Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | ... | 21
15358 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2984
Inactive user


  Reply # 2095578 24-Sep-2018 14:57
Send private message quote this post

Benjip:

 

Silly (but genuine) question – what's to stop the likes of Tesla increasing the price of their vehicles by whatever amount the subsidy provides?

 

Eg. Government says "here's a $15,000 cheque with which to buy an EV", Tesla just puts up their prices by $15k per model?

 

(Assuming they are happy/content with current sales levels which I imagine they are due to the Model 3 production delays/restraints).

 

 

No

 

They want sales, happy for a Govt to stump up some R+D

 

Forget Tesla they are overpriced and not a great build quality. Buy from a car manufacturer


582 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 201

Subscriber

  Reply # 2095580 24-Sep-2018 14:59
Send private message quote this post

tdgeek:

 

Benjip:

 

Silly (but genuine) question – what's to stop the likes of Tesla increasing the price of their vehicles by whatever amount the subsidy provides?

 

Eg. Government says "here's a $15,000 cheque with which to buy an EV", Tesla just puts up their prices by $15k per model?

 

(Assuming they are happy/content with current sales levels which I imagine they are due to the Model 3 production delays/restraints).

 

 

No

 

They want sales, happy for a Govt to stump up some R+D

 

Forget Tesla they are overpriced and not a great build quality. Buy from a car manufacturer

 

 

I'm with you there 100%, they were just the biggest example I could think of. You wouldn't catch me dead in a shoddy Tesla.


 
 
 
 


1524 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 231


  Reply # 2095599 24-Sep-2018 15:30
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

frankv:

 

networkn:

 

tdgeek:

 

Initially low, maybe no taxes, that's probably part of the incentive.

 

 

Great, so the majority of NZ will subsidise them, seems fair. 

 

 

Presumably the Govt has done (or will do) the math so that the cost of incentives is balanced by the reduction in cost to the taxpayer of mitigating the effect of burning fossil fuels. So, in point of fact, the EV users won't be subsidising the petrol fuel drivers.

 

 

 

 

Its taken 9 years in Opposition and 1 year in Government to reach the idea of having incentives for EV's.  How long do you think it will take to do the math?  Or do you think that the concept of a fiscally neutral, non-distortionary subsidy will be abandoned in favour of headline politics?

 

Recall that the previous government abandoned the idea of reducing vehicle emissions through testing/compliance because it cost-disadvantaged those that owned older, cheaper polluting cars.  How do you incentivise improving the aging fleet while not hurting your voting constituents?  


gzt

10613 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1714


  Reply # 2095643 24-Sep-2018 16:55
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

frednz: So perhaps it may pay to hold-off buying a new EV until these incentives come into force?

and might pay to put off buying second hand. Hard to know if second hand will be cash incentive or tax incentive of some kind at this point or just talk about the existing ruc exempt in practice situation.

no doubt they had a reason for this announcement probably some final external work complete and publication started.

5369 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2198


  Reply # 2095647 24-Sep-2018 16:57
2 people support this post
Send private message quote this post

Govt subsidies inflate prices (e.g. insulation subsidies).

 

A subsidy doesn't address lack of supply of EVs, which is a factor external to NZ.

 

Nissan make about 50,000 leafs per year - only some of which are RHD.

 

Tesla couldn't organise a party in a brewery when it comes to production.

 

A Hyudnai would need a 20k - 40k rebate to make the purchase price equate to the ICEV price.





Mike

gzt

10613 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1714


  Reply # 2095650 24-Sep-2018 17:02
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

The predicted demand curve allows manufacturers to plan and increase production appropriately. Unrelated Nissan is about to free capacity for increased RHD production anyway.

3981 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2686

Trusted
Spark NZ

  Reply # 2095651 24-Sep-2018 17:06
4 people support this post
Send private message quote this post

Brilliant, I can't wait for all the low income earners to subsidise my EV purchase. I can't see how to spin this that doesn't equate to those that can afford an EV (Even a second hand leaf isn't anything like the price of an affordable, reasonably efficient reliable car) getting subsidised by those that have no economic choice but to remain with petrol or diesel engines.

