Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12
tdgeek
21495 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #1983375 26-Mar-2018 12:12
Send private message

Rikkitic:

 

I wonder if the autopilot includes an instruction Do NOT land on water.

 

 

 

 

I doubt it. An Airbus autopiloted into a forest I think it was France, all killed

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzD4tIvPHwE

 

 


FireEngine
1217 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

  #1983377 26-Mar-2018 12:16
Send private message

tdgeek:

 

Rikkitic:

 

I wonder if the autopilot includes an instruction Do NOT land on water.

 

 

 

 

I doubt it. An Airbus autopiloted into a forest I think it was France, all killed

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzD4tIvPHwE

 

 

 

 

Paris airshow, not under autopilot but the GPWS was deactivated (as the wheels were down), and the systems didn't know about the trees, that combined with the delay on engine spool-up caused the impact, prime example of CFIT.





Regards FireEngine


 
 
 
 


tdgeek
21495 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #1983384 26-Mar-2018 12:33
Send private message

FireEngine:

 

tdgeek:

 

Rikkitic:

 

I wonder if the autopilot includes an instruction Do NOT land on water.

 

 

 

 

I doubt it. An Airbus autopiloted into a forest I think it was France, all killed

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzD4tIvPHwE

 

 

 

 

Paris airshow, not under autopilot but the GPWS was deactivated (as the wheels were down), and the systems didn't know about the trees, that combined with the delay on engine spool-up caused the impact, prime example of CFIT.

 

 

That's right I googled and it reminded me. They got confused over this airport, a fly by wire demo. But while they undertook a missed approach procedure, the plane did not allow enough nose up as it was protecting against a stall, so engines spooled up but no gain in altitude. The engines filled with tree parts and shut down. And just a few killed 


MikeAqua
6055 posts

Uber Geek


  #1983557 26-Mar-2018 15:22
Send private message

I happened to be listing to radio live last week.  Myles Gazley was on for his regular car section and was talking about this accident.  This was before the details of the accidents emerged and he made two comments that stood out to me.

 

1) He thought it likely the car was not at fault and the accident would be shown to be physically unavoidable

 

2) He quoted some stats on self driving cars ( missed the reference) which showed they actually have more accidents than humans drivers (without necessarily being at fault).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 





Mike


andrew027
1270 posts

Uber Geek


  #1984144 27-Mar-2018 10:59
Send private message

My $0.02:

 

Maybe one day, when driverless vehicles have been around for 20 years and are well tried and tested, you'll be able to get into your car after a night out and say "OK Toyota, take me home" and recline the seat and fall asleep, until the car stops in your driveway and wakes you gently by turning on the sound system at a low, gradually increasing volume. But nobody thinks we're there yet, do they? So the human occupant of the vehicle must be ready to take over, grab the wheel, stomp on the brakes, whatever, if necessary (I'm sure there are rules/laws about this for autonomous vehicles on public roads) and this means they must be paying attention.

 

In the in-car video of this incident, the occupant of the vehicle is obviously not paying attention. My assumption is that as this is a test vehicle, there are digital displays showing what various systems are doing, and the occupant is looking at those. But being Uber perhaps he is checking his phone to see where the next fare needs picking up - who knows? But IMO what's happenning here is no different to someone who is texting while driving and hits a kid who dashes into the road after a ball.

 

TLDR: I think it's the "driver's" fault. 


wellygary
4992 posts

Uber Geek


  #1984156 27-Mar-2018 11:30
Send private message

MikeAqua:

 

1) He thought it likely the car was not at fault and the accident would be shown to be physically unavoidable

 

 

The dash cam footage does not appear to show any breaking or swerving action by the car, which is pretty damning

 

While we only can visibly see the deceased for an instant as she is illuminated by the headlights, these cars are supposed to have LIDAR that works in the dark??

 

I think this will end very badly for UBER...

 

 

 

 


FireEngine
1217 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

  #1984162 27-Mar-2018 11:37
Send private message

wellygary:

 

MikeAqua:

 

1) He thought it likely the car was not at fault and the accident would be shown to be physically unavoidable

 

 

The dash cam footage does not appear to show any breaking or swerving action by the car, which is pretty damning

 

While we only can visibly see the deceased for an instant as she is illuminated by the headlights, these cars are supposed to have LIDAR that works in the dark??

 

I think this will end very badly for UBER...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Indeed - and even subsequent video's posted of the scene at night appear to indicate the victim would have been human-visible under the ambient street lighting way in advance of the time the Uber dash cam seems to indicate due to its poor nighttime recording ability/settings.

 

That means both the vehicle AND the safety driver should have been able to detect and react, the safety driver appears to have been distracted.





