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MikeB4
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  #1009908 20-Mar-2014 15:00
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Klipspringer:
KiwiNZ:
No its a warning

Do you want a sign, a diamond, lights, bells a man with a flag al at once.




But the article I just showed you proves something else

http://www.gw.govt.nz/assets/Transport/School-Travel-Plan-Images-and-Documents/Wairarapa-Road-Safety-Council-Road-Crossing-Safety-Sheet.pdf




Still only a warning.

Best practice; see a pedestrian crossing slowdown, see a person near a crossing prepare to stop, see a person motion to cross or crossing irrespective of what side of the road they are on stop.

MurrayM
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  #1009970 20-Mar-2014 16:10
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KiwiNZ: I really cannot see the need for a diamond if there are lights. On uncontrolled crossing warning is prudent. We have a few things here that are different to overseas, like the side of the road we drive on, we don't have zig zag lines on the side of the road.

Yeah, why DO some countries have zig zag lines down their roads?  I've noticed this in the UK but is it elsewhere too?

 
 
 
 


MurrayM
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  #1009977 20-Mar-2014 16:18
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blakamin: NZ pedestrians treat the crossing as if it were a magic carpet and they won't get hurt no matter what they do.
The amount of people I've had step out in front of my semi... I couldn't count. They get the idea when the air horn goes and the trailer locks up, tyres screeching, smoke billowing everywhere.

Or they step out in front of the car that's in front of the truck... mad.

It's my understanding, someone correct me if I'm wrong, that in Japan (and maybe in other countries) pedestrians have the right of way over cars.  I've been with Japanese students who were staying with us and they just marched out into the road oblivious to any cars that were approaching, they seemed to just think that the cars had to stop for them.

Oblivian
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  #1009979 20-Mar-2014 16:20
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MurrayM:
KiwiNZ: I really cannot see the need for a diamond if there are lights. On uncontrolled crossing warning is prudent. We have a few things here that are different to overseas, like the side of the road we drive on, we don't have zig zag lines on the side of the road.

Yeah, why DO some countries have zig zag lines down their roads?  I've noticed this in the UK but is it elsewhere too?


Same reason as our diamonds lol

These increase the warning to approaching drivers and also create a zone in which parking and overtaking (i.e. 'passing') are strictly forbidden.

Batman
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  #1009981 20-Mar-2014 16:22
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there used to be a pedestrian crossing about 5m from the double laned roundabout in Avondale Auckland that is super busy with I think 4 intersections.

in that case the city council is to blame. if you knew it existed you looked out and prepare to stop once you negotiate though the sea of cars all wanting to cut you off. if you didn't know ... well ...




Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


scuwp
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  #1009983 20-Mar-2014 16:22
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MurrayM:
KiwiNZ: I really cannot see the need for a diamond if there are lights. On uncontrolled crossing warning is prudent. We have a few things here that are different to overseas, like the side of the road we drive on, we don't have zig zag lines on the side of the road.

Yeah, why DO some countries have zig zag lines down their roads?  I've noticed this in the UK but is it elsewhere too?


It's all around creating visual cues, and sometimes an optical illusion to subliminally alter driving behavior (yip...Mind control!!!).   The wiggly lines have been trialed in NZ but not widely adopted.  




Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then always be the Batman



scuwp
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  #1009986 20-Mar-2014 16:29
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Having a wizz through the older posts I can't see the actual law referred to. So how's this from the Road User Rule:


10.1Pedestrian crossings
(1)A driver approaching a pedestrian crossing must—
(a)give way to pedestrians, and to riders of wheeled recreational devices or mobility devices,—
(i)on the pedestrian crossing; or
(ii)obviously waiting to cross it and who are not behind a school patrol sign; and
(b)if necessary, slow down and stop the driver's vehicle for that purpose.
(2)A driver approaching a pedestrian crossing must not enter the crossing if the driver's intended passage is blocked by stationary traffic.
(3)For the purposes of this clause, if a pedestrian crossing is interrupted by a raised traffic island, the parts of the crossing that are situated on different sides of that traffic island must be regarded as separate pedestrian crossings.
(4)This clause does not apply to a pedestrian crossing that is for the time being controlled by an enforcement officer.

Someone commented earlier that you don't have to give way to cyclists unless they are walking. Clearly that advise was incorrect.




Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then always be the Batman



 
 
 
 


jeffnz
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  #1010029 20-Mar-2014 16:55
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Bung:
jeffnz:
so to sum up they are amongst the worst in the areas you travel, fine understand now 


I don't know what pushed your pedant button. If you are a cyclist all you have to understand is you don't have any right of way on a crossing.


label me as you see fit suffice I don't like gross generalisations of any sort and post accordingly. Thanks for explaining the cyclists right of way but I wasn't in any doubt nor did I bring it up, in fac t apart from this one point I agreed with you.




