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frankv
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  #3119300 23-Aug-2023 11:02
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Technofreak:

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1SEfwoqKRU8&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pprune.org%2F&source_ve_path=MA&feature=emb_rel_end

 

The statement of "China, the land of short cuts and facades" about sums it up.

 

 

Tried to watch the video, but gave up... ads embedded in it, ads inserted into it, a whole lot of peripheral puff to extend the length so more ads could be inserted.

 

What's the reason that all those cars are parked there?

 

 


 
 
 

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Technofreak
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  #3119310 23-Aug-2023 11:28
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frankv:

 

Tried to watch the video, but gave up... ads embedded in it, ads inserted into it, a whole lot of peripheral puff to extend the length so more ads could be inserted.

 

What's the reason that all those cars are parked there?

 

 

 

 

Hmmm, was only one long add when I watched it. It's worth perservering with to watch

 

Here's a different link

 

https://youtu.be/1SEfwoqKRU8?si=LdMsG98zl38-9ZFj

 

The cars are surplus. Made and registered so as manufacturers could receive incentives/subsidies. Also from these "sales" or registrations China could also claim it was leading the world in EV uptake and thus doing it's bit for climate change.





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HarmLessSolutions
617 posts

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  #3119331 23-Aug-2023 12:19
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frankv:

 

Technofreak:

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1SEfwoqKRU8&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pprune.org%2F&source_ve_path=MA&feature=emb_rel_end

 

The statement of "China, the land of short cuts and facades" about sums it up.

 

 

Tried to watch the video, but gave up... ads embedded in it, ads inserted into it, a whole lot of peripheral puff to extend the length so more ads could be inserted.

 

What's the reason that all those cars are parked there?

 

 

 

'serpentza' who's presenting the video seems to be primarily on a one man campaign against China. In another of his videos he can't even accurately identify the EVs he's criticising. I don't put too much creedence in his rantings.





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Azzura
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  #3119333 23-Aug-2023 12:21
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Major New Zealand bank offering interest-free loans for electric vehicles

 

 

 

A major New Zealand bank is offering interest-free loans for up to five years to help Kiwis buy electric vehicles. 

 

Westpac announced the new loans on Tuesday as part of its "sustainable lending programme".

 

It's available to anyone with a Westpac home loan who meets lending and affordability criteria.


richms
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  #3119337 23-Aug-2023 12:38
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Azzura:

 

Major New Zealand bank offering interest-free loans for electric vehicles

 

 

 

A major New Zealand bank is offering interest-free loans for up to five years to help Kiwis buy electric vehicles. 

 

Westpac announced the new loans on Tuesday as part of its "sustainable lending programme".

 

It's available to anyone with a Westpac home loan who meets lending and affordability criteria.

 

 

That kind of makes getting one and paying it off over 5 years from the fuel savings a bit of a no brainer if you qualify for it.





Richard rich.ms

jonathan18
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  #3119338 23-Aug-2023 12:40
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That would be mighty tempting if I was with Westpac as we're buying an EV at the moment; having a zero percent loan and keeping the cash in the bank sounds great! My current bank (Kiwibank) doesn't even offer a reduced rate deal for EV purchases, just a sustainable energy loan.


Technofreak
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  #3119346 23-Aug-2023 12:58
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HarmLessSolutions:

 

'serpentza' who's presenting the video seems to be primarily on a one man campaign against China. In another of his videos he can't even accurately identify the EVs he's criticising. I don't put too much creedence in his rantings.

 

 

He may well be on a rant against China. That doesn't change the fact that there are 1000's of Chinese made EVs going to waste in fields in China. There are plenty of other reports about this.





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HarmLessSolutions
617 posts

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  #3119347 23-Aug-2023 13:02
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Technofreak:

 

HarmLessSolutions:

 

'serpentza' who's presenting the video seems to be primarily on a one man campaign against China. In another of his videos he can't even accurately identify the EVs he's criticising. I don't put too much creedence in his rantings.

 

 

He may well be on a rant against China. That doesn't change the fact that there are 1000's of Chinese made EVs going to waste in fields in China. There are plenty of other reports about this.

 

Having spent time in China myself I can say that a few thousand cars anywhere there isn't a scale that is surprising. The scale of everything that goes on there is enormous. serpentza is just a South African (now living in the US) with a bee in his bonnet about the CCP and China in general.





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Hammerer
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  #3120574 26-Aug-2023 12:56
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frankv:

 

Lithium battery fires are not self-sustaining. They can be put out by excluding air from them. My understanding is that they reignite when the fuel is re-exposed to air.

 

Can you please supply an actual link to an actual explanation of how oxygen molecules are created in a lithium battery?

 

 

You keep asserting that air is needed. When I search for “lithium ion battery fire” and do a cursory scan of those webpages then I find a lot of evidence that air is not required and nor do the fires stop when starving them of air, e.g. as on the car carrier fire.

 

Lithium ion battery “fires” are normally thermal runaways, chemical fires resulting from exothermic chemical reactions and also called chemical explosions, which are self-sustaining and do not require oxygen to burn. The release of oxygen just makes this worse. They cannot usually be put out by preventing exposure to air.