 

But hey, It's green right?

 

Cheers - N


3529 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1465

Subscriber

  Reply # 2095703 24-Sep-2018 18:26
2 people support this post
Send private message quote this post

Talkiet:

Brilliant, I can't wait for all the low income earners to subsidise my EV purchase. I can't see how to spin this that doesn't equate to those that can afford an EV (Even a second hand leaf isn't anything like the price of an affordable, reasonably efficient reliable car) getting subsidised by those that have no economic choice but to remain with petrol or diesel engines.


But hey, It's green right?


Cheers - N



And also subsidized by those who can't buy an EV. Because suitable EV models just don't exist. Still waiting for an EV Ute. And there is very poor choice of EV Vans available.

I think that any new subsidies should be better spent on more public charging. Maybe on the basis of matching dollar for dollar, the revenue that the owner of a public charger receives from paid charging.

This method will ensure that new chargers get built where demand is the greatest.





15358 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2984
Inactive user


  Reply # 2095708 24-Sep-2018 18:31
Send private message quote this post

Aredwood:
Talkiet:

 

Brilliant, I can't wait for all the low income earners to subsidise my EV purchase. I can't see how to spin this that doesn't equate to those that can afford an EV (Even a second hand leaf isn't anything like the price of an affordable, reasonably efficient reliable car) getting subsidised by those that have no economic choice but to remain with petrol or diesel engines.

 

 

 

But hey, It's green right?

 

 

 

Cheers - N

 



And also subsidized by those who can't buy an EV. Because suitable EV models just don't exist. Still waiting for an EV Ute. And there is very poor choice of EV Vans available.

I think that any new subsidies should be better spent on more public charging. Maybe on the basis of matching dollar for dollar, the revenue that the owner of a public charger receives from paid charging.

This method will ensure that new chargers get built where demand is the greatest.

 

How can you use funds to subsidise charging when the rationale is not to incentive EVs?


4250 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 825

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 2095711 24-Sep-2018 18:34
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

Given the state of the NZ vehicle fleet I would have thought that getting the clapped out old bangers off the roads would be the most effective way to reduce emissions, especially old diesel four wheel drives.

 

Removing the oldest vehicles from the fleet would also have a positive safety outcome.


15358 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2984
Inactive user


  Reply # 2095712 24-Sep-2018 18:35
Send private message quote this post

ockel:

 

frankv:

 

networkn:

 

tdgeek:

 

Initially low, maybe no taxes, that's probably part of the incentive.

 

 

Great, so the majority of NZ will subsidise them, seems fair. 

 

 

Presumably the Govt has done (or will do) the math so that the cost of incentives is balanced by the reduction in cost to the taxpayer of mitigating the effect of burning fossil fuels. So, in point of fact, the EV users won't be subsidising the petrol fuel drivers.

 

 

 

 

Its taken 9 years in Opposition and 1 year in Government to reach the idea of having incentives for EV's.  How long do you think it will take to do the math?  Or do you think that the concept of a fiscally neutral, non-distortionary subsidy will be abandoned in favour of headline politics?

 

Recall that the previous government abandoned the idea of reducing vehicle emissions through testing/compliance because it cost-disadvantaged those that owned older, cheaper polluting cars.  How do you incentivise improving the aging fleet while not hurting your voting constituents?  

 

 

The previous Govt introduced incentives for EV's. The current Govt has kept it. Not all topics need to be a political bandwagon. Pollution and fuel costs affect everyone.  I see no issue with any Govt supporting less pollution and reducing oil imports. Given the supply, and the initial outlay its a tough sell, or should we just be weak and flag what both Govts have put forward?


15358 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2984
Inactive user


  Reply # 2095714 24-Sep-2018 18:36
Send private message quote this post

alasta:

 

Given the state of the NZ vehicle fleet I would have thought that getting the clapped out old bangers off the roads would be the most effective way to reduce emissions, especially old diesel four wheel drives.

