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  Reply # 1879239 8-Oct-2017 00:30
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The range extender on the i3 supposedly sounds like a dryer on full spin. If I was looking at an i3, I would make sure to test driving the car with the range extender running for a while before I made up my mind...







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  Reply # 1879312 8-Oct-2017 11:07
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jarledb:

 

The range extender on the i3 supposedly sounds like a dryer on full spin. If I was looking at an i3, I would make sure to test driving the car with the range extender running for a while before I made up my mind...

 

 

I haven't read anywhere of problems with the range extender engine, but I would be interested to know if there have been reported problems. What sort of problems are you envisaging might occur if you keep the range extender running for a while?

 

I can understand why it sounds different to a "regular" car engine - that's because it's a 650cc parallel twin engine motor adapted from BMW's motor cycles, as described below:

 

The Wheels Car of the Year is the electric BMW i3 which comes with a range extender option that is powered by a BMW parallel twin 650cc engine.

 

It’s not the first modern car to be powered by motorcycle engines and it may not be the last.

 

VW last year launched the XL Sport which is powered by a Ducati Panigale engine and Mercedes-Benz recently bought into MV Agusta, paving the way for possible hybrid car/motorcycle vehicles.

 

The i3 is driven by electric motors, but you can get a “range extender” option which features a 650cc parallel twin engine adapted from their motorcycles.

 

https://motorbikewriter.com/powered-motorcycle-engine/

 

Overall, I think the range extender engine is a brilliant concept that is nicely designed to meet the "range anxiety" problems of driving an i3 that only has a pure electric range of about 130km.

 

Of course, i3 owners need to be aware that, when driving using the range extender engine, you should not over-tax the engine because it is charging the battery as you drive. For example, if you are driving a fully loaded car into a head wind at a fast speed up a hill using the range extender engine, then the battery may not receive enough energy from the range extender engine and the car may automatically slow down (i.e. go into reduced power mode) in order to conserve energy. This is particularly relevant when the battery has already been discharged to low levels, such as 6%, as discussed here  and also here.


 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1879487 8-Oct-2017 19:03
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frednz:

 

....

 

Overall, I think the range extender engine is a brilliant concept that is nicely designed to meet the "range anxiety" problems of driving an i3 that only has a pure electric range of about 130km.

 

Of course, i3 owners need to be aware that, when driving using the range extender engine, you should not over-tax the engine because it is charging the battery as you drive. For example, if you are driving a fully loaded car into a head wind at a fast speed up a hill using the range extender engine, then the battery may not receive enough energy from the range extender engine and the car may automatically slow down (i.e. go into reduced power mode) in order to conserve energy. This is particularly relevant when the battery has already been discharged to low levels, such as 6%, as discussed here  and also here.

 

 

The 130km would apply to the 22kWh battery version. 

The 33kWh battery i3 is about 180km range on the open road....and a lot more than that around town.  On the LTC drive, a battery-only i3 drove from Napier to Taupo (136km with a BIG hill on the way) and arrived with 25%. My Leaf arrived on 9%. Sea level to Central Plateau is probably the most power-hungry task you can give an EV on the North Island. There are enough fast chargers around now the value of the REX is being reduced almost weekly. 

Interestingly, I read an article last week that made the point that "range anxiety" is a newbie thing. Once you've driven an EV for a few weeks it goes way.....because you know what your car can do and you plan for it......just like a petrol car. 

That said, until the more remote parts of the SH network join the fast charging network there are some places you'd be glad to have the REX......but they are becoming more rare....and that's GOOD. :-)    





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  Reply # 1879546 8-Oct-2017 21:54
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Having seen one in person at evWorld and seen a lot of media surrounding the i3, I am a fan of the design.

 

Having said that, the high NZ New Price is off-putting. The $86k asking price for the REX model is steep given I have seen Tesla NZ previously selling a lightly used Inventory Model S 75 for $107k, which is a whole different league of vehicle with a much greater range for only $20k more.

