2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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Mad Scientist
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#2709867 19-May-2021 21:42

sbiddle:

I don't quite understand the whole vaccine situation, and what's been explained today isn't clear either.

Seemingly we've entered into agreements and are going to be required to pay for vaccines from the other companies even though we've committed to 100% Pfizer at this point. What is actually going to happen to those millions of doses? It's pretty clear they're now not going to be used in NZ so why aren't they simply being resold. Presumably we've paid for 10.7 million doses of Novavax and yet the vaccine isn't even available on the market or approved.

I can understand hedging our bets and entering into multiple agreements, but surely when something isn't even ready then it can be sold elsewhere?

or just donate them

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Handle9

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#2709943 20-May-2021 03:11

Things are getting interesting here.

Events are opening back up but you need evidence of vaccination. It's the same for bars and sports games. The antivaxxers are having a whinge on social media but one benefit of living in a monarchy is they don't have to care.

tdgeek

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#2709952 20-May-2021 06:43

Batman: Way cheaper than the free money you give out during lockdowns

Not counting the money lost from economic stand still

Depends if your happy with mass unemployment and mass business shutdowns, and a lengthy economic recovery.

Batman

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#2709955 20-May-2021 07:03

Handle9: Things are getting interesting here.

Events are opening back up but you need evidence of vaccination. It's the same for bars and sports games. The antivaxxers are having a whinge on social media but one benefit of living in a monarchy is they don't have to care.

People here don't know what that is.

UK and Europe are also trying to do the same as you guys

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#2709958 20-May-2021 07:33

I'm amazed at the backlash at Jayne Hrdlicka and Virgin Australia after her comments, but much of the debate being fueled by a media misreporting exactly what she said. In light of our PM pretty much shutting down Bloomfield's comments last week it truly does seem that neither NZ or Australia are ready to even begin the discussion about endemic Covid.

Great post here from Australia yesterday. https://www.theage.com.au/national/storm-over-hrdlicka-s-hard-truth-exposes-our-politicians-timidity-20210519-p57t7h.html

Data showing 30% of Australians not wanting to be vaccinated is also pretty interesting, especially because plenty of people share the same view as here in NZ - that we've beaten Covid so there is no need to be vaccinated. Politicans effectively suppressing discussion about the future, what a new normal could look like, and how we plan to deal with endemic Covid is only gong to make things worse IMHO.

gzt

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#2709959 20-May-2021 07:38

Great article:

Handle9: https://www.wired.com/story/the-teeny-tiny-scientific-screwup-that-helped-covid-kill/

Tldr; Textbooks mentioning aerosol transmission of viruses quoted a five micron figure with no context.

Researchers quoted in the article eventually established this five micron figure was obtained from studies of tuberculosis infection resulting from aerosol. Textbooks applied the five micron figure to all aerosol transmission of viruses. Sars-cov2, colds, flu have very different infection characteristics compared to tuberculosis.

Work by physicists had previously shown aerosol movement of viruses in aerosol smaller than five micron. This work was not widely accepted in the medical community due to the persistence of the five micron figure.

This relatively new work has since led to redesign of air conditioning systems during the covid period. Based on this there is an enormous benefit to be gained from this and related mitigation. The same mitigations also reduce the incidence of cold and flu transmission which would be a huge benefit.

I expect there has also been much parallel original research and investigation during this period. Including in NZ.

sbiddle

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#2709962 20-May-2021 07:48

gzt: Great article:

Work by physicists had previously shown aerosol movement of viruses in aerosol smaller than five micron. This work was not widely accepted in the medical community due to the persistence of the five micron figure.

This relatively new work has since led to redesign of air conditioning systems during the covid period. Based on this there is an enormous benefit to be gained from this and related mitigation. The same mitigations also reduce the incidence of cold and flu transmission which would be a huge benefit.

I still remember the first news article to appear in this part of the world actually telling us the virus was airborne was a news.com.au article that was also published in the NZ Herald. Considering news.com.au really is just all about the clickbait it's probably the first time they've really nailed something!