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nzkiwiman
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  #1010039 20-Mar-2014 17:32
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MurrayM:
blakamin: NZ pedestrians treat the crossing as if it were a magic carpet and they won't get hurt no matter what they do.
The amount of people I've had step out in front of my semi... I couldn't count. They get the idea when the air horn goes and the trailer locks up, tyres screeching, smoke billowing everywhere.

Or they step out in front of the car that's in front of the truck... mad.

It's my understanding, someone correct me if I'm wrong, that in Japan (and maybe in other countries) pedestrians have the right of way over cars.  I've been with Japanese students who were staying with us and they just marched out into the road oblivious to any cars that were approaching, they seemed to just think that the cars had to stop for them.


I noticed that in San Francisco that if I stepped onto the road, cars were stopping several hundred meters from where I was and telling me to cross. Probably scared I would sue them or something

Stu

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  #1010058 20-Mar-2014 18:07
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KiwiNZ: "When coming up to pedestrian crossings:

 

  • slow down and be ready to stop for any pedestrians stepping onto, or on, the crossing – this also includes people obviously waiting to use the crossing
  • if there is no raised traffic island in the middle of the crossing, stop and give way to pedestrians on any part of the crossing
  • if there is a raised traffic island in the middle of the crossing, stop and give way to pedestrians on your half of the road
  • wait until the pedestrian has crossed in front of you and is clear of your vehicle before you proceed"
Source= NZTA


This came in to effect in 2004 I think it was. Prior to that I'm sure the diamonds were there for the reasons suggested by the OP. 

It was probably easier to change the road rules than to teach the rules of the time to, and develop common sense in, the unruly youths who insisted (still do) on just bowling out of a walkway or side street onto a badly placed crossing (from a drivers' perspective) in front of cars and expecting them to come to a complete stop in less than a metre. Once actually on a crossing, you'll notice how said youths will drop speed down to a crawling pace. The youth of today also seem to think the effective area of a pedestrian crossing begins and ends 5 to 10 metres before and after where the painted stripes actually are.

Bung
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  #1010064 20-Mar-2014 18:29
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scuwp: Having a wizz through the older posts I can't see the actual law referred to. So how's this from the Road User Rule:


10.1Pedestrian crossings
(1)A driver approaching a pedestrian crossing must—
(a)give way to pedestrians, and to riders of wheeled recreational devices
Someone commented earlier that you don't have to give way to cyclists unless they are walking. Clearly that advise was incorrect.


I'll put my hand up to that. If you check the definitions in the rules you'll find that cycles with wheels bigger than 300 and something mm are not included in the definition wheeled rec devices.

scuwp
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  #1010068 20-Mar-2014 18:42
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Bung:
scuwp: Having a wizz through the older posts I can't see the actual law referred to. So how's this from the Road User Rule:


10.1Pedestrian crossings
(1)A driver approaching a pedestrian crossing must—
(a)give way to pedestrians, and to riders of wheeled recreational devices
Someone commented earlier that you don't have to give way to cyclists unless they are walking. Clearly that advise was incorrect.


I'll put my hand up to that. If you check the definitions in the rules you'll find that cycles with wheels bigger than 300 and something mm are not included in the definition wheeled rec devices.


By joves your right!  So you don't have to give way to me when I stupidly think that crossing the road on my bike is quicker and less inconvenience to a driver, but you do have to give way to my daughter on her little bike.  Sillyness prevails.  

 




Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then always be the Batman



Bung
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  #1010084 20-Mar-2014 19:23
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scuwp:
By joves your right!  So you don't have to give way to me when I stupidly think that crossing the road on my bike is quicker and less inconvenience to a driver, but you do have to give way to my daughter on her little bike.  Sillyness prevails.  

 


I think a cycle lobby is working on getting the law changed. My issue with cyclists is the speed that they can appear on the crossing. With the crossings I usually traverse there are road narrowing islands at the side and a pedestrian in that area is a warning to slow or stop. The cyclist that could arrive at the same time could be quite some distance away and just going in the same direction as you are. They should be prepared to almost stop before crossing. That would give both sides a chance.

Stu

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  #1010114 20-Mar-2014 19:55
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They should get off their bikes and walk. It's a pedestrian crossing, not a cycle way. Considering you aren't allowed to ride on the footpath it really makes no sense that you can ride over a pedestrian crossing.

Bung
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  #1010119 20-Mar-2014 20:12
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The line has been blurred as far as footpaths go. Wellington has several wide footpaths that are shared cycle ways.

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