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873 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 2255591 10-Jun-2019 21:56
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A car fan I know told me recently that although the tesla has a 'fun' ludicrous mode it causes so much battery heating that the car is unable to maintain 'performance' use for long periods.

 

He said something like 'one drag run' requires a cool down period of X minutes (where X is way to long to be fun).

 

 

 

GZ: please confirm or deny.


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Ultimate Geek


  # 2255595 10-Jun-2019 22:01
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Batman:

And if you're in Invercargill?


Doesn't look like they have anything in Invercargil yet...have they moved on from horses down there yet? Dunedin looks to be the closest.

 
 
 
 


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  # 2255607 10-Jun-2019 22:14
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elpenguino:

A car fan I know told me recently that although the tesla has a 'fun' ludicrous mode it causes so much battery heating that the car is unable to maintain 'performance' use for long periods.


He said something like 'one drag run' requires a cool down period of X minutes (where X is way to long to be fun).


 


GZ: please confirm or deny.



Model S yes after more than a few (0-100 in 2.3s) launches. Model 3 doesn't have this problem.

And the car does warn you when entering ludicrous mode that it may shorten the battery/motor life.

But really, once you buy this thing, how often is the average NZ driver really going to go through the centre console to activate ludicrous mode?

Source: YouTube

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  # 2255712 11-Jun-2019 07:44
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As they say "the proof's in the pudding": Tesla records the accelerator and brake positions.

You could argue it recorded in error, or there was a bad switch. I assume the dealer checked the accelerator after the accident.

The driver probably moved his foot, thinking he was pressing the brake, when in fact he was still pressing the accelerator.

When he accelerated, he pressed the "brake" hard.

It's a pretty common error. There an estimated 16,000 accidents per year in the US. I must admit I did it once myself, but caught it quick enough not to have an accident.

It's not always a driver error, but I'd say most of the time it is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudden_unintended_acceleration

I'd argue that as self-driving cars get more common, there'll be a lot of frivolous lawsuits where the manufacturer gets blamed every time there's an accident.

I know medical doctors in the States will usually pay any lawsuit before going to court, if the suit is in the $5,000 - $10,000 range.; It's cheaper and involves more convenient than defending it. Lawyers know this, so will use tactics like asking for extension on the trial date, to screw with the doctor's time.

This $5,000 - $10,000 lawsuit range is in the magic spot for many car accidents also: too cheap to be bothered to defend.

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  # 2255714 11-Jun-2019 07:59
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kingdragonfly: As they say "the proof's in the pudding": Tesla records the accelerator and brake positions.

You could argue it recorded in error, or there was a bad switch. I assume the dealer checked the accelerator after the accident.

The driver probably moved his foot, thinking he was pressing the brake, when in fact he was still pressing the accelerator.

When he accelerated, he pressed the "brake" hard.

It's a pretty common error. I must admit I did it once myself, but caught it quick enough not to have an accident.

It's not always a driver error, but I'd say most of the time it is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudden_unintended_acceleration

 

I didnt mention the brake although as you say, it makes sense. Why I didnt is that no one would press a pedal to the floor. If you press the brake as you enter the garage, its hardly a nudge. But yes accidents happen.


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  # 2255726 11-Jun-2019 08:36
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tdgeek:

 

I didnt mention the brake although as you say, it makes sense. Why I didnt is that no one would press a pedal to the floor. If you press the brake as you enter the garage, its hardly a nudge. But yes accidents happen.

 

 

What's the basis for this highlighted bit?

 

I can totally see it is a possibility that a driver, feeling the urgent need to stop as fast as possible, would press the brake pedal as far as it can go; if they've got their pedals confused, the result could well be the flooring of the accelerator pedal.


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  # 2255728 11-Jun-2019 08:39
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jonathan18:

 

tdgeek:

 

I didnt mention the brake although as you say, it makes sense. Why I didnt is that no one would press a pedal to the floor. If you press the brake as you enter the garage, its hardly a nudge. But yes accidents happen.

 

 

What's the basis for this highlighted bit?

