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# 223026 9-Sep-2017 07:57
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From the London Telegraph


 


"Canada’s largest province has unveiled plans for up to 150 government run shops selling marijuana for recreational use. 


Pot will first be sold through an online distribution service starting next July, to coincide with the federal legalisation of cannabis. 


The minimum age to use, purchase and possess recreational cannabis in Ontario will be 19, the same minimum age to consume alcohol and tobacco in the province.


Only marijuana grown by producers licensed by Health Canada, the federal government ministry, will be available for sale."






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  # 1861167 9-Sep-2017 09:57
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I wonder if that makes the Government liable for any adverse effects from the consumption?





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  # 1861206 9-Sep-2017 10:21
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I just wonder how much longer NZ can carry on swimming against what is becoming quite a movement towards legal personal use of weed. Now we have many US states legalising it, Canada legalising it, Europe decriminalising in a number of countries etc etc.

 

Given our limited resources for drug enforcement and the apparently widespread use of the stuff anyway in NZ, it makes far more sense for NZ to legalise it and tax it like alcohol.






 
 
 
 


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  # 1861234 9-Sep-2017 11:51
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Dulouz:

 

I wonder if that makes the Government liable for any adverse effects from the consumption?

 

 

 

 

Does the government accept liability for the adverse effects of alcohol consumption?





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  # 1861236 9-Sep-2017 12:13
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lokhor:

 

Dulouz:

 

I wonder if that makes the Government liable for any adverse effects from the consumption?

 

 

 

 

Does the government accept liability for the adverse effects of alcohol consumption?

 

 

Such a system for legalised sales should have strict quality control.

 

That's likely to result in a reduction in adverse effects compared to what we've got now - not that that comes even close to the cost/damage from alcohol.

 

The most vulnerable group to any drug (ab)use - adolescents - don't seem to have increased marijuana consumption in places where it's been legalised.

 

For the rest of us, it's relatively harmless -at least in moderation.


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  # 1861240 9-Sep-2017 12:18
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Geektastic:

 

I just wonder how much longer NZ can carry on swimming against what is becoming quite a movement towards legal personal use of weed. Now we have many US states legalising it, Canada legalising it, Europe decriminalising in a number of countries etc etc.

 

Given our limited resources for drug enforcement and the apparently widespread use of the stuff anyway in NZ, it makes far more sense for NZ to legalise it and tax it like alcohol.

 

 

We're supposedly assured by Bill English that there's no need to legalise/decriminalise, as police exercise "discretion" as to whether to prosecute users.

 

This doesn't reassure me at all - when the result of a possible conviction has life-changing consequences, relying on "neutrality" from police officers as to whether to prosecute or not seems to be very dangerous.  Fairly certain that they'd (individual officers) use it to penalise people they don't like, but not prosecute people they think are "OK". 


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  # 1861272 9-Sep-2017 13:17
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lokhor:

 

Dulouz:

 

I wonder if that makes the Government liable for any adverse effects from the consumption?

 

 

 

 

Does the government accept liability for the adverse effects of alcohol consumption?

 

 

No - but they don't own a brewery either. BTW - I'm all the law change and would love to see what Canada has introduced adopted in NZ. It just seems a little odd having the government selling weed.





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  # 1861314 9-Sep-2017 14:45
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Dulouz:

 

lokhor:

 

Dulouz:

 

I wonder if that makes the Government liable for any adverse effects from the consumption?

 

 

 

 

Does the government accept liability for the adverse effects of alcohol consumption?

 

 

No - but they don't own a brewery either. BTW - I'm all the law change and would love to see what Canada has introduced adopted in NZ. It just seems a little odd having the government selling weed.

 

 

 

 

My understanding was that in Canada the government owns the bottle shops


 
 
 
 


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  # 1861345 9-Sep-2017 15:48
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blackjack17:

 

 

 

My understanding was that in Canada the government owns the bottle shops

 

 

No, at a provincial level the sale of alcohol was controlled by such as the Alberta Liquor Control Board. Visiting an ALCB liquor store was much how I imagined shopping would have been in the USSR.
Grey, uninviting concrete floored places with partly stocked shelves, and staff who would glance up at you and grunt before going back to whatever they were doing before you rudely interrupted them with your presence.

The sale of Alcohol was privatised in the 90's in AB, now brightly coloured Liquor Supermarkets are all over the place.

In Saskatchewan control of alcohol sales still resides with the Liquor and Gaming Authority.
My wife and I recently flew into the city of Saskatoon, and decided to grab a bottle of wine after a meal downtown.

We wandered around finding a tightly closed SLGA store, then asked some passing locals - who looked at us like we were crazy - "you want to buy alcohol?" they exclaimed "but it's after 6pm!"

