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  # 2114822 27-Oct-2018 10:30
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Linuxluver: 

 

We do ok for 4.8M people.

 

I really don't think we do.

 

Every time I drive it, I'm embarrassed at the state of most of SH1, let alone the rest of the network. All of the former "National" highways (SH1-8), but especially SH1 should be motorway/freeway/expressway level roads the entire length.





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  # 2114832 27-Oct-2018 11:11
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@Lias yep it's a disgrace. Improve the roads, save lives and reduce fuel imports and energy.




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  # 2114881 27-Oct-2018 11:52
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I'd be happy to embrace tolling. If someone built a 4 lane, straight, modern 120kmh road with regular services between Chch and Auckland, and the toll was $50 each way I would pay that without complaint - toll roads are used all over the world to good effect. You could even consider outsourcing the whole thing to an international consortium on a Build/Own/Operate basis.






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  # 2116924 30-Oct-2018 15:48
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Lias:

 

Linuxluver: 

 

We do ok for 4.8M people.

 

I really don't think we do.

 

Every time I drive it, I'm embarrassed at the state of most of SH1, let alone the rest of the network. All of the former "National" highways (SH1-8), but especially SH1 should be motorway/freeway/expressway level roads the entire length.

 



It probably would be if people hadn't voted for tax cuts in 2008 and they NEVER stop wingeing every time a government tries to raise money to improve infrastructure.

We have the highways we voted to have.





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  # 2116925 30-Oct-2018 15:49
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MikeB4: @Lias yep it's a disgrace. Improve the roads, save lives and reduce fuel imports and energy.


Pay more taxes. Get better roads.

It's not rocket science. :-)





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  # 2116940 30-Oct-2018 16:12
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Linuxluver:

 

MikeB4: @Lias yep it's a disgrace. Improve the roads, save lives and reduce fuel imports and energy.


Pay more taxes. Get better roads.

It's not rocket science. :-)

 

 

 

 

that is what we are doing so the government improves a section SH1 from two lanes to two lanes, net benefit zero.





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  # 2116956 30-Oct-2018 16:55
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MikeB4:

 

Linuxluver:

 

MikeB4: @Lias yep it's a disgrace. Improve the roads, save lives and reduce fuel imports and energy.


Pay more taxes. Get better roads.

It's not rocket science. :-)

 

 

 

 

that is what we are doing so the government improves a section SH1 from two lanes to two lanes, net benefit zero.

 

 

Anyone that has driven from Otaki to North of Levin should know that 2 lanes, separated by a median barrier, moving traffic at a steady 90km (allowing for the odd truck) would be a huge improvement in terms of travel time and safety, compared to the current SH1. 


 
 
 
 


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  # 2117053 30-Oct-2018 19:21
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Linuxluver:

 

Pay more taxes. Get better roads.

It's not rocket science. :-)

 

 

Depends on the government. Under a National government you'd probably be right, under Labour? Not so much, sure they will spend _some_ money on roads, but not much, and will mostly funnel it off into complete wastes of money like cycle lanes and light rail.





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  # 2117054 30-Oct-2018 19:23
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nickb800:

 

Anyone that has driven from Otaki to North of Levin should know that 2 lanes, separated by a median barrier, moving traffic at a steady 90km (allowing for the odd truck) would be a huge improvement in terms of travel time and safety, compared to the current SH1. 

 

 

I wouldn't go so far as to say it would be a huge improvement, but yes it will be an improvement.. Not as much of an improvement as 4 lanes would be however, allowing anyone who actually wants to travel at the speed limit the entire length to do so.





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  # 2117170 31-Oct-2018 07:14
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Lias:

 

I wouldn't go so far as to say it would be a huge improvement, but yes it will be an improvement.. Not as much of an improvement as 4 lanes would be however, allowing anyone who actually wants to travel at the speed limit the entire length to do so.

 

 

Agree... it would be a slight improvement, not huge.

 

I went on a trip to the USA last year, and any significant road there was 4 lanes, separated by a median or barrier, often with a 70mph speed limit. The 4 lanes meant that traffic the large number of trucks didn't slow down the traffic at all. Yes, they have a much larger population, but this applied even in areas that were quite remote, where the population density would have been less than in New Zealand.

 

I'm told that in Sweden all major roads are 3 lanes, with the middle lane alternating as a passing lane in one direction or the other every couple of km. That sounds to me like a reasonable  way of saving a bit on the cost of building a proper 4-lane road.

 

 


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  # 2117176 31-Oct-2018 08:00
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Geektastic:

I'd be happy to embrace tolling. If someone built a 4 lane, straight, modern 120kmh road with regular services between Chch and Auckland, and the toll was $50 each way I would pay that without complaint - toll roads are used all over the world to good effect. You could even consider outsourcing the whole thing to an international consortium on a Build/Own/Operate basis.



Good luck with $50 each way! The only long distance toll routes I've had experience with have been in Italy. In round terms 10 Euro per 100km. The non toll routes often had the centre divider down so both ways could use a lane each while the other side was repaired (think Kapiti Expressway fiasco). Public Private Partnership there led to some very cheap construction.

