2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2526399 21-Jul-2020 10:45

frankv:
BarTender:

Ski fields just this week said they were seeing the busiest time for the school holiday season: https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/queenstown/holiday-boost-skifields

I think this was to be expected. Kiwi families have a bit of cash in the discretionary spend bucket due to having been locked down, so are now spending it. It is well-known that school holidays are the busiest time on the skifields, so you would expect Aussies to avoid that if at all possible. So it's no surprise that the scarcity of Aussies hasn't impacted the skifields much.

My issue is that folks such as @handle9 said we needed to open for the economy and the approach the government has is not sustainable.
Oddly enough they haven’t responded to the facts I brought to the argument.

and

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frankv

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#2526456 21-Jul-2020 11:37

Scores of Russia’s business and political elite have been given early access to an experimental vaccine against Covid-19, according to people familiar with the effort, as the country races to be among the first to develop an inoculation.

Exactly the opposite of what drug companies usually do. But it sounds like a great idea, and should be made standard procedure... use the rich, who can afford health care if it all goes wrong, as guinea pigs. And politicians too, who so frequently make decisions affecting everyone but themselves... put them in the front line too.

ezbee

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#2526565 21-Jul-2020 14:23

Victoria is turning into a very hard fight, looks like the initial postcode lock-down was too localized.
Perhaps some lessons, and warnings on how many days ahead of you this virus always is , if its allowed to be free.
NSW numbers may not look that bad, but they are persist, and a number of clusters/sources.
It shows the amplificati0on power of a bar, 1 bar is 50 of the cases so far and growing.
The other states must be reviewing their measures to manage interstate trucking, essential workers, and travel.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-21/coronavirus-australia-live-news-covid-19-latest-victoria/12474758

Key events

28mminutes agoAustralia's unemployment rate is effectively 11.3pc, Treasurer says
45mminutes agoJobKeeper wage subsidy rate will be cut to $1,200 a fortnight for full time workers
1hhour agoThree people have died in Victoria as the state records 374 new coronavirus cases
1hhour agoNSW records 13 new cases overnight

mattwnz

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#2526569 21-Jul-2020 14:36

I have been posting over the last few weeks here about the lack of community testing in the community. Yesterday there were only 8 tests done in the NZ community! EIGHT!

https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/21-07-2020/live-updates-july-21-falloon-asked-to-resign-immediately/

This is despite the Minister of Health weeks ago saying he wasn't happy about the low number of tests being done and asking the ministry to increase testing to 4000 per day. The ministry also says they want testing to increase. They now say "Anyone going to the doctor with respiratory symptoms from now on should be tested; tests should always be free; and people should always accept getting a test. Ashley Bloomfield said he’s aware of people with symptoms that have been offered tests, and refused."

IMO that shoul dhave always been the case and they should never have changed the requirements, and there has been so much confusion with doctors. I wonder if some don't think they will be paid or there will be too much paperwork involved in getting the money back?

I hope this lack of testing doesn't provide to be a major error. We just have to look at Victoria as an example of where the virus escapes the managed isolation facility, and then gets embedded in the community. A similar error in NZ could cost far more than the 14billion they have put aside, as many businesses won't cope with a second lockdown.

Oblivian

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#2526580 21-Jul-2020 14:43

And equally we have been pointing out, you can't MAKE people take it.

It is voluntary.

There has to be reason to consider it, or referral

They can throw numbers in the air all they like. When they keep banging that there has been xx days since community transmission and ensuring people the borders are closed. There is no reason for people to VOLUNTEER.

Regardless of the goal posts. You still have to have people WILLING, or a VALID REASON to put themselves forward.

This isn't China. We don't have a dictatorship.

Hoardes of volunteers come forward in Victoria when they ran street collection. The same would likely happen here if it was for requiring assurance. So far that assurance has come from the top that it's not necessary. The same people bitching there's not enough.

Handle9

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#2526590 21-Jul-2020 15:04

BarTender:
frankv:
/p>
I think this was to be expected. Kiwi families have a bit of cash in the discretionary spend bucket due to having been locked down, so are now spending it. It is well-known that school holidays are the busiest time on the skifields, so you would expect Aussies to avoid that if at all possible. So it's no surprise that the scarcity of Aussies hasn't impacted the skifields much.

My issue is that folks such as @handle9 said we needed to open for the economy and the approach the government has is not sustainable.
Oddly enough they haven’t responded to the facts I brought to the argument.

Give it up. You weren't presenting facts you were presenting strawmen.

Facts are that another thousand people are loosing their jobs with considerably more reducing their hours at the Warehouse.

It is a fact that the South Auckland Christian foodbank has had demand rise by 100% on pre Covid levels.

Your opinion isn't a fact, neither is mine.

freitasm

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#2526592 21-Jul-2020 15:08

And you think jobs at The Warehouse would be safer if we allowed international business travellers as you mentioned before?

Really?