 

I can totally see it is a possibility that a driver, feeling the urgent need to stop as fast as possible, would press the brake pedal as far as it can go; if they've got their pedals confused, the result could well be the flooring of the accelerator pedal.

 

 

In retrospect I agree. I got thrown off by the wholesale denial of Tesla.


 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek


  # 2255743 11-Jun-2019 09:31
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Oof, Audi and Jaguar are having to do recalls on their latest EVs for some build quality issue:

 

https://insideevs.com/news/353790/audi-recall-e-tron-charging-water-fire/

 

https://www.cars.com/articles/2019-2020-jaguar-i-pace-recall-alert-403454/

 

It's worth noting that the Model 3 also had a breaking issue in early models however a trip to the dealer wasn't required since the update was pushed over the air to the cars within a week.


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  # 2255745 11-Jun-2019 09:35
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Do you mean build quality or a fault?

 

Build quality in this thread relates to an inherent lower overall build quality. Mentioned often with Tesla here and elsewhere. Faults does not equal build quality. All cars have had faults or recalls.

 

But defend away


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Ultimate Geek


  # 2255784 11-Jun-2019 09:40
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tdgeek:

 

Do you mean build quality or a fault?

 

Build quality in this thread relates to an inherent lower overall build quality. Mentioned often with Tesla here and elsewhere. Faults does not equal build quality. All cars have had faults or recalls.

 

But defend away

 

 

Alright mate ;)

 

To me, a leaking charge port is a quality issue and a fairly big one considering the current going through that area. 


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  # 2255785 11-Jun-2019 09:46
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Obraik:

 

tdgeek:

 

Do you mean build quality or a fault?

 

Build quality in this thread relates to an inherent lower overall build quality. Mentioned often with Tesla here and elsewhere. Faults does not equal build quality. All cars have had faults or recalls.

 

But defend away

 

 

Alright mate ;)

 

To me, a leaking charge port is a quality issue and a fairly big one considering the current going through that area. 

 

 

Koolaid is fine, I used to drink that with my Apple stuff!  :-)     If there were issues all over the car, then that's quality. If its generally a once only issue, its a fault. Otherwise you'd have to say that no product that existed or has ever existed is good quality


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Uber Geek


  # 2255796 11-Jun-2019 09:56
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Obraik: It's worth noting that the Model 3 also had a breaking issue in early models however a trip to the dealer wasn't required since the update was pushed over the air to the cars within a week.



https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/2/17413732/tesla-over-the-air-software-updates-brakes

Tesla can change so much with over-the-air updates that it’s messing with some owners’ heads

Praise for a recent software fix to the Model 3’s braking is met with worry that different update slowed some customers’ cars

By Sean O'Kane

When Consumer Reports recently found that the braking distance on the Tesla Model 3 was worse than that of a Ford F-150, CEO Elon Musk took the criticism and found a solution. Days later, Tesla shipped an over-the-air update that, according to Consumer Reports’s testing, improved the braking distance by 19 feet. It’s a wild idea: your car automatically downloads some code, and it’s instantly safer. It also wasn’t possible even a few years ago, and some have held it up as an ideal example of how futuristic technologies can make our lives better. Analysts said it was “unheard of.” Jake Fisher, Consumer Reports’s director of auto testing (and the person who originally flagged the issue), said he’d “never seen a car that could improve its track performance with an over-the-air update.”

Others, like Navigant Research’s Sam Abuelsamid, looked at the recent Model 3 braking distance issue as a sign of a larger problem with Tesla’s quality control. He wrote this week that the fact there was that much room for improvement on the braking capabilities of the car shows there’s something “fundamentally broken in what they were doing” with the Model 3. Shouldn’t Tesla, which by now has made and sold over 300,000 cars around the globe, have caught this problem before Consumer Reports did?

We don’t yet know why the Model 3’s braking was underperforming, and we may never know. That matters less than what the update actually signaled.

Tesla has shipped OTA updates to its cars for years now that have changed everything from its Autopilot driver assistance system to the layout and look of its touchscreen interfaces. At one point last year, it even used an update to extend the range of some cars to help customers evacuate the path of Hurricane Irma.

