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753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 1773286 1-May-2017 10:58
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My concern with EV is replacing the battery - say you get 5 years life out of a battery.

 

What then? There don't seem to be many replacement options.

 

So will I have just purchased an expensive disposable car?


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  # 1773297 1-May-2017 11:06
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Until they make a sports wagon with good performance, and reasonable range (300+ KM), I can't see myself switching to an EV.  Esp if the price is in line with what they are now.

 

By sports wagon I mean something that has excellent suspension, steering, and does 0-100 ~5 seconds.

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 1773298 1-May-2017 11:07
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KrazyKid:

 

My concern with EV is replacing the battery - say you get 5 years life out of a battery.

 

What then? There don't seem to be many replacement options.

 

So will I have just purchased an expensive disposable car?

 

 

That is probably my concern as well. Kiwis tend to hang on to their cars for a long time by world standards. So expecting a car to last (say) 20 years is not too unreasonable (you might not own it for that long - but it would still be worth something for that long). Also, you might hope that the apparent reliability of the Leaf (for example) would mean that they are worth a battery replacement or two during its lifespan.

 

I have not seen much to indicate there is much of a system in place for battery refurb/replacement as a cost effective routine thing.

 

EDIT: fixed typo.

 

 





Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

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  # 1773320 1-May-2017 11:25
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Highly unlikely. The range (or more accurately, the steadily declining range as they age) is still a major issue for anyone who doesn't spend all their time in the city or hopping between main centres. Also the initial outlay and rapid depreciation due to the consumable battery bank is something EV fanatics like to gloss over when spouting their savings. I'm not the new car buyer type so I'd only be in the market for well used which has severe drawbacks in the EV world and at this stage is very limiting in terms of choice. The only thing you're really saving is petrol and regular engine servicing and as an ex-mechanic I do my own servicing so there's virtually no saving in that regard for me except for consumables and the odd parts - but EVs still have all the other bits to go wrong too. Compared to the depreciation on a higher capital cost EV the fuel savings really isn't a big factor considering the convenience of knowing there's always a liquid recharge station nearby and you can be back on the road in 5 minutes.


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  # 1773336 1-May-2017 11:53
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Right now; no as I am not in the market to purchase another car 

 

If money was no object, then I would purchase a Tesla or Ioniq as no other EV car has the looks that I look for in a car


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  # 1773367 1-May-2017 12:17
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Yes, I intend to buy one.

 

At the moment, the cost is holding me off (I don't have a spare $15k for a Leaf at the moment).

 

Also, resale puts me off a little. We tend to hold on to the second car (what this would be, Wife does about 30k a day at the most) for a long time, and being able to sell or trade a Leaf with a potentially stuffed battery would be important in about 8 or 9 years.


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  # 1773368 1-May-2017 12:19
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I would consider an electric vehicle when they can tow 1500kg and excite me.

 

I love the sound and feel of my tuned V8, it would take a lot to convince me to give that up.

 

That the cost of an electric vehicle and the fact I do 100+ km a day to work and back so would be worried about the distance.


 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek


  # 1773369 1-May-2017 12:21
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undoubtedly a tesla model s.

 

Nissan leaf is a well-known one, but for some reason i dont like the looks of it...





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662 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 1773383 1-May-2017 12:33
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Won't buy one, for a number of reasons.

 

Saw the contenders at the MTA Car Show of the Century in Wellington over the weekend, and the expensive Tesla's aside, none of them are really viable for a 1 car family (2 adults 2 children).

 

  • The Nissan Leaf is just plain ugly looking, in my opinion.
  • The BMW i3 isn't a bad looking thing, but is really only a city car
  • The Hyundai Ioniq isn't bad looking, boot looked a little small.

Also as someone who rents, and is currently lucky enough to have a garage, if that situation where to change, potentially I'd lose the ability to charge the thing up.

 

The range is another concern. My current vehicle will happily get me and family with a full boot of luggage from wellington to Tauranga on a 3/4 tank, and only require a break to feed and fuel the driver, all the while having the stereo playing and either air con in summer or seat heaters in winter, and while returning 7L/per 100km's, roughly. An EV (Tesla's aside) won't get me there without at least 1 stop, probably 2.

 

And the other gripe I have with EV's at the moment, is effectively, they don't 'pay there way' if you like. A driver of a petrol powered vehicle has road user charges incorporated in the price per litre or diesel vehicles by buying the kilometres. Currently (until 2021) there is an exemption on EV's, so therefore they pay on RUC at all. Yes, this is a carrot to get people into EV's, but you're still using the same roads as everyone else...

 

The other gripe I have is the 'free' charging parks that are available to EV. As far as I can tell, and I'm happy to be proven wrong, they look to be free to use, except they're not really. If you take the Vector EV charging as an example, every Vector customer will be paying for an EV driver to be able to charge there vehicle...

 

If this isn't the case, I'm happy to be proved incorrect\wrong.

 

 


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  # 1773385 1-May-2017 12:39
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My next car will probably be an EV. This wont be for at least 3 years as we have just been through the process of upgrading our cars. The MTA show over the weekend showed that EV's are coming and are going to be very prominent in the near future. ICE is on the endangered species list.





Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

Using empathy takes no energy and can gain so much. Try it.

 

 


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  # 1773416 1-May-2017 12:53
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robjg63:

 

........ I have not seen much to indicate there is much of a system in place for battery refurb/replacement as a cost effective routine thing....

 

 

When I have designed and built my Traction Battery Testing Complex(es) I was looking at the solution not only from Engineering perspective, but also from the Business Process Efficiency, time required to test and labor involved in all steps of the process. With hybrids my concept proved to be 100% fastest and most efficient in the World up to date, partially thanks to Toyota's (& EV Energy/Panasonic) genius traction battery design, versatility and the way it is integrated into the drive train.

 

However with EVs, take Leaf as the popular example here - the battery design is not "repair friendly". Amount of man hours, work space and tools required to rebuild it does not make it attractive and cost efficient and productive at this stage. Needless to say the price of donor battery if you are lucky to find one is not cheap and if you find one just the amount of efforts to check it's state of health and remaining capacity is laboursome.

 

In comparison - in less than an hour in my Lab the battery off any Toyota/Lexus Hybrid can be tested.

 

EV would require much more time and quite big capital investments to be able to test any traction battery from any EV as they are not compatible between brands, even between Nissan Leafs of different generations.




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  # 1773527 1-May-2017 14:30
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RUKI:

 

robjg63:

 

........ I have not seen much to indicate there is much of a system in place for battery refurb/replacement as a cost effective routine thing....

 

 

When I have designed and built my Traction Battery Testing Complex(es) I was looking at the solution not only from Engineering perspective, but also from the Business Process Efficiency, time required to test and labor involved in all steps of the process. With hybrids my concept proved to be 100% fastest and most efficient in the World up to date, partially thanks to Toyota's (& EV Energy/Panasonic) genius traction battery design, versatility and the way it is integrated into the drive train.

 

However with EVs, take Leaf as the popular example here - the battery design is not "repair friendly". Amount of man hours, work space and tools required to rebuild it does not make it attractive and cost efficient and productive at this stage. Needless to say the price of donor battery if you are lucky to find one is not cheap and if you find one just the amount of efforts to check it's state of health and remaining capacity is laboursome.

 

In comparison - in less than an hour in my Lab the battery off any Toyota/Lexus Hybrid can be tested.

 

EV would require much more time and quite big capital investments to be able to test any traction battery from any EV as they are not compatible between brands, even between Nissan Leafs of different generations.

 

 

That's interesting, well, how about the battery of the BMW i3, would you consider this is "repair friendly" and an improvement on the Nissan Leaf situation?

 

Thanks

 

Fred 


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  # 1773543 1-May-2017 14:59
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I take this philosophy to all purchases: I don't buy unless price and performance are right.

 

My partner and I have two cars.  A Mazda 3 SP25 and the mighty Pajero 3.2L Diesel.

 

No interest in an EV yet (TL:DR tech not-there-yet from my perspective). 

 

That said I do genuinely hope (one day) to replace our medium car with a pure EV, when it isn't such a compromise to do so: -

 

- Price: There is currently a purchase price premium for EV.  

 

- Features: Typically (despite high price) a spartan fit out.

 

- Range/Recharge: I like to Grand Tour. I want to be able to cover distance without having to plan around recharge points and spending hours queuing/charging.  I want to apply jandal and use the AC all day.  I'm not interested in economising/nursing the car/battery whatever.

 

- Aesthetics: I'm yet to see an EV that I really like the look of.  Tesla is OK from a distance but the ones I have seen up close the panel fit i poor and the trim is cheap and nasty.

 

Onto the The Paj - our adventure wagon.  It needs to regularly tow >2,000kg over steep ranges (e.g. Takaka Hill) and beach launch a boat.  On occasion it needs highish ground clearance and the ability to wade in a foot or two of water.  With AWD/4WD it's also our main winter vehicle for long distance road trips e.g. Nelson to ChCh.  7 seats is handy too as we have up to 4 kids to accommodate. 

 

Is a production EV with all that capability even on the horizon?

 

 

 

 





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  # 1773547 1-May-2017 15:08
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No.

 

Because:

 

 - high cost (tesla is just too expensive :))

 

 - low range (tesla is just too expensive :))

 

 - the ugly look (tesla is just too expensive :))

 

I would consider EV when they will cost $10-12k for 4-5yr old with 400+ kms range. which will stay the same way for another 5-10 years. 

 

We live in AKL central and on average day drive 50+ km, but sometimes I could drive 150+ km just around the city from shore to waitakere via CBD, and back to Orewa for BBQ and back to CBD. Why? Dunno.





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  # 1773574 1-May-2017 15:12
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jarledb:

 

ilovemusic:

 

a pure ev ?

 

probably not until someone makes one that handles like a sportscar and devoid of gizmos.

 

closest at the moment would be a bmw i8.

 

 

The i8 is a hybrid. 

 

What you want is something like the Tesla Roadster (Basically a Lotus Elise).

 

 

yes , i know the i8 is a hybrid but its the closest to an ev sportscar.

 

driven a tesla roadster, it was added nothing to the base elise and actually detracted from driving enjoyment.

 

 

 

 


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