hence the desire to bypass geoblocking... I guess I misinterpreted your post as meaning your entitled to change provider to get the content that you want no matter its location, rather than change provider for content served for New Zealand.

1700 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 72


  Reply # 1472893 16-Jan-2016 22:14
Send private message

no im happy with NF NZ. but wouldnt mind trying some others as im moving more toward tv than movies lately. never use to watch either. good TV gets addictive. like a good movie every episode.

out of curiosity im wondering if the NZ NF library has grown since it started?

10537 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1746

Trusted

  Reply # 1472898 16-Jan-2016 22:24
Send private message

As was said earlier, the content owners who restrict rights, do so to maximise revenue. Nothing wrong with that. I don't call that outdated, if thats the case. Its what businesses do. 

So, they get good money for rights in a country, and the content isn't on NF in that country. When the rights expire, it goes onto NF library. Why should they put that content on instead of selling rights? They wont get any money as everyone is still paying the unchanged NF fee.

Seems to me that some are complaining about a business maximising revenue, and they don't like that. Content owners could stop selling rights, and just up the cost to NF. Then some will complain about that. It could also be that the fee NF pays is low. So owners sell rights at good money then let NF have it for low dollars once the main interest is over. NF content is old I believe.The answer is simple, NF pays good money to the content owners, and puts its charging up, sorted. 

11531 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5244

Trusted

  Reply # 1472899 16-Jan-2016 22:30
Send private message

shk292:
networkn:
shk292:
networkn:
shk292:
networkn:

That's just fine, but consumers like me will therefore just pirate the content and the producers will get nothing instead of a fair price. No skin off my nose. Exactly the same as I refuse to be ripped off for global days roaming and use a local sim instead


So when the new iPhone comes out, and it doesn't meet your price and availability, do you intend to break in and steal that as well?

Let's be clear. Pirating is THEFT. You are STEALING when you do this. 

Access to Content is not your RIGHT, it's a privilege same way anything you don't get for free is.


Not strictly true, theft is defined as depriving someone of something which is theirs, which applies to your iPhone analogy, but not to making a copy of digital material. You'll never be charged with theft for copyright beach, because it isn't theft


Err I hate to break it to you sport, but you are depriving them of something they value considerably, that would be INCOME!



That still doesn't make it theft. If I take the bus home instead of driving, I'm depriving a taxi driver of income, but I'm not stealing from him. You may have swallowed the piracy is theft line, but that doesn't make it true
I'm not saying it's not illegal, but it's not theft


LOL What? I'll let you just think about how nonsensical that comparison was.

No less valid than your assertion that copyright beach is theft
Theft is defined as taking something from someone, so after the act, the victim no longer has something that he previously had. This plainly doesn't apply to the act of someone downloading a movie. It may deprive the owner of the chance to make income, but he still had exactly the same property before and after the act. Just like if I hang around in my car at the airport offering lifts to people, I'm depriving taxi drivers their income, but I'm not stealing from them
If you really can't understand the difference just say so and I'll move on, don't be embarrassed about it


This debate has been going around and around and around since the internet was one.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


10537 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1746

Trusted

  Reply # 1472900 16-Jan-2016 22:38
Send private message

MikeB4:
shk292:
networkn:
shk292:
networkn:
shk292:
networkn:

That's just fine, but consumers like me will therefore just pirate the content and the producers will get nothing instead of a fair price. No skin off my nose. Exactly the same as I refuse to be ripped off for global days roaming and use a local sim instead


So when the new iPhone comes out, and it doesn't meet your price and availability, do you intend to break in and steal that as well?

Let's be clear. Pirating is THEFT. You are STEALING when you do this. 

Access to Content is not your RIGHT, it's a privilege same way anything you don't get for free is.


Not strictly true, theft is defined as depriving someone of something which is theirs, which applies to your iPhone analogy, but not to making a copy of digital material. You'll never be charged with theft for copyright beach, because it isn't theft


Err I hate to break it to you sport, but you are depriving them of something they value considerably, that would be INCOME!



That still doesn't make it theft. If I take the bus home instead of driving, I'm depriving a taxi driver of income, but I'm not stealing from him. You may have swallowed the piracy is theft line, but that doesn't make it true
I'm not saying it's not illegal, but it's not theft


LOL What? I'll let you just think about how nonsensical that comparison was.

