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Scott3
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  #2542977 17-Aug-2020 15:56
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Obraik:

 

The R1T starting price isn't set yet. Since the Cybertruck was announced, Rivian has said that the R1T will now have a lower starting price but haven't said what that will be. At a guess, it will most likely to something competitive with the Cybertruck.

 

I do think the R1T would fit better with New Zealand than the Cybertruck. I'm curious what Tesla will do with their future "Euro friendly" ute.

 

 

Still showing "Starting at $69,000*" on https://rivian.com/r1t

 

No reference to the * on the page.

 

 

 

Regarding NZ. If the GVM comes in over 3500kg that will be a dealbreaker for the cybertruck for many. Who wants to spend $80k+ on a vehicle that can do 0-60MPH in 6.5sec or less, only to have a stream of Nissan Urvan's & Daihatsu Siron's flowing pest them when on 110km/h roads.

 

Possibility there will be some lobbing done in NZ to have the GVM limit for light vehicles increased by say 500kg. The base electric (FWD) variant of the Kona is 245kg heavier than the base 2.0L petrol FWD, and large vehicles will need roughly double the amount of batteries, hence 500kg...

 

any heavier vehicles (everything from High spec ford rangers, to the nissan Patrol, to land-cruiser 200's, to the Hiace ZX van are allready close to the 3500kg limit. Basically these vehicles will be extremely unattractive in electric trim without a law change, yet, they have some of the highest fuel consumption, so would be the best for the environment to electrify. 

 

 

 

At 3470kg GVM of R1T just squeezes in under the limit (although they had to put an abnormally low payload (for a ute) of 800kg to do that.


Obraik
785 posts

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  #2543139 17-Aug-2020 18:29
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Yeah I think the "we'll have a lower price" stance they're putting out in interviews isn't official yet. It seems like they have until late next year to sort that out now. So there's the benefit of battery tech getting cheaper naturally all the time to allow a lower price as well.

 

And no, I don't think any ute driver is going to be happy with a 90km/h limit. Most of them aren't happy with a 100km/h limit 🙃


 
 
 
 


afe66
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  #2543154 17-Aug-2020 18:55
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I'd support higher weight for electric vehicles but not for petrol/diesel in that it would just increase the size of huge inefficient engines..

tripper1000
1248 posts

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  #2543795 18-Aug-2020 15:57
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You are allowed to drive a camper up to 6,000kg on a car license. LINK so it isn't without precedence.

 

I think a higher weight limit on commercial electric vehicles would be a higher priority. The trucking industry is extremely sensitive to vehicle weight because the heavier the vehicle, the less pay load, the less pay. This is going to put EV trucks at an immediate disadvantage.


wellygary
4998 posts

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  #2543810 18-Aug-2020 16:09
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tripper1000:

 

You are allowed to drive a camper up to 6,000kg on a car license. LINK so it isn't without precedence.

 

I think a higher weight limit on commercial electric vehicles would be a higher priority. The trucking industry is extremely sensitive to vehicle weight because the heavier the vehicle, the less pay load, the less pay. This is going to put EV trucks at an immediate disadvantage.

 

 

What you can drive on a car license is not really the issue, you can rent one of these with a regular licence..

 

The issue is that it needs a COF and much higher cost of ownership than something under 3.5 tonne, Which will kill the market for big heavy EV utes 

 


Obraik
785 posts

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  #2543813 18-Aug-2020 16:22
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The other problem with getting above 3500kg is as @scott3 points out, you are limited to a 90km/h speed limit


Scott3
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  #2543823 18-Aug-2020 16:51
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wellygary:

 

tripper1000:

 

You are allowed to drive a camper up to 6,000kg on a car license. LINK so it isn't without precedence.

 

I think a higher weight limit on commercial electric vehicles would be a higher priority. The trucking industry is extremely sensitive to vehicle weight because the heavier the vehicle, the less pay load, the less pay. This is going to put EV trucks at an immediate disadvantage.

 

 

What you can drive on a car license is not really the issue, you can rent one of these with a regular licence..

