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  # 1736311 14-Mar-2017 13:03
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cadman:

 

A mate of mine used to pop all sorts of OTC pills in an effort to be "healthy". He was perfectly fit. But anyway they screwed with his liver function so the Doctor told him to stop and the problem went away.

 

Just eat properly and your body will derive all it needs from that.

 

 

I think if you read the article I posted a link to, the NZ research on vitamin D levels here, and the recent UK research here, then there's plenty of evidence that with what you might call "modern lifestyle" then your body may not derive all the vitamin D it needs from a "proper" diet - whatever that can of worms may mean, combined with low level of sun exposure on the skin.

 

At particular risk are people with darker skins in colder climates, kids not getting enough sun exposure etc.

 

You'll also find that supplementation of normal diet with iodine (added to salt), fluoride (added to water, toothpaste, or supplements), folate (for pregnant women), is a very normal accepted practice (despite controversy) , so somewhat destroys the idea that "eating properly" is the perfect solution - as it appears that if that's the case then billions of people do not "eat properly" as they have or are at risk of various deficiency.  Yes it would be great if we could all have perfect diets, but it's very hard to achieve.

 

The original article based on meta analysis looked at impact of vitamin D levels on severity and symptoms of complications of cold and flu, and found a very positive correlation from supplementation for significant numbers of people (separately) identified as being at risk of deficiency/low level in the NZ population.  

 

Note that diseases associated with a vitamin D deficiency include rickets, osteoporosis, and certain types of cancer (breast, prostate, colon and ovaries). It has also been associated with increased risks for fractures, heart disease, type 2 diabetes, autoimmune and infectious diseases, asthma and other wheezing disorders, myocardial infarction, hypertension, congestive heart failure, and peripheral vascular disease. (yes I cheated with this paragraph - it's a quote from Wikipedia)

 

It's generally considered not possible to get enough vitamin D to meet RDA from a "normal" diet - you need to eat a lot of oily fish etc - or get quite a lot of sun exposure - much more I expect than many people would consider "safe".

 

There's also some recent epidemiological data suggesting that low seasonal vitamin D levels combined with sun exposure when vitamin D serum levels are low may help explain regional variation in melanoma genotypes and phenotypes (ie higher incidence of melanoma deaths in some regions like Southland - despite lower overall UV exposures than in warmer regions).  


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  # 1736519 14-Mar-2017 20:51
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jnimmo:

 

Yes! Didn't think of posting a thread about this earlier.

 

Unfortunately my doctor was not impressed at me asking to be prescribed a 50,000 IU monthly supplement, dispite some local research suggesting this as a blanket rule and not even bothering with blood tests to confirm deficiency.

 

This is a good read:

 

Seasonal variation in vitamin D levels in the Canterbury, New Zealand population in relation to available UV radiation (September 2007 NZ Medical Journal)

 

 

 

 

My doctor does not request a blood test for Vitamin D levels (unless there are very special circumstances) as he says the test is very expensive, so he just prescribed a 50,000 IU monthly "super" dose on the assumption that I probably need the supplement. I am not very happy with this but I can't do much about it. The doctor's theory is that, even if you have enough Vitamin D, it won't hurt to also take a supplement.

 

However, I have bought some Swisse "Ultiboost" capsules which each have 1000 IU of "naturally derived vitamin D3" and one capsule is taken daily. I think it's more satisfactory to take a daily low dose than a monthly "super dose" of 50,000 IU, but opinions seem to differ on this.

 

Fred

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 1736525 14-Mar-2017 21:14
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@sbiddle goes to the states fairly often, they have relatively cheap vitamins there. Maybe he could give you the D wink laughing


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  # 1736548 14-Mar-2017 22:10
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frednz:

 

 

 

My doctor does not request a blood test for Vitamin D levels (unless there are very special circumstances) as he says the test is very expensive

 

 

 

 

You may be able to go to a blood testing laboratory directly and do a self referral.

 

That's what I do once in awhile down here in Dunedin at Southern Community Laboratories. Cost about the same as a doctor's visit anyhow.

 

I get a bunch of different tests done in the one visit like getting a lipid profile test done at the same time. GPs have been given a directive to cut down on the amount of blood tests they order up as a way to cut healthcare costs.


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  # 1740157 16-Mar-2017 09:27
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dipkiwi:

 

MikeB4:

 

With all supplements it is best to consult ones Doctor before taking them. A blood screen can be done to determine if in fact the supplements are required. There are very real risks associated with vitamin D overdose and vitamin over dose in general.

 

 

 

 

The best way to get D is to expose your skin to some midday sun. Say sitting outside to eat your lunch.

 

This page is useful to see UV strength and burn times in your hometown...

 

www.niwa.co.nz

 

Supplements may be needed in the winter months particularly if you live further south.

 

 

 

 

 

 

This won't be enough for many people - this is what the doctor told me but it simply isn't true. You'd have to be out topless in the sun each day and then run the risk of getting sunburnt.

 

In the winter time, generally at least the South Island population will be not getting enough Vitamin D to maintain an optimum level, as the Canterbury research I linked to in a previous post shows.


