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gzt

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  # 1750345 29-Mar-2017 19:44
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The recent weather causes me to ask this one:

What is consumption like at motorway crawling speed? For example 10km of straight motorway driving vs 10km of the worst stop start slow crawl imaginable?

Does this ratio vary depending on model?


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  # 1750356 29-Mar-2017 20:31
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Does anyone know if you can tell if a Leaf is about to loose a bar? E.g. I'd imagine that fully charged the dash might say 150km (for example), but before losing a bar it might only say 140km.

Edit: I want to know if I can simply look at the number of battery bars left and the remaining range and tell if the battery is good or bad. E.g I might see a Leaf with full 12 battery-life bars, but the current charge is 10 bars and the range is 106km. Does that say anything about the quality of the battery?

 
 
 
 


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  # 1750440 29-Mar-2017 23:33
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pogo: Does anyone know if you can tell if a Leaf is about to loose a bar? E.g. I'd imagine that fully charged the dash might say 150km (for example), but before losing a bar it might only say 140km.

Edit: I want to know if I can simply look at the number of battery bars left and the remaining range and tell if the battery is good or bad. E.g I might see a Leaf with full 12 battery-life bars, but the current charge is 10 bars and the range is 106km. Does that say anything about the quality of the battery?


You need to plug a bluetooth adapter (pritty cheap) into the OBD II port, and use a tool called leaf spy on your phone. One of the values it gives you is SOH or state of heath percentage. How it works is somewhat crude, but generally good enough to access the condition of a leaf battery pack.

Leaf range KM remaining varies dramatically depending on how the car has recently been driven. Don't read anything into the number regarding battery health.


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  # 1750466 30-Mar-2017 07:45
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@Scott3 Cheers, I've ordered the adapter. Any resources on how to interpret the battery info, or what to expect given a car's age & milage?

Banana?
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  # 1750491 30-Mar-2017 08:50
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gzt: The recent weather causes me to ask this one:

What is consumption like at motorway crawling speed? For example 10km of straight motorway driving vs 10km of the worst stop start slow crawl imaginable?

Does this ratio vary depending on model?

 

Was answered a couple of pages back (or maybe in another thread?).

 

Basically, it really only uses power when moving (little bit of overhead for accessories etc, AC uses a bit etc.)

 

Because the power usage is pretty linear (no gears, so electric power scales with speed), if you are crawling, your batteries aren't being hammered.

 

I'd say 10 km at 100kph would use a little bit less battery then 10km stop start, but I don't think it would be massively different. At 100kmh, wind resistance would be not insignificant, stop-start, getting moving (inertia) would be the major user of power.

 

Be interesting to get a comparison actually.


gzt

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  # 1750623 30-Mar-2017 11:13
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Yep stop/start inertia would be the one. More so stuck on an uphill grade. It would help to know the safe margin to get home in case of unexpected traffic conditions. Typical Auckland issues : ).

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  # 1751125 31-Mar-2017 13:01
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Anyone know how good the Bose audio is over the standard audio? I've seen maybe one or two of these Leafs available on TradeMe, wondering if it's worth much of a premium over the normal models.

 

And I suppose they way that they're identified is the Bose unit in the boot?


 
 
 
 


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  # 1752607 1-Apr-2017 12:32
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2014 Nissan Leaf X, SOH=88%, QCs=1546, L1/L2s=195, ~26,000km.

Thoughts?

Circumspice
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  # 1752628 1-Apr-2017 13:25
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pogo: 2014 Nissan Leaf X, SOH=88%, QCs=1546, L1/L2s=195, ~26,000km.

Thoughts?

 

 

 

A bit of caveat emptor in form of anecdote: my ex-Jap 2013 Leaf G, which had a similar ratio of QC to non-QC charging events (and ~30,000km)when I bought it 6 months ago to the Leaf X, lost top 2 bars in last 2 months and now SOH 77%. Maybe coincidence, but I haven't done any QCing in last 2 months (no need as only drive <20km most days). This rate of battery deterioration is greater than expected given when new Nissan would've had 10y SOH=70% guarantee, so maybe just bad luck.


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  # 1752673 1-Apr-2017 14:16
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@paulchinnz I've heard the batteries degrade much faster in the heat, and it was just summer. Have you parked in a hot place like in the sun or a closed hot garage?

Circumspice
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  # 1752677 1-Apr-2017 14:29
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pogo: @paulchinnz I've heard the batteries degrade much faster in the heat, and it was just summer. Have you parked in a hot place like in the sun or a closed hot garage?


Good thought. From 2013 the leaf batteries are meant to be more resistant to this. Further, the reports of heat causing rapid leaf battery deterioration were typically from places like Arizona, which makes my 30C garage during summer seem mild.

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  # 1752682 1-Apr-2017 14:55
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Regarding the Bose audio, yeah, there will be a subwoofer located on the floor, front side of the boot. I can't comment on it's performance sorry.

 



pogo: 2014 Nissan Leaf X, SOH=88%, QCs=1546, L1/L2s=195, ~26,000km.

