2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2519337 8-Jul-2020 14:31

mattwnz:

I just can't believe there weren't staff at the entrance. They aren't prisons, but that doesn't mean that entrances shouldn't be staffed.

There was staff, a security guard. They don’t have the power to apprehend someone though, they can only watch them leave, and then report, follow.

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Scott3

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#2519339 8-Jul-2020 14:34

Buster:

If he has dual citizenship I'd put him on the next flight back to India.

Extremely limited circumstances where citizenship can be revoked:

https://www.govt.nz/browse/passports-citizenship-and-identity/nz-citizenship/changing-your-citizenship-status/being-stripped-of-nz-citizenship/

Even then there is time to appeal, and the time to serve a deportation notice, so putting somebody on the next flight is not feasible.

Not sure how ethical it would be to put a known positive Covid-19 case on a plane either, or if any commercial airline would accept them.

Buster

297 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2519347 8-Jul-2020 14:51

Not sure how ethical it would be to put a known positive Covid-19 case on a plane either, or if any commercial airline would accept them.

Correct. Somehow I missed the point that he had actually tested positive.

mattwnz

20039 posts

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#2519356 8-Jul-2020 15:08

rugrat:

mattwnz:

I just can't believe there weren't staff at the entrance. They aren't prisons, but that doesn't mean that entrances shouldn't be staffed.

There was staff, a security guard. They don’t have the power to apprehend someone though, they can only watch them leave, and then report, follow.

Does show a a major loophole IMO, allowing them to breach the border and get into the community. It is now the second case of someone positive getting through the border since our isolation hotels were setup. I did read that they were looking at a stronger police presence.

IMO it also highlights the importance of testing people upon arrival, as this case could have been picked up earlier, before this event occurred. I understand it was about day 4 before they were first tested

vexxxboy

4232 posts

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#2519374 8-Jul-2020 15:16

mattwnz

Does show a a major loophole IMO, allowing them to breach the border and get into the community. It is now the second case of someone positive getting through the border since our isolation hotels were setup. I did read that they were looking at a stronger police presence.

IMO it also highlights the importance of testing people upon arrival, as this case could have been picked up earlier, before this event occurred. I understand it was about day 4 before they were first tested

why is it important to test them on arrival when you probably get a negative test , Day 3-4 is when most people show symptoms, which is why they are tested on day 3.

Common sense is not as common as you think.

Scotdownunder

213 posts

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#2519394 8-Jul-2020 15:49

Some of our commentators miss the point that the unauthorised exit was possible because taller fences were being installed to stop the type of ‘jump the fence’ issue of the earlier absconder. Yes its a process of catch up but that has to be accepted as part of an ‘as humane as possible’ isolation policy. We are not building concentration camps after all. Pretty sad reflection on some self-entitled Kiwis that it comes to this.

Batman

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#2519395 8-Jul-2020 15:49

GV27:

Another idiot:

There is one new case of Covid-19, a man in his 30s who arrived in New Zealand from India on July 3.

Health Minister Chris Hipkins says the man left his managed isolation facility and went to Countdown on Victoria St West last night.

Public health officials are conducting interviews to assess the risk, but currently it is deemed low.

The man didn't come into close contact in the hour he was away from the facility, from 7pm to 8pm.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12346479

countdown chooses to close the store and staff are self isolating.

is that the right thing to do (assuming there was no close contact between person and staff/others)

bear in mind he came in on a 10hr+ flight, umpteen airport lounges terminals and counters etc etc

mattwnz

20039 posts

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#2519404 8-Jul-2020 15:55

vexxxboy:

why is it important to test them on arrival when you probably get a negative test , Day 3-4 is when most people show symptoms, which is why they are tested on day 3.

That would be assuming they were infected on the plane trip or at the airport over to NZ. But it would depend on when they were infected, as they may have been infected with the virus up to 14 days prior to arriving in NZ, so the sooner they are tested the better, after arriving in the country, so they are put into the appropriate containment facility. These tests aren't that accurate anyway, but if they are getting 3 tests, eg day 1, day 4 and then near the end, the odds of a false negative across all 3 tests should be reduced.

msukiwi

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#2519405 8-Jul-2020 15:55

Batman:countdown chooses to close the store and staff are self isolating.