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  # 1740158 16-Mar-2017 09:29
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frednz:

 

jnimmo:

 

Yes! Didn't think of posting a thread about this earlier.

 

Unfortunately my doctor was not impressed at me asking to be prescribed a 50,000 IU monthly supplement, dispite some local research suggesting this as a blanket rule and not even bothering with blood tests to confirm deficiency.

 

This is a good read:

 

Seasonal variation in vitamin D levels in the Canterbury, New Zealand population in relation to available UV radiation (September 2007 NZ Medical Journal)

 

 

 

 

My doctor does not request a blood test for Vitamin D levels (unless there are very special circumstances) as he says the test is very expensive, so he just prescribed a 50,000 IU monthly "super" dose on the assumption that I probably need the supplement. I am not very happy with this but I can't do much about it. The doctor's theory is that, even if you have enough Vitamin D, it won't hurt to also take a supplement.

 

However, I have bought some Swisse "Ultiboost" capsules which each have 1000 IU of "naturally derived vitamin D3" and one capsule is taken daily. I think it's more satisfactory to take a daily low dose than a monthly "super dose" of 50,000 IU, but opinions seem to differ on this.

 

Fred

 

 

 

 

Good to know - and interesting - I just wish we could get 5000 IU here then I'd take one every second or third day.

 

That UK research linked to in one of the first posts was showing that having the regular i.e. daily supplements was as effective as Flu vaccination, but it didn't hold true for the bolus large 50,000 IU doses which is interesting.


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  # 1740165 16-Mar-2017 10:08
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jnimmo:

 

 

 

This won't be enough for many people - this is what the doctor told me but it simply isn't true. You'd have to be out topless in the sun each day and then run the risk of getting sunburnt.

 

In the winter time, generally at least the South Island population will be not getting enough Vitamin D to maintain an optimum level, as the Canterbury research I linked to in a previous post shows.

 

 

 

Yes and that's pretty much what I said. The niwa UV forecast for different towns is very useful. To get adequate UVB exposure you need the UVI level to be above 3. Today in Dunedin it looks like this. So if I am sitting out eating my lunch in the sun today for half an hour in shorts or in short sleeves or even with my shirt off (am at home) I'll get a decent UVB does without getting burnt.

 

I know this is adequate for me because I did a self referral at a blood testing lab and my 25-OH was 120 nmol/l in December. It was 63 back in August. In mid winter the UVI here in Dunedin doesn't go above 3.

 

 

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 1740169 16-Mar-2017 10:23
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PS... This is why I think advice from the likes of the cancer society that tells people to avoid the midday sun and to slip-slop-slap if they do go out and generally be fearful of the sun is somewhat departmental to public health.


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  # 1740177 16-Mar-2017 10:45
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A vitamin's a vitamin. Got to have enough of each of them. I bet if you did a study on other minerals and vitamins you'd find that low levels of anything will give rise to problems! Including cholesterol. (Though that has to be rather low to cause problems - or does it).




Swype on iOS is detrimental to accurate typing. Apologies in advance.


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  # 1740198 16-Mar-2017 11:23
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frednz:

 

 

 

My doctor does not request a blood test for Vitamin D levels (unless there are very special circumstances) as he says the test is very expensive, so he just prescribed a 50,000 IU monthly "super" dose on the assumption that I probably need the supplement. I am not very happy with this but I can't do much about it. The doctor's theory is that, even if you have enough Vitamin D, it won't hurt to also take a supplement.

 

However, I have bought some Swisse "Ultiboost" capsules which each have 1000 IU of "naturally derived vitamin D3" and one capsule is taken daily. I think it's more satisfactory to take a daily low dose than a monthly "super dose" of 50,000 IU, but opinions seem to differ on this.

 

Fred

 

 

 

 

My Doctor is in Dunedin is the same. I was told it is cheaper to jut give out the pills rather than take the test - so that is the policy.

 

As an aside my wife swears after taking Vitamin D "super" boosts for a week she immediately felt better and her general depression she was feeling at the time reduced dramatically.
Very un-scientific as it's only one persons anecdotal story but that is her story. 
She now takes the monthly does like me.

 

 


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  # 1751178 31-Mar-2017 14:04
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It's important that if you're supplementing with Vitamin D to take Vitamin K2 at the same time. Sorry, I don't have time to find a reference right now, but if you Google it, there's plenty of information on it.


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  # 1752559 1-Apr-2017 11:24
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MikeB4:

 

With all supplements it is best to consult ones Doctor before taking them. A blood screen can be done to determine if in fact the supplements are required. There are very real risks associated with vitamin D overdose and vitamin over dose in general.

 



Joe Rogan talks a lot about supplements (think he has a supplement company) but he also talks a lot about getting your bloodwork done regularly to see how effective they are. That's pretty much impossible in NZ, GPs are unlikely to refer patients for blood analysis work unless there's some clearly-identified deficiency or organ-function issue.

Pity because it seems like a great way for people to pro-actively manage nutrition etc.


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