 

BMW's NZ New i3 asking price is very prohibitive for most people and given a new 3-Series can be had for that money it's questionable value. Thankfully we always have Japanese imports to help EVs become more commonplace in the mean time.


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  Reply # 1879572 9-Oct-2017 00:43
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JoshWright:

 

Having seen one in person at evWorld and seen a lot of media surrounding the i3, I am a fan of the design.

 

Having said that, the high NZ New Price is off-putting. The $86k asking price for the REX model is steep given I have seen Tesla NZ previously selling a lightly used Inventory Model S 75 for $107k, which is a whole different league of vehicle with a much greater range for only $20k more.

 

BMW's NZ New i3 asking price is very prohibitive for most people and given a new 3-Series can be had for that money it's questionable value. Thankfully we always have Japanese imports to help EVs become more commonplace in the mean time.

 



Here's an imported BMW i3 2017 with REX for $54,995. 

BMW i3 2017 with REX





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  Reply # 1879615 9-Oct-2017 09:22
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Linuxluver:

 

JoshWright:

 

Having seen one in person at evWorld and seen a lot of media surrounding the i3, I am a fan of the design.

 

Having said that, the high NZ New Price is off-putting. The $86k asking price for the REX model is steep given I have seen Tesla NZ previously selling a lightly used Inventory Model S 75 for $107k, which is a whole different league of vehicle with a much greater range for only $20k more.

 

BMW's NZ New i3 asking price is very prohibitive for most people and given a new 3-Series can be had for that money it's questionable value. Thankfully we always have Japanese imports to help EVs become more commonplace in the mean time.

 



Here's an imported BMW i3 2017 with REX for $54,995. 

BMW i3 2017 with REX

 

 

Although the advertisement says it's a 2017 model, it only has a Generation 1 22 kWh Battery. If this was a Generation 2 33 kWh battery, then the price of $54,995 would certainly attract a lot of buyers!

 

I think that the price of $54,995 for an old model i3 is actually very expensive.

 

This 2016 second generation i3 for $65,990 with 1900km on the clock is a much better buy (IMHO) even though it's $11,000 dearer.

 

Strangely enough, the above advertisement says that this second generation i3 has a range of "almost double" that of the first generation 60Ah model, but it's widely accepted that the range of the 94Ah new model is only about 40% greater than the 60Ah model (183km vs 130km). 

 

 

 

 




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  Reply # 1879669 9-Oct-2017 09:43
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Linuxluver:

 

frednz:

 

....

 

Overall, I think the range extender engine is a brilliant concept that is nicely designed to meet the "range anxiety" problems of driving an i3 that only has a pure electric range of about 130km.

 

Of course, i3 owners need to be aware that, when driving using the range extender engine, you should not over-tax the engine because it is charging the battery as you drive. For example, if you are driving a fully loaded car into a head wind at a fast speed up a hill using the range extender engine, then the battery may not receive enough energy from the range extender engine and the car may automatically slow down (i.e. go into reduced power mode) in order to conserve energy. This is particularly relevant when the battery has already been discharged to low levels, such as 6%, as discussed here  and also here.

 

 

The 130km would apply to the 22kWh battery version. 

The 33kWh battery i3 is about 180km range on the open road....and a lot more than that around town.  On the LTC drive, a battery-only i3 drove from Napier to Taupo (136km with a BIG hill on the way) and arrived with 25%. My Leaf arrived on 9%. Sea level to Central Plateau is probably the most power-hungry task you can give an EV on the North Island. There are enough fast chargers around now the value of the REX is being reduced almost weekly. 

Interestingly, I read an article last week that made the point that "range anxiety" is a newbie thing. Once you've driven an EV for a few weeks it goes way.....because you know what your car can do and you plan for it......just like a petrol car. 