Send him the bill! Staff wages / lost profit / lost stock (Fresh stuff) / cleaning costs etc! (Plus anything else appropriate)

mattwnz

20039 posts

Uber Geek

#2519406 8-Jul-2020 15:57

msukiwi:

Batman:countdown chooses to close the store and staff are self isolating.

Send him the bill! Staff wages / lost profit / lost stock (Fresh stuff) / cleaning costs etc! (Plus anything else appropriate)

Guessing it will be a lot more than 4k. I woud like to see fines up to the levels they are in Australia.

GV27

5869 posts

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#2519407 8-Jul-2020 15:57

Batman:

countdown chooses to close the store and staff are self isolating.

is that the right thing to do (assuming there was no close contact between person and staff/others)

bear in mind he came in on a 10hr+ flight, umpteen airport lounges terminals and counters etc etc

If he uses a self-checkout he's pressed buttons and other surfaces that other people may well have used subsequently.

Scott3

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#2519409 8-Jul-2020 15:59

Batman:

...

is that the right thing to do (assuming there was no close contact between person and staff/others)

..

Note the definition of close contact.

https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-health-advice-general-public/contact-tracing-covid-19#close

As long as you don't exchange body fluids you can hug, and spend less than 15mins together, nobody would be defined as a close contact.

It is possible to have transmission in 14 minutes or less.

mattwnz

20039 posts

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#2519413 8-Jul-2020 16:03

GV27:

Batman:

countdown chooses to close the store and staff are self isolating.

is that the right thing to do (assuming there was no close contact between person and staff/others)

bear in mind he came in on a 10hr+ flight, umpteen airport lounges terminals and counters etc etc

If he uses a self-checkout he's pressed buttons and other surfaces that other people may well have used subsequently.

This is why people should still be washing their hands etc, even though there isn't much education now about the need to continue to do this. I thought it was interesting that the minister of health was discussing the Covid app today, and had stats, and how people aren't using it. Apparently here have only been about a million scans of codes, which is tiny, considering there have been 500k downloads. Isn't that because there has been little commuiniction out there about the need to use it? My parents tried to use it and it didn't work, as it didn't accept the QR code. Now is the time to make sure these systems are fully working and in use IMO, as we could be living with this covid threat getting into NZ for years.

Batman

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#2519415 8-Jul-2020 16:07

GV27:

If he uses a self-checkout he's pressed buttons and other surfaces that other people may well have used subsequently.

Note the definition of close contact.

https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-health-advice-general-public/contact-tracing-covid-19#close

As long as you don't exchange body fluids you can hug, and spend less than 15mins together, nobody would be defined as a close contact.

It is possible to have transmission in 14 minutes or less.

what's the difference between cleaning the buttons/other places and closing the store though. he's also touched things in the hotel presumably, as well as the numerous airport transit lounges.

they are likely to have gotten the definition from WHO. i have a question for those who fear covid like the plague - if the virus was spread by travellers to each other would we only see 1-2 cases a day? we should see 10,000 cases a day surely.

mattwnz

20039 posts

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#2519418 8-Jul-2020 16:11

Scotdownunder:

Some of our commentators miss the point that the unauthorised exit was possible because taller fences were being installed to stop the type of ‘jump the fence’ issue of the earlier absconder. Yes its a process of catch up but that has to be accepted as part of an ‘as humane as possible’ isolation policy. We are not building concentration camps after all. Pretty sad reflection on some self-entitled Kiwis that it comes to this.

This is true, and it is ironic that something that was supposed to provide a stronger and more robust border, led to this . But common sense would dictate that while that work was being done, that people should be asked to remain inside. Yes it is a poor reflection, but the fact is that the system is only as strong as the weakest link. This virus will find any hole it can, and we do have to remember that there is a war raging out there with this virus, so our border needs to be watertight. It means people coming into NZ have to play their part and mak some sacrifice, just as 5 million people did before this with our level 4 lockdown to eliminate the virus.
If there are a few bad actors, then they spoil it for everyone. We could still have self isolation today, if a few bad actors hadn't let the team of 5 million down originally, and stayed at home in isolation, and didn't have visitors come over.

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