This week was different, though, because it showed just how far the company can go with those updates. With a swift change in the software, the company showed it can reach as deep as the systems that control the brakes. It creates the feeling that you could get out of your car one night, and by the time you get back in the next morning, the car could do some things — maybe everything — in a totally different way.

Tesla is ahead of other carmakers when it comes OTA updates — just look at the recent mini FCA fiasco. But being on the frontline of a new technology means that you have to deal with problems that no one else has encountered, and find answers to questions that people are asking for the first time.

Take this one, posted just a few weeks ago Tesla’s own official forums: ”Did Tesla just slow down our cars?”

In the thread, owners point to how a recent update (specifically 2018.18.3, released in the middle of May) lines up with what could be the possibility that their Model 3s don’t quite accelerate with as much kick as they did before.

“It seems in the latest update that my Model 3 is much slower off the line,” the original poster writes. “It doesn’t throw you into the seat like it used to!”

Then the worry sets in. “Did Tesla purposefully reduce acceleration? Can we please get it back?”

“My car is one of the ones who has definitely lost its ‘oomph.’ It is not near as fast as it was prior to the upgrade,” another owner writes. “When I would hit the gas pedal from a complete stop, it would throw our heads back into the headrests, it was that fast! Now it no longer does that.”

Some have veered into conspiracy territory, noting that the perceived acceleration change happened right around the same time that Tesla announced a new “performance” version of the Model 3. “Frankly, nothing Tesla does at this point would surprise me. This would fit perfectly into their ongoing campaign to ‘disappear’ the $35,000 base model, and upsell everyone to the $87k fully loaded model,” a different user writes.

No one seems to have come up with anything other than anecdotal evidence to support these claims. And plenty others say they haven’t noticed a difference. “I don’t feel like the performance changed at all,” one poster writes. “Still pulls like a bat out of hell! Loving this car so much.”

Tesla says it didn’t tinker with anything in the update. In a statement to The Verge, a spokesperson for Tesla said the “Model 3’s acceleration capability remains unchanged.”

But forget for a moment the question of whether Tesla toyed with the Model 3’s acceleration. Something else is happening, and it suggests Tesla has once again charted new territory for an automaker.

By adopting the behavior of issuing regular OTA software updates — ones that can apparently affect things so deep in the car that the company can demonstrably improve braking distance — Tesla has started to open itself up to the same kinds of controversies and conspiracies that some consumer electronics giants have famously dealt with.
...

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  # 2255804 11-Jun-2019 10:05
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Wow, that's poor design, don't they test anything?? It seems not

 

 

 


When Consumer Reports recently found that the braking distance on the Tesla Model 3 was worse than that of a Ford F-150, CEO Elon Musk took the criticism and found a solution. Days later, Tesla shipped an over-the-air update that, according to Consumer Reports’s testing, improved the braking distance by 19 feet. It’s a wild idea: your car automatically downloads some code, and it’s instantly safer


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  # 2255805 11-Jun-2019 10:06
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Hey, at least the "Good braking" DLC wasn't a premium pay for feature :-)

 

 

 

N.

 

 





--

 

Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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Ultimate Geek


  # 2255810 11-Jun-2019 10:14
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tdgeek:

 

Obraik:

 

tdgeek:

 

Do you mean build quality or a fault?

 

Build quality in this thread relates to an inherent lower overall build quality. Mentioned often with Tesla here and elsewhere. Faults does not equal build quality. All cars have had faults or recalls.

 

But defend away

 

 

Alright mate ;)

 

To me, a leaking charge port is a quality issue and a fairly big one considering the current going through that area. 

 

 

Koolaid is fine, I used to drink that with my Apple stuff!  :-)     If there were issues all over the car, then that's quality. If its generally a once only issue, its a fault. Otherwise you'd have to say that no product that existed or has ever existed is good quality

 

 

All I'm saying is that other EV manufacturers aren't faultless, even those that have been making cars for decades. At least in Tesla's case the quality issues are really just paint and panel gaps, not life threatening quality issues like in the Etron.  


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