That said, until the more remote parts of the SH network join the fast charging network there are some places you'd be glad to have the REX......but they are becoming more rare....and that's GOOD. :-)    

 

 

Thanks, that's good information. I presume that the battery-only i3 that travelled the 136km from Napier to Taupo and arrived with 25% was a second generation i3 which has a quoted range of 183km?

 

 

 

 




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  Reply # 1881737 11-Oct-2017 09:34
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http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/09/18/bmw-i3-longer-range-arriving-2018/

 

The above article claims that:

 

"BMW’s first electric car – the i3 hatch – is bound to get another technology update in 2018. After a battery pack upgrade in late 2016, the i3 will improve its electric range in 2018."

 

"Earlier this summer, a source close to BMWBLOG confirmed that the new update will take place in 2018 which will bring the capacity of the battery expressed in ampere hour (Ah) to 120 or the equivalent of approximately 42.5 kWh. The current 2017 i3 has a 33 kWh capacity. An increase in capacity from 96 to 120 Ah would mean an increase in range of 25 percent, assume voltage and weight of the battery remains the same."

 

"BMW is currently in the process to launch the first facelift of the i3, along with the first ever i3s, a sporty version of the electric car which aims to deliver better driving dynamics. The facelifted BMW i3 is still powered by a 94 Ah battery, which powers an electric motor that makes 170 hp and 184 lb-ft of torque."

 

Earlier posts in this thread have referred to the "facelifts" that have been announced for the 2018 BMW i3, but these do not increase its range as mentioned in the quote above. So, it would be really good if the battery can soon be upgraded to 42.5 kWh from its present 33 kWh. This Generation 3 Model will be well worth waiting for and may have the effect of further reducing the second-hand prices of the existing 33 kWh and 22 kWh models.


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  Reply # 1881812 11-Oct-2017 10:43
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Linuxluver:

Interestingly, I read an article last week that made the point that "range anxiety" is a newbie thing. Once you've driven an EV for a few weeks it goes way.....because you know what your car can do and you plan for it......just like a petrol car. 

 

I don't know about that. No-one 'plans' when and where to refuel with petrol. The lights comes on the dash and you stop at the next one you see or make a note to stop in at your favourite due to fly-buys or whatever.

 

That's hardly planning. 

 

 


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  Reply # 1882016 11-Oct-2017 16:36
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jarledb:

 

The range extender on the i3 supposedly sounds like a dryer on full spin. If I was looking at an i3, I would make sure to test driving the car with the range extender running for a while before I made up my mind...

 

 

 

 

the gen 1 i drove wasn't bad, a bit clattery on startup like a di petrol, not as good sounding as an i8 but a bit more characterful than the average petrol motored ecobox.

 

sidebar; in the latest season of curb your enthusiasm, larry david has traded his prius for an i3.

 

 

 

 

 

 




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  Reply # 1882314 12-Oct-2017 09:49
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martyyn:

 

Linuxluver:

Interestingly, I read an article last week that made the point that "range anxiety" is a newbie thing. Once you've driven an EV for a few weeks it goes way.....because you know what your car can do and you plan for it......just like a petrol car. 

 

I don't know about that. No-one 'plans' when and where to refuel with petrol. The lights comes on the dash and you stop at the next one you see or make a note to stop in at your favourite due to fly-buys or whatever.

 

That's hardly planning. 

 

 

 

 

I agree and that's probably why the range extender version of the i3 is far more popular than the pure electric models.

 

I'm sure many people would like to buy a pure electric i3, but nearly all the second-hand pure electric i3's on sale are Generation 1 models with a maximum range when new of about 130km. It's no surprise that there are now several pure electric second-hand i3's on sale for as low as $35,000, some of which have been on sale for months.

 

But even at a price of $35,000 for an old model short range EV, this is still way too expensive and much more than buying, for example, a brand-new Honda Jazz for $27,000 that has a range of nearly 700km and which can be refuelled anywhere in the country in less than 5 minutes.

