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debo
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  #2008238 4-May-2018 21:53
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Fred99:

 

debo:

 

Rikkitic -  what is your opinion on a vegetarian sausage?  Good for you because there is no meat.  Bad for you because it is more processed than a chicken nugget.

 

 

I really suggest that you check what goes into a chicken nugget, IIRC the one's Maccas sells are marginally okay, if you exclude the batter, deep frying etc. According to Wikipedia they are:

 

White boneless chicken, water, salt, seasoning (yeast extract, salt, wheat starch, natural flavoring, safflower oil, lemon juice solids, dextrose, citric acid), sodium phosphates. Battered and breaded with water, enriched flour (bleached wheat flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid), yellow corn flour, bleached wheat flour, salt, leavening (baking soda, sodium acid pyrophosphate, sodium aluminum phosphate, monocalcium phosphate, calcium lactate), spices, wheat starch, dextrose, corn starch. Prepared in vegetable oil (canola oil, corn oil, soybean oil, hydrogenated soybean oil) with citric acid as a preservative.

 

This is food for kids of course, fed to kids by people who might read a food label and decide that they'll be bad for their cat.

 

The frozen ones sold in big bags cheap at the supermarket are probably worse, they don't even have anything which could be honestly described as "white boneless chicken", but instead scraps of flesh salvaged from slime, reconstituted and shaped to look appealing to innocent children.

 

I've got a pack of vegetarian sausages in the fridge here - and nope - processed of course, but incomparable to the above.

 

 

All depends on how massed produced they are. I assume you are comparing gourmet vegetarian sausages vs massed produced nuggets. 

 

Nuggets basically are chicken, water, salt, seasoning.  Vegetarian versions have to replace the chicken with textured vegetable proteins.  These are substances don't exist in nature and have to be manufactured in factories. Potato starch, soy protein isolate, wheat gluten, cellulose gum etc are also added. Hence, vegetarian versions of meat products are ALWAYS MORE PROCESSED.  

 

Remember when "pink slime" was just called sausage meat and came in a 500g plastic tube.

 

 

 

 


jarledb
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  #2008259 5-May-2018 00:14
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debo:

 

All depends on how massed produced they are. I assume you are comparing gourmet vegetarian sausages vs massed produced nuggets. 

 

Nuggets basically are chicken, water, salt, seasoning.  Vegetarian versions have to replace the chicken with textured vegetable proteins.  These are substances don't exist in nature and have to be manufactured in factories. Potato starch, soy protein isolate, wheat gluten, cellulose gum etc are also added. Hence, vegetarian versions of meat products are ALWAYS MORE PROCESSED.  

 

Remember when "pink slime" was just called sausage meat and came in a 500g plastic tube.

 

 

Ehmmm.. Chicken nuggets ingredients:

 

Chicken (37%), Water Added, Breadcrumb (Wheat Flour, Salt, Yeast, Improver (Wheat Flour, Canola Oil , Flour Conditioners (300, 516), Enzymes, Colour (160b))), Vegetable Oil, Flour (Wheat, Maize), Salt, Sugar, Gluten, Raising Agent (500), Acidity Regulator (339, 450, 451), Thickener (415), Textured Vegetable Protein, Potato Starch, Dehydrated Vegetables, Soy Protein, Hydrolysed Vegetable Protein, Flavour, Flavour Enhancer (635), Spices, Spice Extracts.

 

Source

 

Yeah, I am sure it varies. But this is from chicken nuggets you find at Countdown.


 
 
 
 


debo
235 posts

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  #2008345 5-May-2018 10:49
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jarledb:

 

debo:

 

All depends on how massed produced they are. I assume you are comparing gourmet vegetarian sausages vs massed produced nuggets. 

 

Nuggets basically are chicken, water, salt, seasoning.  Vegetarian versions have to replace the chicken with textured vegetable proteins.  These are substances don't exist in nature and have to be manufactured in factories. Potato starch, soy protein isolate, wheat gluten, cellulose gum etc are also added. Hence, vegetarian versions of meat products are ALWAYS MORE PROCESSED.  

 

Remember when "pink slime" was just called sausage meat and came in a 500g plastic tube.

 

 

Ehmmm.. Chicken nuggets ingredients:

 

Chicken (37%), Water Added, Breadcrumb (Wheat Flour, Salt, Yeast, Improver (Wheat Flour, Canola Oil , Flour Conditioners (300, 516), Enzymes, Colour (160b))), Vegetable Oil, Flour (Wheat, Maize), Salt, Sugar, Gluten, Raising Agent (500), Acidity Regulator (339, 450, 451), Thickener (415), Textured Vegetable Protein, Potato Starch, Dehydrated Vegetables, Soy Protein, Hydrolysed Vegetable Protein, Flavour, Flavour Enhancer (635), Spices, Spice Extracts.