 

The issue is that it needs a COF and much higher cost of ownership than something under 3.5 tonne, Which will kill the market for big heavy EV utes 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, the 6000kg on a class 1 licence is not unique to campervan's.

https://www.nzta.govt.nz/driver-licences/getting-a-licence/licences-by-vehicle-type/what-you-can-drive/

That said, my understanding the rental camper-van industry was pritty instrumentalist in lobbing the increase from 4500kg several years ago, along with allowing people with licences from countries with a 3,500kg limit (much of Europe) to drive heavier vehicles here on that licence.

The COF thing doesn't really matter to the rental industry as they have to have them on all vehicles anyway. Plus the reduced speed limit (which only applies to larger campervans over 3500kg GVM - last 4 berth camper I rented came in under that) isn't really much of a concern for the renters of very large (typically 6 berth) camper vans.

 

 

 

But for private buyers a vehicle on a WOF is way more attractive than one on a COF, particually for the lifestyle market. Inspections are more frequent, strict and costly, and things like tow-bars need engineers certification plates... Plus the reduced speed limit is unattractive to the lifestyle market (excluding those who's main use will be as a tow rig as they already get that limit).

 

For people that do tow heavy stuff, the weight of the cybertruck will cut into the total combination limit of 6000kg on a class 1 licence. If the cyber truck has a 4500kg GVM, thats only 1500kg left for the trailer before crossing the threshold. A ranger can tow the light trailer limit (3500kg) and stay under the 6000kg limit (but the ute needs to be basically empty to do so). I don't think this is too much of a big deal, class 2 licence is easy to get for those who do a lot of heavy towing. Landcruiser 70's and 200's have a GCM of 7000kg (I think) and still remain popular tow vehicles.

 

Lastly once over 3500kg GVM, heavy vehicle laws kick in, which means that there are harsh personalities for overloading (incl axle limits, GVM, GCM etc). I imagine most will be OK with the ample payload, but it is something that needs to be taken seriously given in the heavy vehicle world.


 
 
 
 


Scott3
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  #2543828 18-Aug-2020 16:56
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Obraik:

 

The other problem with getting above 3500kg is as @scott3 points out, you are limited to a 90km/h speed limit

 



 

Imagine paying $140k for a the tri motor cybertruck that can do 0-97 in 2.9sec, and having a stream of old hatchbacks and van's passing you on the Tauranga eastern link...


wellygary
4998 posts

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  #2543843 18-Aug-2020 17:24
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Scott3:

 

Obraik:

 

The other problem with getting above 3500kg is as @scott3 points out, you are limited to a 90km/h speed limit

 

 

Imagine paying $140k for a the tri motor cybertruck that can do 0-97 in 2.9sec, and having a stream of old hatchbacks and van's passing you on the Tauranga eastern link...

 

 

They wouldn't just be passing either, with a 20km/h speed differential they would practically be flying past....


kingdragonfly
5102 posts

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  #2543900 18-Aug-2020 19:04
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At 7:00, starts talking about EV

At 10:00, starts talking about Tesla model 3

Sandy Munro: "Tesla Lies"?

Now You Know | In Depth


kingdragonfly
5102 posts

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  #2548266 23-Aug-2020 16:58
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Another case for EV's

Clean Technica: Porsche Announces It’s Investigating Suspected Gas Engine Manipulation — How Bad Could It Be?

Here we go again. Porsche just announced that it’s launching an internal investigation into suspected engine manipulation, according to Bild am Sonntag (BamS). It has informed KBA, Germany’s automotive watchdog, the Stuttgart prosecutor’s office, and authorities here in the US of the matter.

The suspected illegal changes to hardware and software could affect exhaust systems and engine components. In other words, we may have an almost-Dieselgate on our hands. I say “almost” because Porsche is actively investigating it and seems to be trying to stop it from further affecting its customers and our environment.

