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Ultimate Geek
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Topic # 222569 18-Aug-2017 07:38
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Greater Auckland today released plans for a high speed inter-city rail between Auckland, Bay of Plenty and the Waikato.

This really seems like a waste of money. I'd say purchasing electric buses would at least be more flexible.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11905667

"The Greens are throwing their weight behind a daily regional passenger rail service linking Auckland with major North Island cities.

Based on a rapid rail blueprint linking Auckland to Tauranga and Hamilton released today by transport lobby group Greater Auckland, the Greens say they would champion the alternative form of public transport if elected to Government.

The passenger service would run five times a day between Hamilton and Auckland, and one return service to Tauranga daily.

Greater Auckland has detailed a three-stage plan to modernise existing regional rail links to use modern technology tilting trains travelling up to 160km/h on upgraded tracks.

In the first stage, existing trains such as the 96-seater Silver Fern units would run on the current network to build up passenger numbers.

The second stage would be investing in high-speed tilting trains and upgrading the network.

Greater Auckland says travel times of less than 90 minutes between Hamilton and Auckland and under 60 minutes between Hamilton and Tauranga would link more than half the country's population.

It would allow for journeys that were faster than driving and skip the traffic completely. A revitalised train network would also stitch the economy of Auckland, Hamilton and Tauranga with the benefits of growth and development in the main centres spilling over into nearby towns and villages.

The final stage would see lines extending across the Waikato and Bay of Plenty.

"National has let regional rail services rust away but the Greens in government will restore rail as the backbone of New Zealand's transport system, for freight and for people," said Green Party transport spokeswoman Julie Anne Genter.

"I expect a lot of people from Hamilton and Tauranga will be attracted by the idea of being able to work and rest while on the train, and avoid Auckland traffic once in the city.



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  Reply # 1848299 18-Aug-2017 07:44
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Even a best case scenario with billions in infrastructure is going to be a minimum of 2 hours still between Tauranga and Auckland with high speed rail. To me reading the report I can't see how you could ever have the passenger numbers to make such an investment viable.

 

Yes it would be great to have - but at what cost? How many people will commute from Auckland to Tauranga daily at a cost of $70 return and at over 2 hours each way? It's going to be 3 hours now with the current rail.

 

 

 

 


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1848301 18-Aug-2017 07:47
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I agree that this would be a waste of money, there simply would not be the traffic volume to support the service.

 

I do think there needs to be a train service from the north shore, the bus lane could become shared use but better still they could easily install a mono rail from Albany to the city, there is the volume to support that and i they built seure and cost effective carparking buildings at or near the depot the patronage would increase and become profitable.





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  Reply # 1848305 18-Aug-2017 07:53
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I think a train service does make sense - but to think there is enough demand to need 15 min services to Hamilton is almost laughable.

 

 


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  Reply # 1848307 18-Aug-2017 07:59
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We need to see more info and studies before it gets written off. The idea may work, slow Aucklands hunger for expansion and get vehicles off the road. The trains could move light freight at the same time especially from Port Tauranga.




Mike
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  Reply # 1848309 18-Aug-2017 08:04
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MikeB4: We need to see more info and studies before it gets written off. The idea may work, slow Aucklands hunger for expansion and get vehicles off the road. The trains could move light freight at the same time especially from Port Tauranga.

 

So that means building extra lines unless you want high speed passenger rail delayed by rail freight. Suddenly the cost of such a project gets even higher.

 

I'm sure the ROI would be far better if the the govt simply subsidised flights between both cities!

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1848311 18-Aug-2017 08:10
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A move to new rail is for the future we need to look forward to change the way we move people and stuff. Rail is more sustainable if done right. Only need to look at Auckland and Wellington to see that.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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  Reply # 1848317 18-Aug-2017 08:24
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MikeB4: We need to see more info and studies before it gets written off. The idea may work, slow Aucklands hunger for expansion and get vehicles off the road. The trains could move light freight at the same time especially from Port Tauranga.

 

I'd agree with this. 

 

And, what does 'high speed' mean? 160kph seems rather slow. I'd have thought 350kph would be a better target. 

 

You need to allow people to live in Tauranga/Hamilton and commute to Auckland for work. 

 

For those thinking the cost/benefit does not pay -- think about the cost of Auckland infrastructure.  Auckland needs billions of dollars of investment in roading and infrastructure just to keep up with growth let alone fixing what is already broken.  

 

Imagine being able to live in Tauranga, and work in the auckland CBD with a 35 minute train commute each way. 