No less valid than your assertion that copyright beach is theft
Theft is defined as taking something from someone, so after the act, the victim no longer has something that he previously had. This plainly doesn't apply to the act of someone downloading a movie. It may deprive the owner of the chance to make income, but he still had exactly the same property before and after the act. Just like if I hang around in my car at the airport offering lifts to people, I'm depriving taxi drivers their income, but I'm not stealing from them
If you really can't understand the difference just say so and I'll move on, don't be embarrassed about it


This debate has been going around and around and around since the internet was one.


Yep!  Its about justifying what some want. Facts just get in the way.

I get a bit tired of comments as bolded. 

15337 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4051

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1472903 16-Jan-2016 22:41
One person supports this post
Send private message

 
No less valid than your assertion that copyright beach is theft
Theft is defined as taking something from someone, so after the act, the victim no longer has something that he previously had. This plainly doesn't apply to the act of someone downloading a movie. It may deprive the owner of the chance to make income, but he still had exactly the same property before and after the act. Just like if I hang around in my car at the airport offering lifts to people, I'm depriving taxi drivers their income, but I'm not stealing from them
If you really can't understand the difference just say so and I'll move on, don't be embarrassed about it


So let me get this straight.

Lets say you are an artist, you are selling photos on the side of the road (Let's say they are original works, photos taken by you with your equipment and your resources including potentially, staff, vehicles, computers for post processing etc). I come along and take a photo of these photo's and setup in a stand right beside you, but instead of selling them and giving you the money, I either sell them and buy a new ferrari, or if I already have all the ferrari's I want, I decide, hell I'll just GIVE them away to anyone who expresses interest.

You don't consider that STEALING? You still have YOUR photos!

15337 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4051

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1472905 16-Jan-2016 22:58
Send private message




I get a bit tired of comments as bolded. 


Yup took me a little bit to be calm with my reply to that silliness.

719 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 127


  Reply # 1472909 16-Jan-2016 23:22
Send private message

Hypothetical question to networkn - how would you feel if geoblocking was made illegal i.e. content owners were banned from placing geo restrictions on digital content i.e we could all parallel import it?

 

 

If the content owners then complained about geo-dodging as "stealing", would you still think it to be stealing, even if the law allowed parallel importing / banned geoblocking?

1428 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 311


  Reply # 1472910 16-Jan-2016 23:29
Send private message

shk292:
Theft is defined as taking something from someone, so after the act, the victim no longer has something that he previously had. This plainly doesn't apply to the act of someone downloading a movie. It may deprive the owner of the chance to make income, but he still had exactly the same property before and after the act. Just like if I hang around in my car at the airport offering lifts to people, I'm depriving taxi drivers their income, but I'm not stealing from them


Stealing has more than one definition but you omit two key points about the definition of stealing/theft. It is take something from the owner without their permission or without a legal right to it.

The taxi example is not a good one because it is hard to see how it would be stealing. The taxi drivers don't own what you're taking and in general you are legally able to offer lifts to other people.

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | ... | 70
Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

New Zealand hits peak broadband data
Posted 18-Jan-2018 12:21


Amazon Echo devices coming to New Zealand early February 2018
Posted 18-Jan-2018 10:53


$3.74 million for new electric vehicles in New Zealand
Posted 17-Jan-2018 11:27


Nova 2i: Value, not excitement from Huawei
Posted 17-Jan-2018 09:02


Less news in Facebook News Feed revamp
Posted 15-Jan-2018 13:15


Australian Government contract awarded to Datacom Connect
Posted 11-Jan-2018 08:37


Why New Zealand needs a chief technology officer
Posted 6-Jan-2018 13:59


Amazon release Silk Browser and Firefox for Fire TV
Posted 21-Dec-2017 13:42


New Chief Technology Officer role created
Posted 19-Dec-2017 22:18


All I want for Christmas is a new EV
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:54


How clever is this: AI will create 2.3 million jobs by 2020
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:52


NOW to deploy SD-WAN to regional councils
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:46


Mobile market competition issues ComCom should watch
Posted 18-Dec-2017 10:52


New Zealand government to create digital advisory group
Posted 16-Dec-2017 08:47


Australia datum changes means whole country moving 1.8 metres north-east
Posted 16-Dec-2017 08:39



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.