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  Reply # 1418246 1-Nov-2015 18:55
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mattwnz:
alasta: This is not correct - the Koreans have never used CVT transmissions because they are very unpopular in the European market. I'm pretty sure the facelifted i30 still has conventional torque convertor automatic, however Hyundai/Kia are gradually phasing in dual clutch transmissions.



Interesting, one review I saw said CVT, but the specs on it say CVVT, which looks to be different. Maybe the reviewer got confused over the specs.


Yes, I think CVVT refers to Continuous Variable Valve Timing. Easy to get the two confused!

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  Reply # 1418652 2-Nov-2015 11:07
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alasta:
Yes, I think CVVT refers to Continuous Variable Valve Timing. Easy to get the two confused!
This is true, I always assumed it was reference to the tranny 'til I looked into buying one a few years back.

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1418685 2-Nov-2015 11:55
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alasta:
mattwnz:
alasta: This is not correct - the Koreans have never used CVT transmissions because they are very unpopular in the European market. I'm pretty sure the facelifted i30 still has conventional torque convertor automatic, however Hyundai/Kia are gradually phasing in dual clutch transmissions.



Interesting, one review I saw said CVT, but the specs on it say CVVT, which looks to be different. Maybe the reviewer got confused over the specs.


Yes, I think CVVT refers to Continuous Variable Valve Timing. Easy to get the two confused!


Hyundai have made and used CVT.  I'm not sure if any made it to NZ new car sales.

DSG is more efficient than older conventional torque-converter "slushbox" autos - especially around town where conventional auto trans torque-converter made over the past couple of decades did have "lock-up" clutches (usually erroneously called "OD" - with a button to engage/disengage manually on the gearshift), but these only activated in top gear and low load conditions - yet cruising on the highway, they are efficient.  Now, conventional autos have more forward gears to improve efficiency, but also larger clutches in the torque converter which lock up in more (or all) forward gears. IMO there's no free lunch.  If the DSG on your skoda or ford craps out and your warranty has expired, it's serious $$ to fix, but if the 7 speed slushbox in your mazda skyactiv craps out, you'll probably be in the same boat.  If it's a 10YO vehicle and the transmission dies, cost to repair will likely exceed value of the car.

There's no free lunch. I dislike CVT's I've driven - and don't trust them for reliability long-term.  I doubt that the concept of the 10YO (or more) reliable cheap and simple to maintain car has much future left in it.  If you want cheap motoring, then new/small is becoming the only option, then ditch them before they cause trouble.

I wouldn't take much notice of the new car reliability surveys from US/Europe.  Niggles with new cars aren't uncommon - and they fix them for free.  More of an issue is what happens when they're 5 years old and you'll be paying to get them fixed.  Finding hard data on that longer-term reliability / repair cost is not so easy.  

BTR

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  Reply # 1418844 2-Nov-2015 14:24
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Does Kia mean Killed in Action?

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  Reply # 1419998 3-Nov-2015 16:27
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I own both a current model Kia Cerato SX 2L and a current model Kia Optima EX. I have to say I am completely satisfied with both cars having owned them both for over a year.

The Cerato SX 2L is a great little (very roomy for a hatch in fact) card has all the bells and whistles. My only wish is that the 2L engine was a little more peppy, but we only use it for around town and it does that job perfectly.

Do not underestimate Kia. Sure they used to be very budget, but now they have the ex Audi chief designer working for them, they have come a long way.

I would recommend giving the Cerato some more time.

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  Reply # 1420007 3-Nov-2015 16:37
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I test drove the i30.  It handled quite poorly, for modern car.  There were three power steering settings: average, bad and awful.




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  Reply # 1420034 3-Nov-2015 16:47
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The only Korean sourced vehicle I have owned is a Holden Captiva (Craptiva) it was awful. After many issues and finally a complete meltdown of the electrical system I handed it back to Holden and swapped out for a different vehicle.




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  Reply # 1420036 3-Nov-2015 16:51
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MikeB4: The only Korean sourced vehicle I have owned is a Holden Captiva (Craptiva) it was awful. After many issues and finally a complete meltdown of the electrical system I handed it back to Holden and swapped out for a different vehicle.


Hyundai and Kia vehicles are in a completely different league from the awful Daewoo cast-offs that GM are inflicting on our market.

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  Reply # 1420038 3-Nov-2015 16:53
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Hi, I have a 2014 Kia Rio 1.4L Turbo Diesel 6speed manual as a company car, and some of the plastics feel a little cheap, but generally quality of internal and external fit and finish is adequate. The motor/gearbox combo is exceptional, I do a lot of miles (done 60k in 18months) and other than being a little noisy on our course chip roads its a great long distance car due to that motor/box combo, and runs on the smell of an oily rag.

Sadly the car is let down by soft (US centric I presume) suspension and hyperactive electric steering, again I suspect tuned to a market thats not your common AU/NZ expectation.

Would I buy one myself, no, I like better handling and more spirit (my own car is a Alfa 147 2.0 TwinSpark manual) but its a great car for what I use it. As for reliability, its been faultless, the local agent (Brendon Foot) has been great, not that anything other than oil/filters has been required, set of rotors at next service I suspect.

Cyril 

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  Reply # 1420039 3-Nov-2015 16:55
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alasta:
MikeB4: The only Korean sourced vehicle I have owned is a Holden Captiva (Craptiva) it was awful. After many issues and finally a complete meltdown of the electrical system I handed it back to Holden and swapped out for a different vehicle.


