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Wiggum
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  #2047212 2-Jul-2018 09:19
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MikeB4:

 

The Expressway after only a year looks more like a 20 year old B road. The tax payer is due a refund on that project

 

 

Not sure which expressway you referring to here Mike? But the one I drive on everyday is of exceptional good quality and was worth every cent IMO. Sure there have been some problems with leaking etc which are getting fixed.. But looks like a 20year old road? Come on ..... Stop your trolling.


tdgeek
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  #2047214 2-Jul-2018 09:24
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MikeB4:

 

tdgeek:

 

 

 

As I see it, the framework of the deal has already been locked down, and that included a toll. Its a bit late now to re do the deal. NZTA also recommended a tool as if it was too easy and cheap to use the new road, more will use it, and take away public transport use, then public transport loses viability, and the new road takes on traffic that did not previously exist. Against that is another cost to the public to pay for the toll

 

 

The National Party transport spokesman has said that the funding model used when the green light was given for the road was that toll charges would be avoided. Now we are looking at a double hit with toll charges and a new excise(tax) mooted by local bodies. All these new transport costs are going to put pressure on the CPI as these costs will be passed onto consumers, a triple hit.

 

 

Agree

 

But, who should pay?  Toll, or fuel tax, or the central Govt, or local Govt? Someone has to pay, and at the end of the day the public will pay. Either directly, or via higher transport costs adding onto freight (although its been stated here that freight might be cheaper as fuel savings exceed toll costs) or via Govt funding which remove funding for other functions.

 

NZ cannot afford everything, so it comes down to how locally targeted the costs should be. If that route is used by N.I and S.I freight, you could argue its a national cost for all of us, but not much (as its on all of us) But add a local fuel tax or toll on to allow some non business user pays


 
 
 
 


trig42
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  #2047215 2-Jul-2018 09:25
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DarthKermit:

 

Transmission Gully will be a great alternative to get back out of Welly, but I'd hate to see the congestion it's gonna cause south of the new Linden interchange. There won't be any extra vehicles in total going into Welly but many more of them will be travelling into Welly at the same time. Do these road planners not realise this?

 

 

No, they wont have learnt anything. They did the same when SH20 linked up to SH1 at Manukau - a new two lane motorway joining the existing three lane motorway (going south). any extra lanes? No show. In fact, at Hill road it went down to two lanes. They are fixing it now, but that is still a few months away and this motorway was linked up a few years ago now.


Lias
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  #2047217 2-Jul-2018 09:29
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As someone who lives in Kapiti, and commutes daily to Tawa, this news has inspired feelings in me that can only be described as "unquenchable homicidal rage". The word filter and the FUG prevent me from expressing my true desires, but suffice to say that I would like some time alone with some Labour politicians, and to quote Pulp Fiction "a pair of pliers and a blowtorch".





GV27
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  #2047218 2-Jul-2018 09:32
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MikeB4:

 

GV27:

 

MikeB4:

 

Tip, try and discuss without being snotty.

 

SH1, runs right through the centre of Wellington from the planes north and south. It is the main route for trade for ALL NZ so any additional costs added at Wellington will affect prices for ALL NZ. 

 

 

Again, there is a toll road in North Auckland on SH1. For all intents and purposes, it is the same road. I'm asking what makes Wellington special, given that trucks filling up in Auckland (also the main economic centre of the country) are subjected to a regional fuel tax; solely in place because the Govt didn't want to pay Auckland back for the decades they stripped out more than they put back in.

 

 

Puhoi is not the main transport hub for NZ. ALL transport from the North to the South does not go through there and vice versa.That is the difference.

 

 

I don't think stuff getting shipped out of POAL goes through Wellington. I think you'll find that it is however on the route between Marsden Pt and the rest of the country. In fact I'm fairly sure that Auckland and Tauranga move more freight than the rest of the country combined. 


tdgeek
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  #2047219 2-Jul-2018 09:32
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Lias:

 

As someone who lives in Kapiti, and commutes daily to Tawa, this news has inspired feelings in me that can only be described as "unquenchable homicidal rage". The word filter and the FUG prevent me from expressing my true desires, but suffice to say that I would like some time alone with some Labour politicians, and to quote Pulp Fiction "a pair of pliers and a blowtorch".

 

 

A very informative post. Just lacking the informative bit.


Lias
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  #2047223 2-Jul-2018 09:34
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tdgeek:

 

Lias:

 

As someone who lives in Kapiti, and commutes daily to Tawa, this news has inspired feelings in me that can only be described as "unquenchable homicidal rage". The word filter and the FUG prevent me from expressing my true desires, but suffice to say that I would like some time alone with some Labour politicians, and to quote Pulp Fiction "a pair of pliers and a blowtorch".

 

 

A very informative post. Just lacking the informative bit.

 

 

I think the only appropriate response to that is *loud raspberry noise*





 
 
 
 


MikeB4
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  #2047226 2-Jul-2018 09:36
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Wiggum:

MikeB4:


The Expressway after only a year looks more like a 20 year old B road. The tax payer is due a refund on that project



Not sure which expressway you referring to here Mike? But the one I drive on everyday is of exceptional good quality and was worth every cent IMO. Sure there have been some problems with leaking etc which are getting fixed.. But looks like a 20year old road? Come on ..... Stop your trolling.