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  # 2117189 31-Oct-2018 08:24
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Bung:
Geektastic:

 

I'd be happy to embrace tolling. If someone built a 4 lane, straight, modern 120kmh road with regular services between Chch and Auckland, and the toll was $50 each way I would pay that without complaint - toll roads are used all over the world to good effect. You could even consider outsourcing the whole thing to an international consortium on a Build/Own/Operate basis.

 



Good luck with $50 each way! The only long distance toll routes I've had experience with have been in Italy. In round terms 10 Euro per 100km. The non toll routes often had the centre divider down so both ways could use a lane each while the other side was repaired (think Kapiti Expressway fiasco). Public Private Partnership there led to some very cheap construction.

 

France is the same - good motorways, expensive tolls. I'd imagine here AKL to WGN would be about $75-100 on a tolled road (at 10 euros/100km, that'd be about right). Not that it would happen (in my lifetime anyway).

 

There are issues with that too - look at the bridge collapse in Italy - that was on a tolled road run by a private company. Maintenance is an issue. That road is/was pretty amazing - we drove it in May and from the border with France for about 200km, is is pretty much all bridges and tunnels, it never really runs on the ground.


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  # 2117272 31-Oct-2018 10:10
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We have approx 4 times as many trucks and 6 times as many cars on SH1 since 20 years ago, yet a lot of the road remains the same 2 lane nightmare. Imagine the road tax collected over the 20 years and I cannot help wondering just how much of it has actually been spent on new roads.

 

Cancelling the expressway from Otaki to Levin is a disgrace. All the contract type infrastructure and experience is already in place building the Otaki expressway and in addition all the land purchases have been completed.

 

What will be the cost in 5 years or so to restart this project from scratch. The last government funded this project in a way that they were only starting a new section when the previous section was complete. 

 

Any trucker knows that this road is a mess and it is a grave error to have stopped it. I can only assume that Kiwibuild for the wealthier of us is using this funding.


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  # 2117338 31-Oct-2018 12:23
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trig42:

 

Bung:
Geektastic:

 

I'd be happy to embrace tolling. If someone built a 4 lane, straight, modern 120kmh road with regular services between Chch and Auckland, and the toll was $50 each way I would pay that without complaint - toll roads are used all over the world to good effect. You could even consider outsourcing the whole thing to an international consortium on a Build/Own/Operate basis.

 



Good luck with $50 each way! The only long distance toll routes I've had experience with have been in Italy. In round terms 10 Euro per 100km. The non toll routes often had the centre divider down so both ways could use a lane each while the other side was repaired (think Kapiti Expressway fiasco). Public Private Partnership there led to some very cheap construction.

 

France is the same - good motorways, expensive tolls. I'd imagine here AKL to WGN would be about $75-100 on a tolled road (at 10 euros/100km, that'd be about right). Not that it would happen (in my lifetime anyway).

 

There are issues with that too - look at the bridge collapse in Italy - that was on a tolled road run by a private company. Maintenance is an issue. That road is/was pretty amazing - we drove it in May and from the border with France for about 200km, is is pretty much all bridges and tunnels, it never really runs on the ground.

 

 

Maybe correct in the toll charge, but to build a 4 lane highway, with a shoulder and centre barrier isn't going to fit in the current 'footprint' of the existing SH1 is it?

 

Therefore, the government is likely to have to negotiate with land holders to buy the land on top of the cost of building the new road. 

 

And why only do AKL-WGN? Why not the entire length of SH1 from Bluff to Cape Reinga? Maybe include a bridge over the cook strait while we're at it, and a tunnel under the strait too for when it's too windy to use the bridge :-)

 

 




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  # 2117374 31-Oct-2018 12:52
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Bluntj:

 

We have approx 4 times as many trucks and 6 times as many cars on SH1 since 20 years ago, yet a lot of the road remains the same 2 lane nightmare. Imagine the road tax collected over the 20 years and I cannot help wondering just how much of it has actually been spent on new roads.

 

Cancelling the expressway from Otaki to Levin is a disgrace. All the contract type infrastructure and experience is already in place building the Otaki expressway and in addition all the land purchases have been completed.

 

What will be the cost in 5 years or so to restart this project from scratch. The last government funded this project in a way that they were only starting a new section when the previous section was complete. 

 

Any trucker knows that this road is a mess and it is a grave error to have stopped it. I can only assume that Kiwibuild for the wealthier of us is using this funding.

 

 

Fully agree with you there. Labour's plan to replace the Otaki to Levin expressway with just a two lane road costing about $100 million, is false economy. I expect that the cost to go back and retro-actively make this four lanes in however many year's time will be greater than if it was done now.

 

Speaking of that lovely 1950's era piece of SH1 south of Levin, I pointed out the following fact in my thread about the closure of SH1 for 17 hours due to a truck crash at Labour weekend:

 

SH1 bridge

 

This miserable little bridge on our main highway is the only road crossing this stream in the north island. Check google maps and you'll see I'm right. All the successive governments who have done f. all to improve this situation should hang their heads in shame.


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