2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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488 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2889370 21-Mar-2022 07:18

quickymart:

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2022/03/covid-19-calls-for-vaccine-exemption-for-chronic-fatigue-patients-after-dozens-report-debilitating-reaction.html

Does this sound genuine? I honestly don't know.

My aunty has chronic fatigue syndrome. She's in her late 70s and has suffered from it since he was in her early 20s. I've never met anyone as frail as her. She's been on a sickness benefit as she's been unable to work since she developed the disease. She only has around an hour of energy before she needs to rest /nap to recharge. Anyway yes when she had the first vaccine she was absolutely debilitated for days afterwards. But she knew it was for the greater good and for her community so she did the further doses anyway.

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quickymart

13770 posts

Uber Geek

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#2889379 21-Mar-2022 08:48

That is awesome of her to do that, given her situation, a pity those protesters aren't more like your aunt.

alexx

867 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2889681 21-Mar-2022 17:32

quickymart:

Sorry - it talks about the impact of removing all restrictions (ie, "just open up the borders") as opposed to leaving some in place, at least until we're over the current peak.

It depends on whether you think we have seen the last wave or last serious wave or not.

The whole idea of the Traffic Light system was meant be that you could bring things back to the lower levels as appropriate. Most of the restrictions have very little impact on my life. If I go to my local cafe I wear a mask in the cafe when I order and sit outside to drink my coffee or lunch. Since they know me and have seen my vaccine pass, it's not something I have needed to show them again in a long time. Since there are less than 100 seats in this cafe, there would be few if any restrictions anyway under Green Light conditions.

Getting rid of all restrictions might sound good until the next wave comes, but if anything it could be worse for the hospitality sector if there were no restrictions at all. My willingness to visit my local cafe is based on my perception on the level of risk and precautions being taken, not whether I have to wear a mask inside or carry a vaccine pass.

Getting rid of MIQ and all isolation requirements must sound good to the regular business traveller, but MIQ and isolation requirements have no doubt saved hundreds, if not thousands of lives - just compare to some other countries with a similar population. Even though these systems are not perfect, the delay of Delta and then Omicron allowed a lot of adults and children to get vaccinated and others to get boosters.

Vaccination appears to have made a huge difference with Omicron as we can see in the this thread from John Burn-Murdoch from the Financial Times
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1503420660869214213

Without MIQ or isolation requirements, we would probably get the next significant wave during the same week as the rising case numbers and hospitalisations appear in the world media. Hope everyone here has a nice comfortable home to isolate in and can afford to work from home and stock up on supplies - many can't.

#include <standard.disclaimer>

mattwnz

20100 posts

Uber Geek

#2889685 21-Mar-2022 17:47

alexx:

Getting rid of MIQ and all isolation requirements must sound good to the regular business traveller, but MIQ and isolation requirements have no doubt saved hundreds, if not thousands of lives - just compare to some other countries with a similar population. Even though these systems are not perfect, the delay of Delta and then Omicron allowed a lot of adults and children to get vaccinated and others to get boosters.

Vaccination appears to have made a huge difference with Omicron as we can see in the this thread from John Burn-Murdoch from the Financial Times
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1503420660869214213

Without MIQ or isolation requirements, we would probably get the next significant wave during the same week as the rising case numbers and hospitalisations appear in the world media. Hope everyone here has a nice comfortable home to isolate in and can afford to work from home and stock up on supplies - many can't.

Exactly. And the problem is that NZs health system is nowhere near as good as Australia's or the UKs, to cope with a wave where a lot of people do not have significant immunity to getting a bad case of covid. NZ would have had our wave in line with Australias if we didn't have MIQ in place, and far more people would have likely died or got very sick, because we needed that extra time to bump up vaccinations and get more people boosted. NZ no longer has that line of defense in place so we are very vulnerable to the next variant. The WHO have warned that the pandemic is far from over, and we need to get poorer countries vaccinated otherwise we will just continue to get new variants emerge.

IMO it is just crazy that there are some calling for an end to mandates and restrictions, right when we are yet to reach the peak of cases in much of NZ. It is like going outside into a cyclone to celebrate it is over , in the eye of the storm, when you still have the other half to come. I read one expert sees that NZ could end up in a yoyo situation, or we could flatline with a high number of cases each day for a long time, along with other winter illnesses. It does seem we are flatlining at the moment with constant high numbers.

johno1234

2734 posts

Uber Geek

#2889868 22-Mar-2022 08:28

mattwnz:

alexx:

Getting rid of MIQ and all isolation requirements must sound good to the regular business traveller, but MIQ and isolation requirements have no doubt saved hundreds, if not thousands of lives - just compare to some other countries with a similar population. Even though these systems are not perfect, the delay of Delta and then Omicron allowed a lot of adults and children to get vaccinated and others to get boosters.

Vaccination appears to have made a huge difference with Omicron as we can see in the this thread from John Burn-Murdoch from the Financial Times
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1503420660869214213

Without MIQ or isolation requirements, we would probably get the next significant wave during the same week as the rising case numbers and hospitalisations appear in the world media. Hope everyone here has a nice comfortable home to isolate in and can afford to work from home and stock up on supplies - many can't.

Exactly. And the problem is that NZs health system is nowhere near as good as Australia's or the UKs, to cope with a wave where a lot of people do not have significant immunity to getting a bad case of covid. NZ would have had our wave in line with Australias if we didn't have MIQ in place, and far more people would have likely died or got very sick, because we needed that extra time to bump up vaccinations and get more people boosted. NZ no longer has that line of defense in place so we are very vulnerable to the next variant. The WHO have warned that the pandemic is far from over, and we need to get poorer countries vaccinated otherwise we will just continue to get new variants emerge.