Regards FireEngine


 
 
 
 


wellygary
4992 posts

Uber Geek


  #1984164 27-Mar-2018 11:40
Send private message

Yip, and  the LIDAR manufacturer is now throwing UBER under the bus,

 

https://www.autoblog.com/2018/03/26/lidar-maker-velodyne-fatal-uber-crash/

 

"Certainly, our lidar is capable of clearly imaging Elaine and her bicycle in this situation. However, our lidar doesn't make the decision to put on the brakes or get out of her way."


kryptonjohn
2523 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #1984165 27-Mar-2018 11:41
Send private message

I would expect/hope all this would be available in the tracing/diagnostics.

 

 

 

 


cruxis
236 posts

Master Geek


  #1984468 27-Mar-2018 19:33
Send private message

Rikkitic:

 

The problem with code is it's not intuitive. It is all based on if this do that. The precision can be increased by breaking actions down further and further, but ultimately it is still if this do that. I wonder if any conceivable AI would have made the decision to put that plane down in the Hudson river.

 

 

 

 

Yeah it  all seems based on superior sensors and reaction speed the cars will have to me too. I see no true intuitive AI on top of that being available anytime soon in cars like a human has. That be the where it needs to go.

 

I done some Defensive riding courses and you taught to look for clues, to predict others actions based on body language and where their eyes are looking. Their head movements, where drivers hands are on the steering wheel. Is that pedestrian paying attention, have they made eye contact of your approach. Does that body language on that pedestrian look like hes gonna try to dash across ? Is that kid throwing a tantrum on the footpath about slip free from mums grip and run out onto the road ?


bmt

bmt
571 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #1984493 27-Mar-2018 20:45
Send private message

I'm sure we will find out soon enough what the true cause of the accident was. Air crash investigations don't take two weeks!

 

If even a small % of cars on the road these days were self driving, but lets say a majority, you would assume the death rate would go down on average. Is it possible for the overall rate to go down while your own personal risk of death (being in a self-driving car) goes up because of the programming unknowns? 

 

It's not just about deaths though. Self driving cars are better drivers than humans - a study found adding just a couple of self-driving cars to traffic will even out traffic flows as they are not stop-start like many human drivers are. 


gzt

gzt
11670 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #1984499 27-Mar-2018 20:49
Send private message

An entirely hypothetical study.

debo
235 posts

Master Geek


  #1984503 27-Mar-2018 20:54
Send private message

I went to street view to look at accident site. The red arrow shows the path of the cyclist.  The blue arrow shows a bike / pedestrian pathway.  The green arrow shows a sign indicating cars to "yield to bikes". I guess Uber cars can't read road signs either.

 


debo
235 posts

Master Geek


  #1984506 27-Mar-2018 21:02
Send private message

Here is a close up of the pathway. There is a sign saying to "use crosswalk". How can one use the crosswalk, if there is no pathway to get to the crosswalk?  Looks like a poorly designed road.

 


itxtme
1779 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

  #1984529 27-Mar-2018 22:07
Send private message

Debo, I believe the yeild to bikes sign indicates dont pull into the right turning lane (20m up the road)without giving way to bikes that are in the inner "cycle" lane, it is not related to someone walking across the road with their bike.


1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic





News »

Nanoleaf enhances lighting line with launch of Triangles and Mini Triangles
Posted 17-Oct-2020 20:18


Synology unveils DS1621+ 
Posted 17-Oct-2020 20:12


Ingram Micro introduces FootfallCam to New Zealand channel
Posted 17-Oct-2020 20:06


Dropbox adopts Virtual First working policy
Posted 17-Oct-2020 19:47


OPPO announces Reno4 Series 5G line-up in NZ
Posted 16-Oct-2020 08:52


Microsoft Highway to a Hundred expands to Asia Pacific
Posted 14-Oct-2020 09:34


Spark turns on 5G in Auckland
Posted 14-Oct-2020 09:29


AMD Launches AMD Ryzen 5000 Series Desktop Processors
Posted 9-Oct-2020 10:13


Teletrac Navman launches integrated multi-camera solution for transport and logistics industry
Posted 8-Oct-2020 10:57


Farmside hits 10,000 RBI customers
Posted 7-Oct-2020 15:32


NordVPN starts deploying colocated servers
Posted 7-Oct-2020 09:00


Google introduces Nest Wifi routers in New Zealand
Posted 7-Oct-2020 05:00


Orcon to bundle Google Nest Wifi router with new accounts
Posted 7-Oct-2020 05:00


Epay and Centrapay partner to create digital gift cards
Posted 2-Oct-2020 17:34


Inseego launches 5G MiFi M2000 mobile hotspot
Posted 2-Oct-2020 14:53









Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.


Support Geekzone »

Our community of supporters help make Geekzone possible. Click the button below to join them.

Support Geezone on PressPatron



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.