The fact so many people didn't want to take this seriously was something I found so interesting 12 months ago - and why here in NZ we were so late to the party when it came to mandatory face coverings.

Batman

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#2710173 20-May-2021 13:25

So we have covid traces in wastewater essentially all over the country

One question

Is this new ie none detected in many tests prior and now it's here. (vs never tested before and first test shows this result). The two scenarios have different meanings.

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300312523/covid19-traces-found-in-wastewater-of-christchurch-rotorua-and-queenstown

Oblivian

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#2710199 20-May-2021 13:53

Yeah it does lead to some questions. They're all MIQ facility locations. Would expect when they were populated en-masse by the plane load they could pop u

That is, if it was clear if it has been ongoing and spiked suddenly vs they only just started.

ezbee

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#2711254 22-May-2021 12:01

‘Like hell:’ As Olympics loom, Japan health care in turmoil
https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4208030

""
Hospitals in Osaka, Japan’s third-biggest city and only 2 1/2 hours by bullet train from Summer Olympics host Tokyo, are overflowing with coronavirus patients. About 35,000 people nationwide — twice the number of those in hospitals — must stay at home with the disease, often becoming seriously ill and sometimes dying before they can get medical care.
""

Does not look good, and vaccination program is slow given limited global vaccine supply.

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#2711274 22-May-2021 13:13

Batman: So we have covid traces in wastewater essentially all over the country

One question

Is this new ie none detected in many tests prior and now it's here. (vs never tested before and first test shows this result). The two scenarios have different meanings.

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300312523/covid19-traces-found-in-wastewater-of-christchurch-rotorua-and-queenstown

they retested Rotorua and it came back negative , the same for Wellington if i recall.

Common sense is not as common as you think.

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#2711288 22-May-2021 13:33

ezbee:

‘Like hell:’ As Olympics loom, Japan health care in turmoil
https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4208030

""
Hospitals in Osaka, Japan’s third-biggest city and only 2 1/2 hours by bullet train from Summer Olympics host Tokyo, are overflowing with coronavirus patients. About 35,000 people nationwide — twice the number of those in hospitals — must stay at home with the disease, often becoming seriously ill and sometimes dying before they can get medical care.
""

Does not look good, and vaccination program is slow given limited global vaccine supply.

What's happening in so many countries now (incl Vietnam, Singapore, Taiwan and Thailand) is far far worse than their Covid outbreaks last year. To me it shows the perilous state that countries like Australia and New Zealand are in with low vaccination rates and the very serious risks posed of CT.

You'd have to seriously question whether an identical L4 lockdown to last year would actually work if we had a breakout in NZ with these more infectious variants. There would probably need to be a lot of additional restrictions and requirements on top.

tdgeek

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#2711325 22-May-2021 14:13

ezbee:

‘Like hell:’ As Olympics loom, Japan health care in turmoil
https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4208030

""
Hospitals in Osaka, Japan’s third-biggest city and only 2 1/2 hours by bullet train from Summer Olympics host Tokyo, are overflowing with coronavirus patients. About 35,000 people nationwide — twice the number of those in hospitals — must stay at home with the disease, often becoming seriously ill and sometimes dying before they can get medical care.
""

Does not look good, and vaccination program is slow given limited global vaccine supply.

And we have

IOC VP: Tokyo Olympics will go ahead, even if there's a state of emergency

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/olympics/300313998/ioc-vp-tokyo-olympics-will-go-ahead-even-if-theres-a-state-of-emergency

Its clearly about pride, not sport or people

Rikkitic

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#2711327 22-May-2021 14:19

tdgeek:

IOC VP: Tokyo Olympics will go ahead, even if there's a state of emergency

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/olympics/300313998/ioc-vp-tokyo-olympics-will-go-ahead-even-if-theres-a-state-of-emergency

Its clearly about pride, not sport or people

It's about money, nothing else. They want the broadcasting rights income. What is a mass pandemic compared to that?

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Batman

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#2711336 22-May-2021 14:50

on the other hand, high quality testing of vaccine real world effectiveness

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