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afe66
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  #1631695 16-Sep-2016 12:29
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It's got a very big battery..
The 12v charges off the main battery.

A.

 
 
 

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  #1631696 16-Sep-2016 12:31
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I wondered that - so why do they bother with the 12V battery? Surely they could just down-convert the main batteries to 12V to run the car accessories etc?


Linuxluver

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  #1631767 16-Sep-2016 13:53
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Willuknight:

 

Hey guys, looking at getting a leaf for my partner, I've done the math and she drives about 10,000k a year, based off that vs a Ford Ka (the other car she's interested in) it looks like she's $4,000 better off after running costs over 5 years.

 

Just wondering who are good to deal with in NZ for Leafs, I'd rather do a bit of legwork and save money than go through someone who has awesome customer service but fairly pricy cars (ie http://www.evimports.co.nz/)

 

Also my partner was wondering what the leafs are like in terms of replacement part prices and availability of people who can do repair work on them. Any feedback from you guys? 

 

 

Where are you? 

Murray and Fiona of "plugndriveman" seem to have good prices. he's based in south Auckland. 

 

You could also try David Lees of Volt Vehicles. 

If you're in the South Island, you can try "Electric Car Company" in Lincoln. Ken and Sarah Davidson. They import to order.....and don't tend to carry much stock.  

 

 

 

 





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Linuxluver

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  #1631769 16-Sep-2016 13:58
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SumnerBoy:

 

I wondered that - so why do they bother with the 12V battery? Surely they could just down-convert the main batteries to 12V to run the car accessories etc?

 



Looks like several reasons: 

- You need a separate battery for the brakes, power steering and lights etc so a flat traction battery results in a flatbed recovery and not a hospital visit. A good old lead acid battery means they can use the current off the shelf units.

 

- There are systems that need to run all the time, such as central locking and detecting when a charger cable is plugged in. These could be run by DC-DC conversion from the main pack, but converters are probably really inefficient when run at the very bottom end of their power range. The car could be using 5W for running bits and bobs, but 50W overhead in the converter! Better to just top-up a low voltage battery from time to time.

- Most EVs are based on or share parts with ICE cars. There is a huge economy of scale savings by sticking with existing 12-volt accessory systems.





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Linuxluver

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  #1631772 16-Sep-2016 14:00
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afe66: It's got a very big battery..
The 12v charges off the main battery.

A.

 

The 12v can also charge from the solar panel that some LEAFs have on the rear spoiler-thingy above the window.  





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Linuxluver

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  #1631774 16-Sep-2016 14:01
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SumnerBoy:

 

Linuxluver:
Maybe you could post a couple of screen shots. I'll post a couple of my own now. 

 

 

I ended up getting the Pro version, here is a screenshot from last night when I first installed it;

 

 

I will have to find some time to try out your range test. Where is live is not well suited as I am not near any highways, but there are quite a few hills around so maybe I could burn some juice zipping around them for an hour or so.

 

Appreciate your feedback!

 

 

Have you set the year / model in the LeafSpy settings? You've got a new car there....the number of charges is trivial and the kms are very low. the battery looks good to me. You can alter the scale by tapping on the left scale so the visual variation isn't as great. Those numbers all look fine, though battery is cold. You haven't charged it or driven the car in the past few hours.......?? 





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MikeB4
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  #1631782 16-Sep-2016 14:12
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I have never driven an electric car, what is hill descent like? do the brakes need to get a heavy work out?

 

I need to test drive one of these machines.




afe66
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  #1631793 16-Sep-2016 14:28
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When I drive down hill without my foot on accelerator there is a slight "engine braking" effect which regenerates the main battery.

If I press more heavily on brake you get more regeneration effect slowing the car until it's max regeneration and the disk brakes kick in.

If I suddenly brake you get max regeneration and disk brakes - stops like normal car.

I have basic leaf with eco mode, higher spec versions have more aggressive regeneration eco b mode which I saw someone say mentioned they hardly use brake, just take foot off accelerator.

Ultimately these cars just drive like normal car with a lot of torc.

A.

MikeB4
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  #1631804 16-Sep-2016 14:40
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afe66: When I drive down hill without my foot on accelerator there is a slight "engine braking" effect which regenerates the main battery.

If I press more heavily on brake you get more regeneration effect slowing the car until it's max regeneration and the disk brakes kick in.

If I suddenly brake you get max regeneration and disk brakes - stops like normal car.

I have basic leaf with eco mode, higher spec versions have more aggressive regeneration eco b mode which I saw someone say mentioned they hardly use brake, just take foot off accelerator.

Ultimately these cars just drive like normal car with a lot of torc.

A.

 

 

 

Did it take long to get used to and was it spooky at first? It was also be a pleasure driving in relative quiet. It's nice when the wife's car turns of at the lights etc and we can talk with ease.

 

I often think how much the cities will be when our fleet is electric.


Willuknight
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  #1631832 16-Sep-2016 15:52
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Linuxluver:

 

Willuknight:

 

 

 

...

 

Where are you? 

Murray and Fiona of "plugndriveman" seem to have good prices. he's based in south Auckland. 

 

You could also try David Lees of Volt Vehicles. 

If you're in the South Island, you can try "Electric Car Company" in Lincoln. Ken and Sarah Davidson. They import to order.....and don't tend to carry much stock.  

 

 

 

Hey LL, thanks for the recommendations.

 

We're in Christchurch, but i've been looking on trademe for anywhere because I don't mind flying up to drive something down. I'll check out both of the places you mentioned. There's a dealership that has a 2012 model in Chirstchurch, so going to try and take that for a test drive tomorrow, neither of us have ridden in a leaf before. We're pretty much only looking at 2011 or 2012 models because of the cost difference to 2013+.