 

Removing the oldest vehicles from the fleet would also have a positive safety outcome.

 

 

A good idea, how would you do that? Tax the lower income earners? 


818 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 369


  Reply # 2095715 24-Sep-2018 18:39
Send private message quote this post

tdgeek:

 

alasta:

 

Given the state of the NZ vehicle fleet I would have thought that getting the clapped out old bangers off the roads would be the most effective way to reduce emissions, especially old diesel four wheel drives.

 

Removing the oldest vehicles from the fleet would also have a positive safety outcome.

 

 

A good idea, how would you do that? Tax the lower income earners? 

 

 

Surely everyone driving an old car is just doing it for the hipster cred right? 


15358 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2984
Inactive user


  Reply # 2095716 24-Sep-2018 18:45
Send private message quote this post

GV27:

 

tdgeek:

 

alasta:

 

Given the state of the NZ vehicle fleet I would have thought that getting the clapped out old bangers off the roads would be the most effective way to reduce emissions, especially old diesel four wheel drives.

 

Removing the oldest vehicles from the fleet would also have a positive safety outcome.

 

 

A good idea, how would you do that? Tax the lower income earners? 

 

 

Surely everyone driving an old car is just doing it for the hipster cred right? 

 

 

Lol probably! These days old Jap cars are dirt cheap and they will run forever. I see no issue with older cars. Cheap, still economical. 


818 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 369


  Reply # 2095717 24-Sep-2018 18:46
Send private message quote this post

tdgeek:

 

GV27:

 

tdgeek:

 

alasta:

 

Given the state of the NZ vehicle fleet I would have thought that getting the clapped out old bangers off the roads would be the most effective way to reduce emissions, especially old diesel four wheel drives.

 

Removing the oldest vehicles from the fleet would also have a positive safety outcome.

 

 

A good idea, how would you do that? Tax the lower income earners? 

 

 

Surely everyone driving an old car is just doing it for the hipster cred right? 

 

 

Lol probably! These days old Jap cars are dirt cheap and they will run forever. I see no issue with older cars. Cheap, still economical. 

 

 

Your can't depreciate if it's already worthless meme goes here. 


1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | ... | 21
Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic


Donate via Givealittle


Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

Amazon introduces new Kindle with adjustable front light
Posted 21-Mar-2019 20:14


A call from the companies providing internet access for the great majority of New Zealanders, to the companies with the greatest influence over social media content
Posted 19-Mar-2019 15:21


Two e-scooter companies selected for Wellington trial
Posted 15-Mar-2019 17:33


GeForce GTX 1660 available now
Posted 15-Mar-2019 08:47


Artificial Intelligence to double the rate of innovation in New Zealand by 2021
Posted 13-Mar-2019 14:47


LG demonstrates smart home concepts at LG InnoFest
Posted 13-Mar-2019 14:45


New Zealanders buying more expensive smartphones
Posted 11-Mar-2019 09:52


2degrees Offers Amazon Prime Video to Broadband Customers
Posted 8-Mar-2019 14:10


D-Link ANZ launches D-Fend AC2600 Wi-Fi Router Protected by McAfee
Posted 7-Mar-2019 11:09


Slingshot commissions celebrities to design new modems
Posted 5-Mar-2019 08:58


Symantec Annual Threat Report reveals more ambitious, destructive and stealthy attacks
Posted 28-Feb-2019 10:14


FUJIFILM launches high performing X-T30
Posted 28-Feb-2019 09:40


Netflix is killing content piracy says research
Posted 28-Feb-2019 09:33


Trend Micro finds shifting threats require kiwis to rethink security priorities
Posted 28-Feb-2019 09:27


Mainfreight uses Spark IoT Asset Tracking service
Posted 28-Feb-2019 09:25



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.


Support Geekzone »

Our community of supporters help make Geekzone possible. Click the button below to join them.

Support Geezone on PressPatron



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.