...Porsche, which is a part of the Volkswagen Group family, has been conducting this investigation since June. The illegal changes were said to have been made in series production after approval by the Federal Motor Transport Authority (KBA.) Employees are also being asked for meeting minutes and discussions along with those hundreds of thousands of emails just mentioned. A senior Porsche manager told BamS that, “We turn every stone and follow up every clue. If suspicions are confirmed, we act consistently in all matters.” One thing BamS emphasized is that it’s more than just exhaust systems being affected. Engine components are also.

...It always seems like there’s another new diesel scandal or “event” when it comes to these automakers. This is just another example of how important and necessary it is to switch to clean vehicles. The Volkswagen scandal is a great example of just how bad these things can go when they go wrong. In 2015, The Guardian conducted an analysis that found that the 482,000 recalled Volkswagen and Audi vehicles here in the US would have released a range of 10,392 and 41,571 tonnes of toxic gas into the air each year if they’d covered the average annual US mileage. Volkswagen, The Guardian noted, is possibly responsible for at least 1 million tonnes of air pollution every year, which is the same as the UK’s combined emissions for all of its power stations, vehicles, industry, and agriculture.
...

kingdragonfly
5102 posts

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  #2548480 24-Aug-2020 08:01
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This 2015 Toyota Aqua Hybrid car from GVI electric seems too good to be true.

It's a 2015 claiming to have only 3,900 KMs.

It mentions a "facelift" so I'm not sure what this is.
Hybrid Vehicles are the future Dont miss out on this lovely, money saving machine at an incredible price As new condition traveled super low 3,900kms with AA Certified Mileage -

2015 Toyota Aqua Hybrid / Prius C Hybrid
1500cc Petrol / Electric Automatic

+ Includes our 12 Month Hybrid Battery Warranty +

Toyota Hybrid Loaded with Options check this out
* Factory Rear Spoiler
* ECO / 100% EV Modes
* Full Monsoons
* Brand New Alloy Wheels
* Toyota Aqua Silver

** Chain driven engine so NO CAMBELT to change **

Very Tidy Travelled only 3,900 Kms with AA Certified Mileage and AA Pre Purchase Appraisal

old3eyes
8475 posts

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  #2548555 24-Aug-2020 10:38
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kingdragonfly: This 2015 Toyota Aqua Hybrid car from GVI electric seems too good to be true.

It's a 2015 claiming to have only 3,900 KMs.

It mentions a "facelift" so I'm not sure what this is.
Hybrid Vehicles are the future Dont miss out on this lovely, money saving machine at an incredible price As new condition traveled super low 3,900kms with AA Certified Mileage -

2015 Toyota Aqua Hybrid / Prius C Hybrid
1500cc Petrol / Electric Automatic

+ Includes our 12 Month Hybrid Battery Warranty +

Toyota Hybrid Loaded with Options check this out
* Factory Rear Spoiler
* ECO / 100% EV Modes
* Full Monsoons
* Brand New Alloy Wheels
* Toyota Aqua Silver

** Chain driven engine so NO CAMBELT to change **

Very Tidy Travelled only 3,900 Kms with AA Certified Mileage and AA Pre Purchase Appraisal

 

For a 5 year old car the mileage does seem rather low. 





Regards,

Old3eyes


Obraik
785 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2548567 24-Aug-2020 11:03
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It's not even a PHEV though, just a traditional hybrid. You can get a decent Leaf for around that same price. The km's won't be as low but with an EV that doesn't matter as much as long as the battery SoH is good.


Dugimodo
162 posts

Master Geek


  #2548702 24-Aug-2020 13:20
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The low kms is unusual but the price isn't, there are a lot of Prius and Aqua vehicles around that price. I know because I've been looking to replace my leaf with one.

 

The Leaf is great around town but it does have some limitations. In terms of capabilities the Aqua can do everything a leaf can but the reverse is not true.

 

 

 

Sure the leaf has lower running costs and may be better for the environment (still under debate due to the lack of affordable battery replacements) but I think it's only fair to be realistic about it's capabilities.

 

For me for example I have 2 cars so I can do everything I want to because as much as I like my leaf it can't so I'm looking to replace both cars with a single hybrid.


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