IMO it is just crazy that there are some calling for an end to mandates and restrictions, right when we are yet to reach the peak of cases in much of NZ. It is like going outside into a cyclone to celebrate it is over , in the eye of the storm, when you still have the other half to come. I read one expert sees that NZ could end up in a yoyo situation, or we could flatline with a high number of cases each day for a long time, along with other winter illnesses. It does seem we are flatlining at the moment with constant high numbers.

Given that we are what, 95% vaccinated? And the 5% would rather die than be vaccinated, what is the ongoing benefit to vaccine mandates? Is 96% coverage effectively different to 95%?

Oblivian

7284 posts

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#2889904 22-Mar-2022 09:53

johno1234:
Given that we are what, 95% vaccinated? And the 5% would rather die than be vaccinated, what is the ongoing benefit to vaccine mandates? Is 96% coverage effectively different to 95%?

*Double vaccinated..IE a whole lot behind the ball given the timespan that was distributed and focused on detla

3x dosed in last few months is required before exposure for descent follow up effect in the now. And we are only 73% of eligible there.

Leave out those not eligible. Or refusing to get a 3rd because they think they are bullet proof or it's a sham. And you are waaayyyyy over a remaining 5%

As there are posts around. 'getting on with it' paints an even larger target on immunocompromised than suppression.

DS248

1691 posts

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Lifetime subscriber

#2889915 22-Mar-2022 10:31

alexx:

...

Vaccination appears to have made a huge difference with Omicron as we can see in the this thread from John Burn-Murdoch from the Financial Times
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1503420660869214213

...

Excellent info in that link. Clearly highlights that Omicron's apparent mildness/low lethality in NZ, AU, and other countries with high levels of vaccination and/or prior infections is mainly immunity-driven, as HK so well demonstrates.

Oblivian

7284 posts

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#2890528 23-Mar-2022 11:34

Well then.

Even more people to give up caring now they have target dates I guess.

At least events I visit are now eaiser.

Batman

Mad Scientist
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#2890539 23-Mar-2022 11:46

APRIL 4!

That's the shortest mandate in the world?

edit - is that some mandate or all mandate? eg healthcare?

quickymart

13770 posts

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#2890567 23-Mar-2022 12:09

https://thespinoff.co.nz/live-updates/23-03-2022

I think healthcare will stay the same. I'm a bit worried about teachers not needing to be vaccinated though. What about midwives, or are they classed as healthcare workers?

Oblivian

7284 posts

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#2890571 23-Mar-2022 12:14

Passes were the go to for weeding out travellers

Go guessing there is more changes ahead in finite details that need to come.

As is businesses that chose to keep it adopted (I know of a few specialist roles that still will that cant afford anyone off)

Much to the discontent associated with the passes/mandates at least masks are being kept to try isolate you breathing on me and vice versa.
If only those below the nose would click.

Tempted to make a sign 'I put this up my nose for a sample 3x a week. Least you can do is cover your breeding grounds'

sen8or

1778 posts

Uber Geek

#2890639 23-Mar-2022 12:49

quickymart:

https://thespinoff.co.nz/live-updates/23-03-2022

I think healthcare will stay the same. I'm a bit worried about teachers not needing to be vaccinated though. What about midwives, or are they classed as healthcare workers?

Why the worry?

Theoretically, anyone now who is teaching is vaccinated. 95%+ of the population is vaccinated, so chances are that anyone not currently a teacher that is going into the profession is likely to be vaccinated. Will those that were teaching and had to leave because of the mandates go back to the profession (skewing the odds), I guess that depends on how much they liked the job and whether or not they are welcomed back.

Its interesting to see that they have left things open for businesses that choose to keep things like vaccine passes in place. I can see employment lawyers rubbing their hands together at "discrimination cases" where there is no Govt. directive in play to force vaccine status/declaration.

Oblivian

7284 posts

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#2890641 23-Mar-2022 12:52

I just said similar to a friend

Betting the protestors around country will be first in line for unjust dismissal or similar, based on their employment agreement changes that they didn't agree with so parted ways.

kiwifidget

"Cookie"
3362 posts

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#2890654 23-Mar-2022 13:17

Oblivian: I just said similar to a friend

Betting the protestors around country will be first in line for unjust dismissal or similar, based on their employment agreement changes that they didn't agree with so parted ways.

If their job description mentions anything about being a "team player" then they won't have a leg to stand on.

Delete cookies?! Are you insane?!

ezbee

2369 posts

Uber Geek

#2890667 23-Mar-2022 13:38

Teaching no problem ?

You may want to look at the age of Teachers.
Before covid there were warnings about the increasing age and large number over retirement age.
Trainees not being enrolled at level needed over next few years.

Like for Trades, Medical pretty much anything no-one wants to pay for training, nor employ freshly qualified. So people are a bit cautious to enroll to qualify for something they can't get work in too.

When you get to older people around and over retirement age, vaccination is not as effective as much younger. Hopefully they are all getting their boosters, though uptake is a bit slow on these.

Children are unvaccinated too.
Looks like we may still be weeks away from getting to 50% 5-11, and maybe 55% will be it. 12-18 ?

So its not so easy, given that level of exposure is a potential issue.
Air purifiers for every school room are a long way away ?
If it ever happens, or gets cancelled as not necessary expense ?
Winter ?

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