 

Source

 

Yeah, I am sure it varies. But this is from chicken nuggets you find at Countdown.

 

 

 

 

Your example is a cross between the two: half vegetarian, half meat (well, only 37% meat).  The manufactures are using meat substitutes to reduce their costs. See how it contains TVP, Potato Starch, Soy Protein, Gluten etc.

 

I brought up the subject of meat substitutes because it seems like they are on the verge of becoming main stream.  There are articles on synthetic meat & milk proteins in the media regularly with warning about the effects on the NZ economy.  However, little is being said about the increased processing of these foods. If they do become main stream and replace meat, then we are about to start the largest experiment on human digestion the world has ever seen. It will make the whole Hydrolyzed Vegetable Oil fiasco seem like nothing.  Maybe, in 20 years, we will be able to get a Big Mac Original as a healthy option instead of the regular Big Mac TVP.


tdgeek
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  #2008348 5-May-2018 11:07
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I dont see how it will be a huge food revolution. There are many meat substitutes that are in wide use today. Fruit and vegetables. Aka vegetarians or just general cutting back on meat. Chicken is lean, fish is lean. Not too hard


irongarment
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  #2008377 5-May-2018 12:27
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¡Yo quiero Taco Bell!

I like McDonald's too.

Fred99
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  #2008502 5-May-2018 18:04
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debo:

 

jarledb:

 

debo:

 

All depends on how massed produced they are. I assume you are comparing gourmet vegetarian sausages vs massed produced nuggets. 

 

Nuggets basically are chicken, water, salt, seasoning.  Vegetarian versions have to replace the chicken with textured vegetable proteins.  These are substances don't exist in nature and have to be manufactured in factories. Potato starch, soy protein isolate, wheat gluten, cellulose gum etc are also added. Hence, vegetarian versions of meat products are ALWAYS MORE PROCESSED.  

 

Remember when "pink slime" was just called sausage meat and came in a 500g plastic tube.

 

 

Ehmmm.. Chicken nuggets ingredients:

 

Chicken (37%), Water Added, Breadcrumb (Wheat Flour, Salt, Yeast, Improver (Wheat Flour, Canola Oil , Flour Conditioners (300, 516), Enzymes, Colour (160b))), Vegetable Oil, Flour (Wheat, Maize), Salt, Sugar, Gluten, Raising Agent (500), Acidity Regulator (339, 450, 451), Thickener (415), Textured Vegetable Protein, Potato Starch, Dehydrated Vegetables, Soy Protein, Hydrolysed Vegetable Protein, Flavour, Flavour Enhancer (635), Spices, Spice Extracts.

 

Source

 

Yeah, I am sure it varies. But this is from chicken nuggets you find at Countdown.

 

 

 

 

Your example is a cross between the two: half vegetarian, half meat (well, only 37% meat).  The manufactures are using meat substitutes to reduce their costs. See how it contains TVP, Potato Starch, Soy Protein, Gluten etc.

 

I brought up the subject of meat substitutes because it seems like they are on the verge of becoming main stream.  There are articles on synthetic meat & milk proteins in the media regularly with warning about the effects on the NZ economy.  However, little is being said about the increased processing of these foods. If they do become main stream and replace meat, then we are about to start the largest experiment on human digestion the world has ever seen. It will make the whole Hydrolyzed Vegetable Oil fiasco seem like nothing.  Maybe, in 20 years, we will be able to get a Big Mac Original as a healthy option instead of the regular Big Mac TVP.

 

 

The vegetarian sausages I have in the fridge here, the only "chemical-ish" additive is a bit of calcium sulphate.  They aren't "vegan" though - as they contain dairy extracts.  No TVP, they're based on soy.

 

I'm not vegetarian, but avoid commercial/mass produced sausages because I've seen what goes in to them. 

 

The vegetarian sausages actually taste good, they're more expensive than "sizzlers" and other such thing that I'd recommend avoid for all kinds of reasons even forgetting whether they're healthy or (probably) not, but about the same price as you'd pay for a quality real meat sausage.  Bonus is they're vacuum packed with long shelf life - you can keep then in the fridge for a couple of months no problem.  The vegetarian burger patties I'd also rate as "good" - with same bonus - they'll keep for ages refrigerated. 


jarledb
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  #2008519 5-May-2018 18:40
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debo:

 

Your example is a cross between the two: half vegetarian, half meat (well, only 37% meat).  The manufactures are using meat substitutes to reduce their costs. See how it contains TVP, Potato Starch, Soy Protein, Gluten etc.