Hyundai and Kia vehicles are in a completely different league from the awful Daewoo cast-offs that GM are inflicting on our market.


Agreed, that is why I don't buy Holden anymore after owning many many Holdens over the years.

I do like some of the designs of Kia and Hyundai I am just a little doubtful of reliability and many models are light on power and need to be pushed to get along
The ex VW designer had a good influence on their design. The Hyundai Genesis is very nice.




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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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  Reply # 1420081 3-Nov-2015 17:50
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nathan: don't buy a Pug, nothing but problems (I've owned 3 in my life and would only ever buy one if I didn't care about money)


Why would you buy one even if you didn't care about money? If you didn't care about money you could have an Audi, BMW or almost any other brand :) 


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  Reply # 1420083 3-Nov-2015 17:52
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MikeB4:I do like some of the designs of Kia and Hyundai I am just a little doubtful of reliability and many models are light on power and need to be pushed to get along


Yes, the main thing that put me off the Cerato was the fact that the top of the line variant has a lot less torque and higher fuel consumption compared with the best players in that segment but Hyundai/Kia have some new high compression petrol engines in the pipeline which will fix that. In my view the Cerato and the mechanically related i30 are slightly less mature products than the Focus/Golf/Mazda3, but there is nothing wrong with their quality and reliability. 

The ex VW designer had a good influence on their design. The Hyundai Genesis is very nice.


Yes, but it remains to be seen whether anyone will pay $100k for a Hyundai. 

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  Reply # 1420085 3-Nov-2015 17:55
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alasta:
MikeB4:I do like some of the designs of Kia and Hyundai I am just a little doubtful of reliability and many models are light on power and need to be pushed to get along


Yes, the main thing that put me off the Cerato was the fact that the top of the line variant has a lot less torque and higher fuel consumption compared with the best players in that segment but Hyundai/Kia have some new high compression petrol engines in the pipeline which will fix that. In my view the Cerato and the mechanically related i30 are slightly less mature products than the Focus/Golf/Mazda3, but there is nothing wrong with their quality and reliability. 

The ex VW designer had a good influence on their design. The Hyundai Genesis is very nice.


Yes, but it remains to be seen whether anyone will pay $100k for a Hyundai. 


Yeah it does not seem to offer much more than my Nissan,  I want to take one for a test drive




Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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  Reply # 1420103 3-Nov-2015 18:19
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alasta:

Yes, the main thing that put me off the Cerato was the fact that the top of the line variant has a lot less torque and higher fuel consumption compared with the best players in that segment but Hyundai/Kia have some new high compression petrol engines in the pipeline which will fix that. In my view the Cerato and the mechanically related i30 are slightly less mature products than the Focus/Golf/Mazda3, but there is nothing wrong with their quality and reliability. 



Just my opinion, despite similar (but different) high tech engine/transmission design, VW vs Ford, I'd avoid the Focus like the plague as a long-term ownership proposition. I hear of too many electronic faults and niggles, and shudder to think how they'll be after 5 years / 100,000km. I put them in the same (low) class as those awful GM Daewoo "Holdens". Fit and finish of Kia/Hyundai is superb for the price - even if they're not exciting cars, they're damned good/solid/reliable.  The Mazda skyactiv are also high tech, but normally aspirated high compression petrol rather than forced induction.  Whether that means lower cost over the long run, who knows. I doubt you'll see good running examples of any of them - like you can find old '90s corollas and pulsars etc. with +300,000km.  They will not last.

BTW - don't believe the fuel consumption figures or use them for direct comparison.  The European cars (incl Ford) use the totally ridiculous Euro test cycles.

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  Reply # 1420155 3-Nov-2015 19:54
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Fred99: Just my opinion, despite similar (but different) high tech engine/transmission design, VW vs Ford, I'd avoid the Focus like the plague as a long-term ownership proposition. I hear of too many electronic faults and niggles, and shudder to think how they'll be after 5 years / 100,000km. I put them in the same (low) class as those awful GM Daewoo "Holdens". Fit and finish of Kia/Hyundai is superb for the price - even if they're not exciting cars, they're damned good/solid/reliable.  The Mazda skyactiv are also high tech, but normally aspirated high compression petrol rather than forced induction.  Whether that means lower cost over the long run, who knows. I doubt you'll see good running examples of any of them - like you can find old '90s corollas and pulsars etc. with +300,000km.  They will not last.


Generally I agree with all of this - I certainly feel more confident owning a Japanese or Korean car. 

In recent history the total cost of ownership has decreased significantly for newer cars, and increased significantly for older cars so I imagine you're right in thinking that my Skyactiv Mazda will be uneconomic to keep operating beyond 10 years or 100,000km. Fortunately I only do 8,000km a year, rarely drive around town, and tend to replace my vehicles before the warranty runs out so I'm not too worried.

BTW - don't believe the fuel consumption figures or use them for direct comparison.  The European cars (incl Ford) use the totally ridiculous Euro test cycles.


I always understood that advertised fuel consumption figures were understated, but consistently so. That is, a car quoted at 6l/100km won't achieve that figure in reality, but it will use 25% less fuel than a car quoted at 8l/100km under normal driving conditions.

Is this not the case? 

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