 

 

 

 


afe66
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  #1631849 16-Sep-2016 17:06
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MikeB4:

afe66: When I drive down hill without my foot on accelerator there is a slight "engine braking" effect which regenerates the main battery.

If I press more heavily on brake you get more regeneration effect slowing the car until it's max regeneration and the disk brakes kick in.

If I suddenly brake you get max regeneration and disk brakes - stops like normal car.

I have basic leaf with eco mode, higher spec versions have more aggressive regeneration eco b mode which I saw someone say mentioned they hardly use brake, just take foot off accelerator.

Ultimately these cars just drive like normal car with a lot of torc.

A.


 


Did it take long to get used to and was it spooky at first? It was also be a pleasure driving in relative quiet. It's nice when the wife's car turns of at the lights etc and we can talk with ease.


I often think how much the cities will be when our fleet is electric.



I enjoy driving my leaf. Better driving position than my Ford focus. Certainly more powerful.

The quiet driving is strangely relaxing and very smooth. Had it a couple of months and still drive it with a smile.

A.

Linuxluver

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  #1631851 16-Sep-2016 17:12
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MikeB4:

 

I have never driven an electric car, what is hill descent like? do the brakes need to get a heavy work out?

 

I need to test drive one of these machines.

 



 

If you're in Auckland, let me know and we can go for a drive. :-)  





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Linuxluver

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  #1631852 16-Sep-2016 17:15
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Willuknight:

 

 

 

Hey LL, thanks for the recommendations.

 

We're in Christchurch, but i've been looking on trademe for anywhere because I don't mind flying up to drive something down. I'll check out both of the places you mentioned. There's a dealership that has a 2012 model in Chirstchurch, so going to try and take that for a test drive tomorrow, neither of us have ridden in a leaf before. We're pretty much only looking at 2011 or 2012 models because of the cost difference to 2013+.

 

 

You're welcome.....but I would strongly recommend not buying a 2011-12 model unless you never want to drive it more than perhaps 80km. The batteries on those "Gen 1" models are fading fast. Most have lost one bar (ie: battery can now only charge to less than 85% of original capacity - and loses another bar for each 6%-7% further reduction) and many have lost two or even three. Three bars down is a LEAF with a range of about 80km. Their original range was a nominal 120km.

It's worth every penny to go straight to a Gen 2. There are Gen 2 LEAFs with over 160,000km and all 12 bars. Most haven't been driven that much yet. I don't yet know of any Gen 2 LEAFs that don't have all 12 bars. The nominal range of a Gen 2 LEAF is 170km....and that's achievable in mainly city driving. On the highway, wind resistance will drop that closer to 140km-150km if you do a steady 100kph on flat terrain. A strong headwind can drop it lower still if you don't slow down. 

Adding another thought: the Gen 1 LEAF is every bit as much fun to drive as the Gen 2. It's essentially the same car. If you're happy with the reduced (and reducing) range, it can be awesome. Fingers crossed new battery packs will be available from either Nissan or a 3rd-party at some point. That's all these would need to be completely revived. But that option isn't there right now. 





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Willuknight
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  #1631885 16-Sep-2016 17:59
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Linuxluver:

 

Willuknight:

 

 

 

Hey LL, thanks for the recommendations.

 

We're in Christchurch, but i've been looking on trademe for anywhere because I don't mind flying up to drive something down. I'll check out both of the places you mentioned. There's a dealership that has a 2012 model in Chirstchurch, so going to try and take that for a test drive tomorrow, neither of us have ridden in a leaf before. We're pretty much only looking at 2011 or 2012 models because of the cost difference to 2013+.

 

 

You're welcome.....but I would strongly recommend not buying a 2011-12 model unless you never want to drive it more than perhaps 80km. The batteries on those "Gen 1" models are fading fast. Most have lost one bar (ie: battery can now only charge to less than 85% of original capacity - and loses another bar for each 6%-7% further reduction) and many have lost two or even three. Three bars down is a LEAF with a range of about 80km. Their original range was a nominal 120km.

It's worth every penny to go straight to a Gen 2. There are Gen 2 LEAFs with over 160,000km and all 12 bars. Most haven't been driven that much yet. I don't yet know of any Gen 2 LEAFs that don't have all 12 bars. The nominal range of a Gen 2 LEAF is 170km....and that's achievable in mainly city driving. On the highway, wind resistance will drop that closer to 140km-150km if you do a steady 100kph on flat terrain. A strong headwind can drop it lower still if you don't slow down. 

Adding another thought: the Gen 1 LEAF is every bit as much fun to drive as the Gen 2. It's essentially the same car. If you're happy with the reduced (and reducing) range, it can be awesome. Fingers crossed new battery packs will be available from either Nissan or a 3rd-party at some point. That's all these would need to be completely revived. But that option isn't there right now. 

 



At the moment her daily commute is 30k a day, and that's with living 15km out of town. Ideally next year she would be living closer to town so that would be even less, so 80km doesn't sound too terrible. I'd love to get a Gen 2, but I'm already talking her up from a $2,000 car to a $16,000 car by pointing out that it's going to cost her about $25k over 5years in running costs - at least with a leaf the money is in the car not the running costs and that includes buying a new battery pack ($6k?) in 3 years. It seems like I can't rely on that battery pack being gauranteed to be there, but it should be achievable right? 


Dingbatt
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  #1631895 16-Sep-2016 18:30
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There aren't any road user charges on EVs at the moment but it may be wise to consider that they may be imposed in the future if you are looking for a payback period. My fervent wish is that the government doesn't impose them thereby doing something at least to encourage the EV uptake.
Try and factor the smooth quiet ride quality as part of the payback, and even that you get to park by the door at the mall along with the young mums.
I only took the Leaf for a modest length test drive but was impressed with it as a city commuter.




“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996


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