 

I brought up the subject of meat substitutes because it seems like they are on the verge of becoming main stream.  There are articles on synthetic meat & milk proteins in the media regularly with warning about the effects on the NZ economy.  However, little is being said about the increased processing of these foods. If they do become main stream and replace meat, then we are about to start the largest experiment on human digestion the world has ever seen. It will make the whole Hydrolyzed Vegetable Oil fiasco seem like nothing.  Maybe, in 20 years, we will be able to get a Big Mac Original as a healthy option instead of the regular Big Mac TVP.

 

 

I am not that fuzzed about additives as such, or processing. You do realise that we don't harvest things like sugar, salt, etc. And that the vinegar you probably have on your fish is also chemically produced? They all have to be processed before they reach the shelfs. Same is true for a lot of other every day products that you probably consume.

 

BTW: Sticking to the chicken nuggets. This seems to be the nuggets with the most chicken @ Countdown. Can you find something with more chicken?

 

Ingredients still show a lot of additives:

 

Chicken Breast (60%), Water, Flour (Wheat, Maize), Starch (Maize), Salt, Raising Agents (500, 541), Milk Solids, Vegetable Oils (Canola, Maize), Spices & Spice Extracts (White Pepper, Turmeric, Black Pepper, Celery), Thickener (1442), Emulsifier (433), Antioxidants (321, 320, 310), Anticaking Agent (551), Acidity Regulator (327), Mineral Salts (450, 451, 339)


 
 
 
 


networkn
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  #2008522 5-May-2018 18:50
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Fred99:

 

The vegetarian sausages actually taste good, they're more expensive than "sizzlers" and other such thing that I'd recommend avoid for all kinds of reasons even forgetting whether they're healthy or (probably) not, but about the same price as you'd pay for a quality real meat sausage.  Bonus is they're vacuum packed with long shelf life - you can keep then in the fridge for a couple of months no problem.  The vegetarian burger patties I'd also rate as "good" - with same bonus - they'll keep for ages refrigerated. 

 

 

Heh, I'll take "real" meat and eat it more quickly :) 

 

 


Fred99
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  #2008618 6-May-2018 10:11
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networkn:

 

Fred99:

 

The vegetarian sausages actually taste good, they're more expensive than "sizzlers" and other such thing that I'd recommend avoid for all kinds of reasons even forgetting whether they're healthy or (probably) not, but about the same price as you'd pay for a quality real meat sausage.  Bonus is they're vacuum packed with long shelf life - you can keep then in the fridge for a couple of months no problem.  The vegetarian burger patties I'd also rate as "good" - with same bonus - they'll keep for ages refrigerated. 

 

 

Heh, I'll take "real" meat and eat it more quickly :) 

 

 

 

 

Fair enough - but be aware that stuff described as (real) "meat" on the label - and many people's expectations of what "meat" should be, could be wildly different when it comes to sausages.


tdgeek
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Fred99
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  #2008655 6-May-2018 12:12
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tdgeek:

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/oddstuff/103666563/us-man-eats-30000th-big-mac

 

Works for him!

 

 

Wow - that's actually an average of about 2 a day since '72.

 

He says his cholesterol and blood pressure are normal.

 

I wonder what "normal" means, and if perhaps he's using the Trump method - but he looks okay for 64.

 

No mention of whether he includes fries and drinks with his big macs, but he is holding a super-sized drink container in the video.


gzt

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  #2008733 6-May-2018 13:59
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Gorske has said his only liquid intake is coca-cola and, he almost never eats the fries. He stores extra big macs in hiis freezer in case of emergency.

debo
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  #2008735 6-May-2018 14:08
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jarledb:

 

I am not that fuzzed about additives as such, or processing. You do realise that we don't harvest things like sugar, salt, etc. And that the vinegar you probably have on your fish is also chemically produced? They all have to be processed before they reach the shelfs. Same is true for a lot of other every day products that you probably consume.

 

 

I'm not too concerned either.  Salt and table sugar are simply purified extracts.  They are chemically identical to their natural states.  However, some ingredients are being chemically altered, and i'm not too keen on that.  Hydrogenated Vegetable Oil is produced through a chemical process that adds hydrogen atoms to the available double bonds in the vegetable oil. High Fructose Corn Syrup is produced by glucose isomerase to convert some of its glucose into fructose.  And yes, I understand vinegar is chemically produced but I can do that at home. If an ingredient can only be made in large chemical factory, then I tend to avoid it.


jarledb
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  #2008749 6-May-2018 15:02
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debo:

 

[...] And yes, I understand vinegar is chemically produced but I can do that at home.

 

 

So produce at home = safe?

 

Metamfetamin is safe by that logic...


Rikkitic

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  #2008752 6-May-2018 15:23
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And if that is a bridge too far, there are always purely natural substances like coca leaf or opium poppy. 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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