 

If I owned a pure electric Gen 1 i3 with a range of no more than 130km, I certainly wouldn't venture outside city boundaries and I would only charge it up at home. Nevertheless, this may be great for someone who wants the i3 as a second car just to travel 60km a day to and from work.

 

 

 

 




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  Reply # 1883066 13-Oct-2017 16:14
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I've just found on Trade Me Motors the lowest price second-hand BMW i3 that I've seen so far.

 

It's a 2014 Gen 1 "pure electric" model with 17,000 km on the clock and it has DC fast charge and NZ GPS and aux etc.

 

The asking price is $30,000, so that's getting a bit more reasonable.

 

The advertisement says you can fast charge this vehicle to 85% in just 20 minutes, do you think that's possible?

 

Although the 2014 model has a maximum range when new of 130 km, I guess you would have to reduce this a bit for a 3-year old vehicle due to normal degradation of the battery over that time. So, do you think you could count on getting a range of 110 - 120 km?


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  Reply # 1883070 13-Oct-2017 16:25
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frednz:The advertisement says you can fast charge this vehicle to 85% in just 20 minutes, do you think that's possible?

 

 

Yip, a Gen 1 had a 21.6kwh battery ( 18.8kwh usable) so at a 50wkh fast charger, you will dump 16.7 kwh in 20mins,

 

85% of 19 Kwh is 16.2 Kwh


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  Reply # 1883073 13-Oct-2017 16:40
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frednz:

 

I've just found on Trade Me Motors the lowest price second-hand BMW i3 that I've seen so far.

 

It's a 2014 Gen 1 "pure electric" model with 17,000 km on the clock and it has DC fast charge and NZ GPS and aux etc.

 

The asking price is $30,000, so that's getting a bit more reasonable.

 

The advertisement says you can fast charge this vehicle to 85% in just 20 minutes, do you think that's possible?

 

Although the 2014 model has a maximum range when new of 130 km, I guess you would have to reduce this a bit for a 3-year old vehicle due to normal degradation of the battery over that time. So, do you think you could count on getting a range of 110 - 120 km?

 



Make sure the DC fast charging interface isn't CCS Type 1 (American standard) 

I think there may be only 2 of those left in the country....and both of them will soon disappear. The fast chargers have all been converted to CCS Type 2 (European and - as of December 2016 - the NZ standard). 





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  Reply # 1883104 13-Oct-2017 17:34
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Linuxluver:

 

frednz:

 

I've just found on Trade Me Motors the lowest price second-hand BMW i3 that I've seen so far.

 

It's a 2014 Gen 1 "pure electric" model with 17,000 km on the clock and it has DC fast charge and NZ GPS and aux etc.

 

The asking price is $30,000, so that's getting a bit more reasonable.

 

The advertisement says you can fast charge this vehicle to 85% in just 20 minutes, do you think that's possible?

 

Although the 2014 model has a maximum range when new of 130 km, I guess you would have to reduce this a bit for a 3-year old vehicle due to normal degradation of the battery over that time. So, do you think you could count on getting a range of 110 - 120 km?

 



Make sure the DC fast charging interface isn't CCS Type 1 (American standard) 

I think there may be only 2 of those left in the country....and both of them will soon disappear. The fast chargers have all been converted to CCS Type 2 (European and - as of December 2016 - the NZ standard). 

 

 

Thanks Linuxluver, that's good advice and I think it's possible that some second-hand BMW i3's on sale wouldn't have a fast charging option at all, is that correct?

 

Thanks Wellygary for confirming that a fast charge for the Gen 1 22 kWh model can charge the battery to 85% in 20 minutes, that's pretty good, provided that you don't have to wait in a queue to charge up the vehicle!

 

There are even 3 range extender models (REX) being advertised for sale for less than $40,000 at the moment. The best value of these is a 2015 i3 with 8756 km on the clock for $39,990, so that's not a bad price for an i3 with low kilometres. The lowest price one is $33,990 for a 2014 REX model, but it has done 41,660 km, which is getting up a bit.

 

 


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