 

Cannabis isn't going to be legal for recreational use until July next year, however it's almost as freely available now as "Medical Marijuana" - you just need a 'green card' from your friendly doctor.
The companies that are producing Pot for medical sale are all jostling for position for the sales explosion that's predicted.

Some are listed on the TSX already, like Aurora who's production facility just outside Calgary I got a look at this year.

 

It's going to be a 'goldrush' until the industry sorts itself out, and I'm sure fortunes will be made and lost.


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  # 1861363 9-Sep-2017 16:53
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This will be disastrous for those various Border Patrol reality shows.

 

 




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  # 1861431 9-Sep-2017 18:02
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Fred99:

 

Geektastic:

 

I just wonder how much longer NZ can carry on swimming against what is becoming quite a movement towards legal personal use of weed. Now we have many US states legalising it, Canada legalising it, Europe decriminalising in a number of countries etc etc.

 

Given our limited resources for drug enforcement and the apparently widespread use of the stuff anyway in NZ, it makes far more sense for NZ to legalise it and tax it like alcohol.

 

 

We're supposedly assured by Bill English that there's no need to legalise/decriminalise, as police exercise "discretion" as to whether to prosecute users.

 

This doesn't reassure me at all - when the result of a possible conviction has life-changing consequences, relying on "neutrality" from police officers as to whether to prosecute or not seems to be very dangerous.  Fairly certain that they'd (individual officers) use it to penalise people they don't like, but not prosecute people they think are "OK". 

 

 

 

 

I trust the Police about as far as I could throw them wearing handcuffs...! Having seen them make up laws on the hoof with regard to firearms, I would not trust their discretion in a matter like that at all.






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  # 1861468 9-Sep-2017 18:38
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Fred99:

We're supposedly assured by Bill English that there's no need to legalise/decriminalise, as police exercise "discretion" as to whether to prosecute users.



I'm not sure how that works in practice. Never seen it happen on those police shows. Even if this discretion thing was true or did not have a disproportionate effect depending on where you live or ethnicity it would not address the supply side.

Apart from recreational use it seems common in NZ for cancer patients to use marijuana and at present there is no legal means by which they may obtain it.

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  # 1861924 10-Sep-2017 18:20
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gzt:
Fred99:

 

We're supposedly assured by Bill English that there's no need to legalise/decriminalise, as police exercise "discretion" as to whether to prosecute users.

 



I'm not sure how that works in practice. Never seen it happen on those police shows. Even if this discretion thing was true or did not have a disproportionate effect depending on where you live or ethnicity it would not address the supply side.

Apart from recreational use it seems common in NZ for cancer patients to use marijuana and at present there is no legal means by which they may obtain it.

 

In my opinion it's a terrible idea to allow the police to "exercise discretion" when they have good evidence of someone committing an offense - such as caught red-handed with a baggie of dope.

 

It's a cop-out by law makers (parliament), police don't have any expertise from which to form an opinion and cast judgement as to who should face penalties, and who shouldn't.  That should never be their job - especially in this case where a conviction could cost the offender their job, future employment, travel etc.

 

It's a very stupid law which allows or even encourages prejudice by police.  It's also not fair to the police concerned, as it opens them up to accusations of prejudice.

 

As for cancer patients (or anybody else with some severe condition) I don't give a flying monkey's if they want to use it "recreationally" rather than "medicinally".  If they think it helps - let them.  FFS - there are people profiting massively from selling quack remedies, some people forgo medical treatment based on false promises making scamsters rich.  So much utter BS "tolerated".  In any case, "orthodox" medicine based on alleviation of symptoms, pain, discomfort, feeling nauseous etc are going to rely primarily on how the patients feel.  Bit hard to run a double blind trial when the drug under test has profound effects.  "I feel much much better - and really stoned" is pretty valid reason to allow them to use something - when the alternatives (like opiates etc) also whack people and have comparably very serious side-effects.

 

 


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  # 1861934 10-Sep-2017 18:44
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Police aren't trained to determine guilt. Judges are. That is why we have courts and that is why they are separate from police. 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  # 1861985 10-Sep-2017 21:21
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Rikkitic:

 

Police aren't trained to determine guilt. Judges are. That is why we have courts and that is why they are separate from police. 

 

 

 

 

Reminds me of the story of Alex Wubbels





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


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  # 1861986 10-Sep-2017 21:22
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Geektastic:

 

I just wonder how much longer NZ can carry on swimming against what is becoming quite a movement towards legal personal use of weed. Now we have many US states legalising it, Canada legalising it, Europe decriminalising in a number of countries etc etc.

 

Given our limited resources for drug enforcement and the apparently widespread use of the stuff anyway in NZ, it makes far more sense for NZ to legalise it and tax it like alcohol.

 

 

Does Canada allow driving and smoking weed?





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


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