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  Reply # 1914815 7-Dec-2017 18:57
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A few years ago someone driving slowly in Hastings killed an elderly lady on a zebra crossing in front of our hospital. He was texting and didn't notice the crossing or the lady. He wasn't speeding. He was just crawling along not looking where he was going. Even at a crawl, a two-ton car does a lot of damage to an old lady.

 

 





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  Reply # 1914860 7-Dec-2017 21:04
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Batman: Yup I've always thought they have a quota system. Now it's confirmed.

 

Unless things have changed recently, they don't specifically have a ticket "quota system" as such, but like all (most?) workplaces employees have certain performance expectations and key performance indicators they are expected to meet to justify their pay.  Mostly that revolves around the number of offences detected, not necessarily what decision they make as a result of the apprehension.    Inspector Lynam appears to be looking to change those KPI's to ensure officers are targeting the important things first and foremost.   





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  Reply # 1914861 7-Dec-2017 21:17
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I travel the Waikato highway often, been typically seeing the old camera in a unmarked van over the last few weeks just after it enters "auckland"

 

 

 

I've noticed often there will be cars sitting on the Highway, however they often just flash the lights if someones doing sub 120.. a quick reminder and don't move.





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  Reply # 1914870 7-Dec-2017 21:32
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scuwp:

 

Batman: Yup I've always thought they have a quota system. Now it's confirmed.

 

Unless things have changed recently, they don't specifically have a ticket "quota system" as such, but like all (most?) workplaces employees have certain performance expectations and key performance indicators they are expected to meet to justify their pay.  Mostly that revolves around the number of offences detected, not necessarily what decision they make as a result of the apprehension.    Inspector Lynam appears to be looking to change those KPI's to ensure officers are targeting the important things first and foremost.   

 

 

That's certainly true at a national / district level however it doesn't stop local Snr/Sergeants from interpreting those KPI's into a quota system for their local troops. I certainly know of people who have worked in the Police (within the last 4 years) under clear quota systems - i.e. target 15x tickets per day on traffic with Excel sheet to track progress and everything! And more recently (last 12mths) at a different station target 5x tickets on traffic with greater emphasis on "high visibility"  - so I guess things may be changing there.

 

In saying that though it's not like quotas are enforced strictly enough to incentive Police into going out there and making up offences. They do however (or did) encourage the unfortunately practice of "smashing" (usually belligerent) drivers with tickets where possible (i.e. Learner driver unaccompanied + Failed to display 'L' plates + Failed to produce licence etc).

 

Another thing to consider is different Govt funding streams are air-marked and accountable for different purposes. i.e. ACC funds Police X amount for crash prevention, NZTA funds X amount for vehicle compliance etc and the organisation is accountable to those different KPI's.


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  Reply # 1914872 7-Dec-2017 21:43
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Rikkitic:

 

A few years ago someone driving slowly in Hastings killed an elderly lady on a zebra crossing in front of our hospital. He was texting and didn't notice the crossing or the lady. He wasn't speeding. He was just crawling along not looking where he was going. Even at a crawl, a two-ton car does a lot of damage to an old lady.

 

 

Ditto, in my own personal experience. 6 weeks ago, my missus got rear-ended outside a Whangarei primary school by a large truck only doing 20 kph tops, and she's ended up with whiplash and has had to give up her job. If this had been at 50 kph, her tiny little car would have been wiped out, and she would have been in hospital.

 

According to the owner of the large trucking firm, "Yeh, this isn't the first time this driver has been caught tutuing with his phone while driving..."

 

I've trained the kids to answer my phone for me if I'm driving, and put it onto speaker. Ditto for changing Spotify music.

 

 


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  Reply # 1914881 7-Dec-2017 22:22
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Gurezaemon:

 

Rikkitic:

 

A few years ago someone driving slowly in Hastings killed an elderly lady on a zebra crossing in front of our hospital. He was texting and didn't notice the crossing or the lady. He wasn't speeding. He was just crawling along not looking where he was going. Even at a crawl, a two-ton car does a lot of damage to an old lady.

 

 

Ditto, in my own personal experience. 6 weeks ago, my missus got rear-ended outside a Whangarei primary school by a large truck only doing 20 kph tops, and she's ended up with whiplash and has had to give up her job. If this had been at 50 kph, her tiny little car would have been wiped out, and she would have been in hospital.

 

According to the owner of the large trucking firm, "Yeh, this isn't the first time this driver has been caught tutuing with his phone while driving..."

 

I've trained the kids to answer my phone for me if I'm driving, and put it onto speaker. Ditto for changing Spotify music.

 

 

 

 

And if it were a hatchback with a kid in the rear seat, or worse, a wagon with 3rd row seats in the boot ....


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  Reply # 1915061 8-Dec-2017 09:37
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Coil:

 

Police need to invest in education of our drivers. 