It's that long strip of tar seal between PekaPeka and McKays that has been constantly repaired and now a huge percentage has to be resealed due to poor construction. All in twelve months of opening.

tdgeek
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  #2047227 2-Jul-2018 09:39
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Lias:

 

tdgeek:

 

Lias:

 

As someone who lives in Kapiti, and commutes daily to Tawa, this news has inspired feelings in me that can only be described as "unquenchable homicidal rage". The word filter and the FUG prevent me from expressing my true desires, but suffice to say that I would like some time alone with some Labour politicians, and to quote Pulp Fiction "a pair of pliers and a blowtorch".

 

 

A very informative post. Just lacking the informative bit.

 

 

I think the only appropriate response to that is *loud raspberry noise*

 

 

You should have put what your issue is, and why, and what you feel is the solution.


Handle9
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  #2047238 2-Jul-2018 09:43
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sbiddle:

 

Handle9:

 

It doesn't appear to be a huge shock - it appears to have been signaled for quite some time.

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10615848

 

https://www.transport.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Our-Work/Documents/Transmission-Gully-PPP-Cabinet-Nov-2012.pdf

 

 

 

 

In the early days Transmission Gully was going to be a toll road simply because it went nowhere for ~40 years until it ended up being funded by National.

 

The road will end up being a white elephant if it does become a toll road because plenty of people will simply choose to use the current route. All it will take is ~20% of traffic to be removed at peak hour (people who will opt to use the toll road) and the current SH1 route will have much of the congestion removed.

 

 

People said that Albany to Puhoi would be a white elephant. The road gets well used and most people pay the toll for the convenience.


Wiggum
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  #2047239 2-Jul-2018 09:44
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MikeB4:
Wiggum:

 

MikeB4:

 

 

 

The Expressway after only a year looks more like a 20 year old B road. The tax payer is due a refund on that project

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure which expressway you referring to here Mike? But the one I drive on everyday is of exceptional good quality and was worth every cent IMO. Sure there have been some problems with leaking etc which are getting fixed.. But looks like a 20year old road? Come on ..... Stop your trolling.

 



It's that long strip of tar seal between PekaPeka and McKays that has been constantly repaired and now a huge percentage has to be resealed due to poor construction. All in twelve months of opening.

 

The part between Waikanae and Peka Peka was just getting an upgrade to make it smoother and quieter.  South of Waikanae Road already has the noise reducing seal. 

 

NIMBY's in Peka Peka were moaning about the noise of the chip seal. This work was done to satisfy their complaints. South of waikanae offramp is getting some work done yes.. Parts are leaking.


UHD

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  #2047240 2-Jul-2018 09:45
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tdgeek:

 

UHD:

 

Wiggum:

 

UHD:

 

The road has already been paid for out of taxes for a half century.

 

 

If that were true then surely we would not be borrowing money to get it build? Or need the private sector to chip in to help pay for it.

 

 

 

 

The private sector investment was accepted in order to remove the need for tolls on the road. A bit disingenuous for Labour to now say they are necessary and always part of the plan.

 

 

Not really

 

"We were critical of the previous Government's financing of Transmission Gully through a public-private partnership because it increased costs over the life of the project," he said.

 

"Now that the project is going ahead under the former Government's arrangements, it may make sense to establish a revenue source to off-set some of those costs."

 

 

 

As I see it, the framework of the deal has already been locked down, and that included a toll. Its a bit late now to re do the deal. NZTA also recommended a tool as if it was too easy and cheap to use the new road, more will use it, and take away public transport use, then public transport loses viability, and the new road takes on traffic that did not previously exist. Against that is another cost to the public to pay for the toll

 

 

At the time of the green light, the national minister said the PPP removed the need for tolls on the project. Tolls were investigated as a way to recover revenue in the case that the government had to foot the entire bill.


Wiggum
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  #2047248 2-Jul-2018 09:55
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UHD:

 

At the time of the green light, the national minister said the PPP removed the need for tolls on the project. Tolls were investigated as a way to recover revenue in the case that the government had to foot the entire bill.

 

 

Yes. But tolls were never ruled out.

 

 

Mr Brownlee says that while tolling will not be part of the PPP contract for Transmission Gully, he has requested the NZTA investigate the merits of tolling the route in order to offset some of the costs of construction.

 

“The NZTA will look into the details of a tolling scheme in the New Year, and a decision on tolling will be made separately; progressing Transmission Gully as a PPP is not dependent on tolling the route.”

 

https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/green-light-transmission-gully-ppp

 

 


MikeB4
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  #2047253 2-Jul-2018 10:00
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@Wiggum I am not referring to any work being done to reduce noise. If you actually drive along that road you would have seen the whitish stains appearing on the tar seal most of its length. That is water damage due to poor construction. There has been many announcements regarding this and the need to reseal a large percentage of the highway with the costs being shared between the contractor, Local bodies and the tax payer.


Wiggum
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  #2047255 2-Jul-2018 10:06
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MikeB4:

 

@Wiggum I am not referring to any work being done to reduce noise. If you actually drive along that road you would have seen the whitish stains appearing on the tar seal most of its length. That is water damage due to poor construction. There has been many announcements regarding this and the need to reseal a large percentage of the highway with the costs being shared between the contractor, Local bodies and the tax payer.

 

 

Yes, those white stains are where its leaking, and getting fixed. And for now, they are stains and not much more. There is a part with such stains between Waikanae Rd and paraparumu Rd, Its not the complete length like you make out. Part of the problem IMO being the noise reducing seal. Does it makes the road look 20 years old? Maybe to you, not to me. The road is a pleasure to drive.


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