2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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366 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2835348 19-Dec-2021 00:21

alasta:

Sup:

There are a lot of assumptions being made about omicron.

The biggest being that it would confer immunity to Delta and all other Covid strains...and more importantly that this omicron immunity would last long enough to guarantee the extinction of Delta too.

This is what I have been thinking. Two of the existing endemic coronaviruses, 229E and NL63, appear to be genetically related and yet they have continued to circulate in parallel for centuries. The same thing may occur with Delta and Omicron.

Good spotting.

We need a pan Corona Virus vaccine and or a program where vaccines get the population through the novel risk phase and the virus provides seasonal top ups of immunity.

Or...if you look at the New Zealand Delta approach, we need Govts to get serious about vaccine mandates, to boost production and delivery to the third world, in other words slow down mutation rates, treat the pandemic properly.

The global response has been terrible, but there is no law which says it has to stay that way forever and ever.

Just keep swimming...

Batman

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#2835373 19-Dec-2021 09:35

DS248:
Pfizer's child-sized vaccine fails to produce expected immunity in kids under 5.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/12/17/health/pfizer-vaccine-children/index.html

Iirc they were testing 1/10 adult dose. Maybe it's a dose issue. But it's just a wild guess.

Scott3

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#2835375 19-Dec-2021 09:47

DS248:

Pfizer's child-sized vaccine fails to produce expected immunity in kids under 5.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/12/17/health/pfizer-vaccine-children/index.html

That summary is not quite accurate:

"It showed that two child-sized doses of the Pfizer/BioNtech vaccine were not producing the expected immunity in the 2- to 5-year-olds, although they were doing so for the babies up to age 2."

Pretty gutting as the parent of a child in the 2-5 age band.

Both age band's were trialed with 3mg doses. To a causal observer, it seems in it's quest to keep side effects low, pfizer picked a too small dose to trial for the 2-5 age band. (using 1/10 of the adult dose, when children in this age band are often 1/4 - 1/6 of an adult body weight). Keeping side effects low is important, because this age group gets off lightly from the virus, so low side effects are needed for the risk / reward ratio to stack up. Some regulators like the UK, only consider individual risk / reward, not community impacts, making this especially important.

Hopefully adding a third dose will stimulated the expected immune response. But sadly this will have set the results of the trial back 2 - 3 months...

Scott3

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#2835379 19-Dec-2021 10:25

Booster's now available 5 months after second dose (was 6 months) at major vaccination sites in Auckland [unverified].

Source of this info is a Nurse at the Mt Wellington Center via an reddit comment. Walk ins 0845-1615 Monday- Sunday. Big centers only, no pharmacies.

Unverified, but sounds very plausible. Apparently they dropped to 5m,2w on Wednesday.

No government announcement yet.

bazzer

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#2835518 19-Dec-2021 13:19

Scott3:

Both age band's were trialed with 3mg doses. To a causal observer, it seems in it's quest to keep side effects low, pfizer picked a too small dose to trial for the 2-5 age band. (using 1/10 of the adult dose, when children in this age band are often 1/4 - 1/6 of an adult body weight). Keeping side effects low is important, because this age group gets off lightly from the virus, so low side effects are needed for the risk / reward ratio to stack up. Some regulators like the UK, only consider individual risk / reward, not community impacts, making this especially important.

Hopefully adding a third dose will stimulated the expected immune response. But sadly this will have set the results of the trial back 2 - 3 months...

The dosage isn't about body size/weight so much as immune response. Children have a much more robust immune system than adults.

MaxineN

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#2835524 19-Dec-2021 13:49

Canterbury sitting at 98% first dose is making me very happy. 94% second dose as well. We're literally so close to 100%.

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quickymart

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#2835530 19-Dec-2021 14:13

55 new cases today, 5 more Omnicron cases at the border.

If MIQ goes I can Omnicron taking over as the main strain very quickly.

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alexx

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Ultimate Geek

#2835545 19-Dec-2021 15:07

Scott3:

Booster's now available 5 months after second dose (was 6 months) at major vaccination sites in Auckland [unverified].

Source of this info is a Nurse at the Mt Wellington Center via an reddit comment. Walk ins 0845-1615 Monday- Sunday. Big centers only, no pharmacies.

Unverified, but sounds very plausible. Apparently they dropped to 5m,2w on Wednesday.

No government announcement yet.

Have you tried booking through Book My Vaccine?

I just tried mine to see what happens and it still shows the first day available as 6 months from second dose. But I noticed it only appears to be offering pharmacies. I'm in Auckland, not far from the city centre so perhaps there aren't any of these big centres here. I'm not due for a long time even if it was changed to 5 months, so it was just curiosity for me.

#include <standard.disclaimer>

Scott3

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#2835586 19-Dec-2021 20:04

alexx:

Scott3:

Booster's now available 5 months after second dose (was 6 months) at major vaccination sites in Auckland [unverified].