 

 

I am convinced laziness trumps education. 

 

People know they have to indicate when turning yet many don't.   Cos you have to engage in some effort.    Reminding people they must indicate is not going to override the lazy switch. 


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  Reply # 1915076 8-Dec-2017 10:15
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surfisup1000:

 

Coil:

 

Police need to invest in education of our drivers. 

 

 

I am convinced laziness trumps education. 

 

People know they have to indicate when turning yet many don't.   Cos you have to engage in some effort.    Reminding people they must indicate is not going to override the lazy switch. 

 

 

I think that laziness also trumps thinking, for the same reason. So the police engage in lots of speed enforcement activities that really don't have much impact on road safety, and ignore dangerous driving behaviour simply because with microwaves and speed cameras it's much easier to nab speeders than dangerous drivers.

 

 


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  Reply # 1915079 8-Dec-2017 10:20
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Batman: Yup I've always thought they have a quota system. Now it's confirmed.

No, there is no quota system. Police are free to write as many tickets as they like.



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  Reply # 1915082 8-Dec-2017 10:30
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Dratsab:
Batman: Yup I've always thought they have a quota system. Now it's confirmed.

No, there is no quota system. Police are free to write as many tickets as they like.

 

"Free"? Well, their performance is assessed, among other things, on tickets issued. 

 

I think that one keeps coming round due to terminology. Police management are adamant there is no quota, but front line police will tell you that they have a "target" to meet and if they don't write enough tickets it's a negative.

 

So "quota", "target" or whatever, the copper on traffic patrol has to churn them out otherwise he looks bad.

 

But looks like that's about to change, at least in the Waikato area.

 

 


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  Reply # 1915128 8-Dec-2017 10:51
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I believe the problems on our road are mostly a reflection of the general society we are breeding, it would be better to address that.  For example:

 

  • It's all about "me"
  • Instant satisfaction demanded - it has to be right now! (see first point)
  • No respect for others, property or authority
  • No consequences
  • Generally apathetic population (back to point #1)

These sorts of things reflect nowhere better than in our driving.  

 

Also should have psychometric testing to get your licence I think.  

 

In time it will all be sorted because there won't be any such thing as a self-drive car :-)

 

 

 

 

 

 





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  Reply # 1915137 8-Dec-2017 10:53
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I'm happy for them to change the target in their KPIs from 'tickets' to 'interactions'. For example, if they are tasked to have at least 5 interactions per hour, then they still have to spot infractions, pull people over, but the actual result may or may not be a ticket, as appropriate.

 

Enforcement is still happening, but the action taken can be more nuanced. A warning, a chance to get warranted/registered in the next few days, a phone call to mum maybe...




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  Reply # 1915146 8-Dec-2017 11:22
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BlueShift:

 

I'm happy for them to change the target in their KPIs from 'tickets' to 'interactions'. For example, if they are tasked to have at least 5 interactions per hour, then they still have to spot infractions, pull people over, but the actual result may or may not be a ticket, as appropriate.

 

Enforcement is still happening, but the action taken can be more nuanced. A warning, a chance to get warranted/registered in the next few days, a phone call to mum maybe...

 

 

Like.

 

They should be out there, being visible, talking to people, educating them and generally getting them onside in a positive way. It would be a win for everybody and make traffic policing a much more rewarding job.

 

 


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  Reply # 1915192 8-Dec-2017 11:38
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Coil:

 

kryptonjohn:

 

Senecio:

 

A friend of mine was hit from behind bay a crawling driver on a mobile phone in stop-start traffic. Still managed to rack up $3,500 repair bill! No sympathy for the phone use at any time.

 

 

Agreed. Nobody should be using a hand held device in a moving vehicle, even if slowly. As the copper helpfully pointed out, it technically becomes legal to use a hand held phone in a car when stopped at the kerb but not at a traffic light. So by removing the red traffic light and moving the car a couple of feet to the left it would become legal!

 

As I said, nothing to do with safety in this particular case. No discretion applied.

 



I don't think its bad using a phone at a red light, But you should still be aware for when it goes green and other objects that may hit you. 

 

 

No way is that ok. That's where the 'just having a quick look at my phone' starts.

 

Then its followed with:

 

  • I'm just moving really slowly in this traffic - I'll just have a look
  • I can fiddle with my phone around town - I am not going that fast
  • I can use my phone at 100kph

If you have a seat on the top floor of one of the double decker buses in Auckland you get a very good view of drivers. It is actually pretty frightening how many people are fiddling with their phones on a pretty much fulltime basis and paying very limited attention to anything else.

 

Start slamming the phone using drivers with really heavy fines hard and often - I reckon the last couple of years big accident increases are 99% attributable to idiots with phones.





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  Reply # 1915260 8-Dec-2017 12:51
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Of course the authorities could also just start jamming phones in the CBD and say we will stop it when drivers stop using their phones.

 

 





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