 

 


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  Reply # 1848324 18-Aug-2017 08:34
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I'm in, if within 20 mins from AKL to Hamilton, < 1 hr to Tauranga from AKL + expand to northland and I will forget my dreams about Melbourne :)

 

Otherwise, there's no point, faster and cheap to use car :(





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  Reply # 1848329 18-Aug-2017 08:47
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surfisup1000:

 

MikeB4: We need to see more info and studies before it gets written off. The idea may work, slow Aucklands hunger for expansion and get vehicles off the road. The trains could move light freight at the same time especially from Port Tauranga.

 

I'd agree with this. 

 

And, what does 'high speed' mean? 160kph seems rather slow. I'd have thought 350kph would be a better target. 

 

You need to allow people to live in Tauranga/Hamilton and commute to Auckland for work. 

 

For those thinking the cost/benefit does not pay -- think about the cost of Auckland infrastructure.  Auckland needs billions of dollars of investment in roading and infrastructure just to keep up with growth let alone fixing what is already broken.  

 

Imagine being able to live in Tauranga, and work in the auckland CBD with a 35 minute train commute each way. 

 

 

 

 

I bet the good folk of Tauranga are absolutely thrilled.

 

 


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  Reply # 1848331 18-Aug-2017 08:52
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I'd love to see it happen  but looking at the naysayers here  and in other media I know it never will.  The car rulz.  Would nice to go from Morrinsville to ether Tauranga or Auckland without a car. Not interested in Hamilton unless they reopen the underground station in the CBD.





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  Reply # 1848333 18-Aug-2017 08:54
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surfisup1000:

 

Imagine being able to live in Tauranga, and work in the auckland CBD with a 35 minute train commute each way. 

 

 

But that's simply never going to happen any time soon so not even worth dreaming about.

 

Based upon some estimates of rail build costs for a 400km/h train you're probably looking at build costs in the $15 - $20 billion region based on current build costs. Even if you look at the Chinese who seem to be able to build rail for bargain US$20 million per km it would still be a $7 billion+ project. For that sort of price the Government could just buy jets, charge people the same $70 - $100 or so each way that a high speed train would have to cost and laugh all the way to to the bank.

 

People keep talking about rail in Japan but I don't think many people realise how expensive it is to get around.

 

 


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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1848338 18-Aug-2017 09:18
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MikeB4:

 

You need to allow people to live in Tauranga/Hamilton and commute to Auckland for work. 

 

 

 

 

Thanks to Auckland's housing market - people already do this. A lot from Hamilton, but I also know of a few going a few times a week from Tauranga. If you're up early enough its 90 minutes from Hamilton to Auckland by car - not too different from the commute from Howick some days.

 

I think there is more demand for this than people on here think... if it's affordable and convenient.

 

 


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  Reply # 1848351 18-Aug-2017 09:23
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caminham:

 

MikeB4:

 

You need to allow people to live in Tauranga/Hamilton and commute to Auckland for work. 

 

 

 

 

Thanks to Auckland's housing market - people already do this. A lot from Hamilton, but I also know of a few going a few times a week from Tauranga. If you're up early enough its 90 minutes from Hamilton to Auckland by car - not too different from the commute from Howick some days.

 

I think there is more demand for this than people on here think... if it's affordable and convenient.

 

 

 

 

You need to leave really early then.  I  go to Auckland once or twice a month and I leave Morrinsville at about 6.45am  and get to Auckland about 9.00 ~ 9.30.  The Drury que kills it.. 





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Old3eyes


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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1848353 18-Aug-2017 09:25
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old3eyes:

 

 

 

You need to leave really early then.  I  go to Auckland once or twice a month and I leave Morrinsville at about 6.45am  and get to Auckland about 9.00 ~ 9.30.  The Drury que kills it.. 

 

 

Yep! I was going the opposite direction for a long time, working in Hamilton. Drury starts building up at about 6:30. People I know start in the CBD by 7:30 at the latest, then they're heading home before the afternoon rush too.


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1848369 18-Aug-2017 09:52
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caminham:

 

 

 

Thanks to Auckland's housing market - people already do this. A lot from Hamilton, but I also know of a few going a few times a week from Tauranga. If you're up early enough its 90 minutes from Hamilton to Auckland by car - not too different from the commute from Howick some days.

 

 

 

 

Have they done their sums? An extra 45,000k per year (over a CBD commute from say, Manukau) on your car, even ignoring the loss of time, is more than $30,000 at standard accounting rates for overall cost of driving.

 

That's enough to pay the mortgage on the average Auckland house.

 

 

 

 


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