 

If you read the Wikipedia article then that is a good starting point. It mentions in at least two places that degradation and damage of the batteries can release oxygen from chemical reactions at the cathodes, eg LiCoO2 and LiMn2O4, and that heat is produced at the same time at the anode which can then create the conditions for a thermal runaway.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_battery#Lifespan

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_battery#Safety

 

 


MarkH67
510 posts

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  #3120590 26-Aug-2023 14:31
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Hammerer:

 

You keep asserting that air is needed. When I search for “lithium ion battery fire” and do a cursory scan of those webpages then I find a lot of evidence that air is not required and nor do the fires stop when starving them of air, e.g. as on the car carrier fire.

 

 

In this video: https://youtu.be/jNHJICRGZkY?si=nDc_mIbL0c4NDDEA

 

It certainly looks like the battery fire stops when starved of air and then reignites when it has access to some fresh oxygen.


johno1234
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  #3120591 26-Aug-2023 14:40
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I wonder if you can access the Westpac interest free loan without a mortgage but by using the house as security? Don't have a mortgage at the moment. Or would a non-drawn revolving credit do? There's no information on westpac.co.nz about this that I can find.

 

Hopefully someone knows - the last thing I want to do is attempt to contact Westpac to ask them!

 

Westpac cap these loans at $50k. ANZ and ASB have IIRC 1% loans for any sustainable energy use IIRC up to $80k.

 

 

 

 


tukapa1
691 posts

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  #3120612 26-Aug-2023 16:03
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johno1234:

I wonder if you can access the Westpac interest free loan without a mortgage but by using the house as security?



We recently refinanced with Westpac so we're all good there but funny I can't find anything about this loan on their website.

Just trying to decide what car to buy up to $50k.

We're not after a SUV, want a hatchback.

First decision is PHEV vs BEV. If BEV I've narrowed down to Peugeot e208, MG4 or BYD Dolphin. I swore away from the Dolphin at launch as I considered it overpriced

I'm leaning towards the MG4 but not sure of availablity in time to utilise the clean car payment before National and ACT kill it off.

Or maybe spend half that amount and buy a second hand PHEV.


HarmLessSolutions
617 posts

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  #3120614 26-Aug-2023 16:09
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tukapa1:
johno1234:

 

I wonder if you can access the Westpac interest free loan without a mortgage but by using the house as security?



We recently refinanced with Westpac so we're all good there but funny I can't find anything about this loan on their website.

Just trying to decide what car to buy up to $50k.

We're not after a SUV, want a hatchback.

First decision is PHEV vs BEV. If BEV I've narrowed down to Peugeot e208, MG4 or BYD Dolphin. I swore away from the Dolphin at launch as I considered it overpriced

I'm leaning towards the MG4 but not sure of availablity in time to utilise the clean car payment before National and ACT kill it off.

Or maybe spend half that amount and buy a second hand PHEV.

It will be a fair bet that PHEVs will be charged (distance based) RUCs as part of the changes coming in April 2024 to bring EVs into that tax net and addressing the petrol use by them will likely be messy. That will have a significant impact on the economics of owning a PHEV so worth factoring into your purchase decision.





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tukapa1
691 posts

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  #3120622 26-Aug-2023 16:26
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HarmLessSolutions:

 

It will be a fair bet that PHEVs will be charged (distance based) RUCs as part of the changes coming in April 2024 to bring EVs into that tax net and addressing the petrol use by them will likely be messy. That will have a significant impact on the economics of owning a PHEV so worth factoring into your purchase decision.

 

 

It does make it hard making an informed decision when you're still waiting to be informed how the gummint is going to deal with this....


mattwnz
19488 posts

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  #3120629 26-Aug-2023 16:59
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tukapa1:
johno1234:

 

I wonder if you can access the Westpac interest free loan without a mortgage but by using the house as security?



We recently refinanced with Westpac so we're all good there but funny I can't find anything about this loan on their website.

Just trying to decide what car to buy up to $50k.

We're not after a SUV, want a hatchback.

First decision is PHEV vs BEV. If BEV I've narrowed down to Peugeot e208, MG4 or BYD Dolphin. I swore away from the Dolphin at launch as I considered it overpriced

I'm leaning towards the MG4 but not sure of availablity in time to utilise the clean car payment before National and ACT kill it off.

Or maybe spend half that amount and buy a second hand PHEV.

 

 

 

I wonder how they are going to do road user charges with PHEVs, as you could end up paying twice if you often end up use petrol. I had read that you will need to pay RUC on a vehicle that plugs in, but some PHEVs have a tiny electric range which guessing only drops as it ages. WE were looking at the brand new Mazda cx60, but unless they sort that out, I don't know how anyone could buy one when it is up in the air. 
All EVs are overpriced ATM IMO as over time the prices should drop back. Most seem to be  are in the luxury car price, and for the same price you can get a really good ICE equivalent.. WIth electricty prices increasing and the unit price being higher in some areas, and with RUCs coming in, there may not be that much of a cost saving from driving electric.  The CCD is possibly heaping dealers increase their margins, because otherwise they may need to drop their prices.  


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