Source of this info is a Nurse at the Mt Wellington Center via an reddit comment. Walk ins 0845-1615 Monday- Sunday. Big centers only, no pharmacies.

Unverified, but sounds very plausible. Apparently they dropped to 5m,2w on Wednesday.

No government announcement yet.

Have you tried booking through Book My Vaccine?

I just tried mine to see what happens and it still shows the first day available as 6 months from second dose. But I noticed it only appears to be offering pharmacies. I'm in Auckland, not far from the city centre so perhaps there aren't any of these big centres here. I'm not due for a long time even if it was changed to 5 months, so it was just curiosity for me.

I understand that people in the 5 - 6 month range are not able to book, but able to get vaccinated as walk in's at the large vacciantion centers in Auckland.

Click the appropriate pin at the below to see options in Auckland:

https://immunisation.northernregion.health.nz/getting-vaccinated/where-to-get-vaccinated/

Note that a whole bunch are permanently closing up in the next couple of days (and some have already closed). And much of the rest have a holiday shutdown. (as an example, the Mt Wellington center which the tip came from, is closed from noon 23rd December to the 9th of January 2022). Seems the focus is generally moving away from the mass centers, and towards Pharmacies, GP's, Maori & Pacific lead centers. I assume the mobile units will continue too. Probably a good move to get vaccinations close to where people allready are - but the remaining vaccination locations are going to get seriously slammed if we have omicron turn up in the community during the shutdown period.

At 5 months I am eligible for my booster now - was keen to go today, but my spouse has three extremely busy work days ahead, and dosn't want to deal with any side effects untill after that, and wanted me to get mine at the same time are hers, so we are deferring a few days.

Sup

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Ultimate Geek

#2835690 20-Dec-2021 02:21

It really would be very helpful if we kept omicron out of the streets while the vaccinators take a much deserved hard earned break over Christmas.

Hopefully they come back full of Vim and vigor.

The model may be shifting to GPs and Pharmacies, which is great, however the booster program in perpetuity for the short term will surely require the bulk of the current roll out infrastructure stays in place?

Just keep swimming...

Sup

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Ultimate Geek

#2835693 20-Dec-2021 03:40

Looks like the workers off sick issue we have talked a lot about in our speculation of omicron is being manifest in the UK with London declaring a serious incident due to staff illness in the essential services, primarily first responders being unable to meet the call volumes in a timely fashion.

Hospital rates have climbed thirty percent according to Germanys DW news.

Germany have placed the UK on the list of high risk countries.

I still do not think this is cause for panic for us, provided you take practical and sensible decisions to have some preparation at home, for a flu like illness and some short term disruption to services.

All this of course assumes we cannot keep it out till the third round of shots is completed.

Just keep swimming...

DS248

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#2835755 20-Dec-2021 08:04

Sup:

Looks like the workers off sick issue we have talked a lot about in our speculation of omicron is being manifest in the UK with London declaring a serious incident due to staff illness in the essential services, primarily first responders being unable to meet the call volumes in a timely fashion.

Hospital rates have climbed thirty percent according to Germanys DW news.

Germany have placed the UK on the list of high risk countries.

I still do not think this is cause for panic for us, provided you take practical and sensible decisions to have some preparation at home, for a flu like illness and some short term disruption to services.

All this of course assumes we cannot keep it out till the third round of shots is completed.

Yes, a recent Imperial College study suggests Omicron is no milder than Delta, though others are still say it is too early to draw conclusions on that.

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/omicron-five-times-more-likely-reinfect-than-delta-study-says-2021-12-17/

"We find no evidence (for both risk of hospitalisation attendance and symptom status) of Omicron having different severity from Delta," the study said, although it added that data on hospitalisations remains very limited.

SJB

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#2835775 20-Dec-2021 08:49

Sup:

Germany have placed the UK on the list of high risk countries.

What is the point. Politicians thinking they need to be seen doing something.

Geektastic

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#2835875 20-Dec-2021 10:31

We spoke with our unvaccinated Christmas guest. His wife, vaccinated, is joining us on Boxing Day. He isn't.

We asked about how he was going to visit his 90 year old mother etc over Christmas. Easy. She's not vaccinated and neither is anyone else in the family...! Eejits.

Since he likes travelling, I asked how he intended to do that when it is eventually possible. Oh, he said. I'll get the vaccine then if I have to.

So you're actually prepared to have it per se, so why not just have it now and enjoy a relatively normal life, I asked. No useful answer was forthcoming.

Oblivian

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#2835881 20-Dec-2021 10:50

It's the 'I refuse to be told to' mentality. Have found a few. They refuse, as it is a 'rule' and quashes social responsibility aspect

But the moment it is needed for their own cause (the common one is infact travel if not effected by workplace) but not seen as enforced. They're OK with it. But not until that time. It's an inconvenience that shalt not cave in to because I refute against 'the man'... until I actually want to.

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