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Handle9

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#2526597 21-Jul-2020 15:11

freitasm:
And you think jobs at The Warehouse would be safer if we allowed international business travellers as you mentioned before?

Really?

Did I say that?

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#2526608 21-Jul-2020 15:17

Fred99: Scores of Russia’s business and political elite have been given early access to an experimental vaccine against Covid-19, according to people familiar with the effort, as the country races to be among the first to develop an inoculation.

By "elite" I guess they mean "rich".

It's a sad fact that most medical volunteers are either very altruistic or risk-takers, or very poor.

It's the equivalent to being test pilots for a new plane. It's wonderful if everything goes right. Not so much if things goes wrong.

freitasm

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#2526613 21-Jul-2020 15:24

Handle9:
freitasm:

And you think jobs at The Warehouse would be safer if we allowed international business travellers as you mentioned before?

Really?

Did I say that?

You said "Facts are that another thousand people are loosing their jobs with considerably more reducing their hours at the Warehouse."

And this is a follow up from your previous discussion about opening up.

"I think that if all your neighbours and trading partners are shut down, then it's inevitable that your own economy will take a hit. Possibly if enough other countries had stayed open, their economies and Sweden's would have taken less of a hit. Not that I think staying open would have been a good idea, just saying."

"I know of a number of redundancies that happened recently that may have even avoided had the parent company management been able to visit. What is New Zealands plan to keep things moving, other than subsidies? This isn't about the next 3 months, it's likely a multi year problem. Many billions of dollars have been taken out of the New Zealand economy and it's not coming back. Those subsidies are stopping soon so what happens next?"

You have been hammering this point and now make a direct representation of an event - that by all purposes seemed to be a long time coming, even before COVID-19 - and want us to not believe you are not creating the correlation?

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Handle9

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#2526614 21-Jul-2020 15:27

freitasm:

Did I say that?

You said "Facts are that another thousand people are loosing their jobs with considerably more reducing their hours at the Warehouse."

And this is a follow up from your previous discussion about opening up.

"I think that if all your neighbours and trading partners are shut down, then it's inevitable that your own economy will take a hit. Possibly if enough other countries had stayed open, their economies and Sweden's would have taken less of a hit. Not that I think staying open would have been a good idea, just saying."

"I know of a number of redundancies that happened recently that may have even avoided had the parent company management been able to visit. What is New Zealands plan to keep things moving, other than subsidies? This isn't about the next 3 months, it's likely a multi year problem. Many billions of dollars have been taken out of the New Zealand economy and it's not coming back. Those subsidies are stopping soon so what happens next?"

You have been hammering this point and now make a direct representation of an event - that by all purposes seemed to be a long time coming, even before COVID-19 - and want us to not believe you are not creating the correlation?

Yes I do.

I said my piece the other day, there was nothing I felt I needed to add.

I was responding to a direct mention by someone else who was looking to pick a fight.

Do you think I am lying?

freitasm

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#2526616 21-Jul-2020 15:30

Handle9:

Do you think I am lying?

Did I say that?

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#2526620 21-Jul-2020 15:36

freitasm:
Handle9:

Do you think I am lying?

Did I say that?

Nope 😀

KrazyKid

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#2526644 21-Jul-2020 16:32

Re Testing:

Oblivian:

Hoardes of volunteers come forward in Victoria when they ran street collection. The same would likely happen here if it was for requiring assurance. So far that assurance has come from the top that it's not necessary. The same people bitching there's not enough.

There is no point doing random street tests - the chance of a positive is way to low to make it worthwhile.

We need to test the right areas.
Eg anyone symptomatic presenting at doctors, All border and MIQ hotel staff, Maybe hospital staff and other high contact/risk areas.
And regular tests as well - cycle through and repeat test every month or something.
Plus out of cycle tests if symptomatic (Which I suspect the will do already)

But like others said, you can't make people take the test.

We need to educate the public and get the doctors to push the testing when people present.

The panic testing in Auckland a few weeks ago was to much, but now it is way to low.

Oblivian

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#2526652 21-Jul-2020 16:48

KrazyKid:

We need to test the right areas.
Eg anyone symptomatic presenting at doctors, All border and MIQ hotel staff, Maybe hospital staff and other high contact/risk areas.
And regular tests as well - cycle through and repeat test every month or something.
Plus out of cycle tests if symptomatic (Which I suspect the will do already)

The 8 is the 'randoms'. The rest are in the above.

Yesterday our laboratories processed 1007 tests.

The programme to test people working at Managed Isolation Facilities and at the border is now well underway and we are finalising the frequency with which people at those facilities will need to be tested.

This programme provides additional assurance that we are continuing to detect and contain COVID-19 at the border. It’s in addition to testing for those who have symptoms which is already well established.

The Ministry wishes to thank employers for working with us to support this programme and to all who have been tested, along with all the measures you take to keep yourselves safe and keep COVID-19 out of our communities.

We are asking DHBs and health providers to report to us on a weekly basis.

Between the 8th and 19th of July, we can report border testing of 405 workers

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