Thoughts?


Again I'm probiably not the best person to answer this, I don't have a leaf, and have never used leafspy. It would be ideal if somebody plotted a chart for typical State of health values (against both Age and Odometer, so we should see what typical is).

Note that the first "bar" drops at SHO = 85%, and each subsequent bar every 6.26 % after that. As such the car you tested is only 3 percentage points away from dropping its first bar.

I have no evidence, but would guess that this result is somewhat poor for a 2014, 26000km, gen2 leaf.

 

Other result of significance is the large QC's count (This refers to high powered DC quick charges (typically 50kW)) as compared to low L1/L2's count (refers to normal AC charging (typically 2- 3.6kW) - Up to 6.6kW on some ex UK cars)). It appears the previous owner used DC charging as the primary means of charging the pack.

Generally quick charging is tough on the battery pack, particually in warm weather. Essentially the quick charging combined with high pack temperature leads to accelerated pack degrasion.

Nissan choice to use an atmospheric temperature air-cooled pack in the leaf contributes to this. Other vehicles have better cooling systems:

 

  • Chilled air (essentially feeding air-conditioned air into an air cooled pack): Imiev, Nissan E-NV200
  • Liquid cooled: Smart Electric drive, Tesla's, Holden Volt, Audi A3 e-tron.
  • Refrigeration cooled: BMW i3 & Mercedes S400 Bluehybrid.

 

 

If you want more people thoughts on the leaf spy report, sign up to the NZ EV owners facebook page, and post the full leafspy screenshot (incl graph of cell levels).


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Master Geek


  # 1752703 1-Apr-2017 15:20
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As someone pointed out in another forum, it seems that the Leaf Spy reading is rather suspicious . There's a lot of missing info and the number of quick charges is very large for the number of kms (one charge per ~16kms??).

 

Anyone experienced bad output from Leaf Spy?




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  # 1752790 1-Apr-2017 16:58
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gzt: The recent weather causes me to ask this one:

What is consumption like at motorway crawling speed? For example 10km of straight motorway driving vs 10km of the worst stop start slow crawl imaginable?

Does this ratio vary depending on model?

 

The simple formula is: the slower you go, the further you go. If you're stop / start-ing it means you're too close to the car in front. Don't do that. I' lag back and let a gap of 50m (or more) open up. If other people want to move into it.....fine. The usual reason for stop / start is people tailgating across on-ramp merges......so people have to literally stop to let others in.

 

You could see it as a collective IQ test and most drivers #FAIL with flying colours.

If you let the big gap open up....then when the cars in front of you stop (because they think closer means faster when it REALLY means slower) then you get to coast gently and eat up your gap......and just as you get to the car in front, 4 time out of 5, they will begin moving again. Meanwhile......the people behind you never have to actually stop....they just maintain a steady, slow speed.

 

Smoking and tailgating are two important signs that there's very little intelligent life on Earth.  

So.....there you are, gently coasting, using virtually no battery. 

Plus....when you do lift your foot off the accelerator or apply the brake you are actually MAKING power. Your range at 10kph will be more than double what it is a 100kph. Trust me......done it many times.

Uphill? Going up the hill slowly is going to use a lot less power than going up the hill fast. Seriously. For real. It's true.

Ratios will vary according to vehicle weight and engine power consumption and rolling resistance of the tyres and levels of regen (LEAF has 3, Hyundai Ioniq also has at least 3)....and many factors.  

Plus your driving style. If you think being closer to the car in front means you're going faster.....well....there are a lot things in this world that won't make sense to you. :-)  

EVs *love* rush hour. Going slow means going a lot further.....even up hill. 





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My Tesla referral code: https://ts.la/steve52356




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  # 1752793 1-Apr-2017 17:05
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pogo: Does anyone know if you can tell if a Leaf is about to loose a bar? E.g. I'd imagine that fully charged the dash might say 150km (for example), but before losing a bar it might only say 140km.

Edit: I want to know if I can simply look at the number of battery bars left and the remaining range and tell if the battery is good or bad. E.g I might see a Leaf with full 12 battery-life bars, but the current charge is 10 bars and the range is 106km. Does that say anything about the quality of the battery?

 

The GOM indicates estimated range based on the recent driving style or road conditions that affected energy usage. 

A couple of weeks ago I drove from Matawai downhill about 760m to Opitiki at seal level. It was regen heaven. I used 12.5kWh to get up there....and only 8.7kWh to get back down again....the same 74km.

 

My LEAF's GOM the next day thought a full charge should see me do 240km no problem.....unfortunately, not all roads are downhill. :-)

So even you fill the car up, the estimated range isn't a reliable indictor of battery state.  Certainly not reliable enough to assess the difference between a 100% SoH (State of Health) battery and an 85% SoH battery that's about to drop its first bar. 





____________________________________________________
If you order a Tesla, use my referral code to get free stuff. 

 

My Tesla referral code: https://ts.la/steve52356


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