Can an EV replace a Subaru Outback?

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › Can an EV replace a Subaru Outback?

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#2732103 21-Jun-2021 15:44

jonathan18:

Has the range of the base 57 kWh Ioniq 5 been announced yet? That’s the biggest limiting factor for me; while it may be eligible for the rebate, that’s immaterial if the range means it’s not fit for (our) purpose. (I think I could cope with the slower acceleration and lower power; I’m certainly looking forward to seeing these in the flesh, and ideally taking one for a spin...)

Yes. Range for 58kWh RWD ioniq 5 is 384km WLTP. Oddly they put the rated range low down in the specs under the sustainability tab.

From having spend a little time in a Kona, and based on that I would expect this car to get the rated range in the real world.

As I said prior, it is a real pity that the $80k rebate cap exists. If there wasn't the cap the cost to step up to the 72kWh would be $10k, and for many that would represent value, given the greater motor power (160kW vs 125kW), longer range (481km), and greater tow rating (1600kg vs 750kg)

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Batman

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#2732184 21-Jun-2021 17:21

Obraik:

This year at that budget? No.

Never never ever at that budget (55k), unless the Chinese cars make them, then it might be possible. Current Chinese MG SUV is 2WD 110kw range of 250kms at 50k. Lithium is a very rare metal. It's going to get even more rare.

jarledb

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#2732198 21-Jun-2021 17:53

Batman:

Lithium is a very rare metal. It's going to get even more rare.

Nope

https://www.leadingthecharge.org.nz/do_we_have_enough_rare_earth_metals_for_evs

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Batman

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#2732204 21-Jun-2021 18:12

jarledb:

Batman:

Lithium is a very rare metal. It's going to get even more rare.

Nope

https://www.leadingthecharge.org.nz/do_we_have_enough_rare_earth_metals_for_evs

time will tell

Obraik

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#2732208 21-Jun-2021 18:19

Batman:

Never never ever at that budget (55k), unless the Chinese cars make them, then it might be possible. Current Chinese MG SUV is 2WD 110kw range of 250kms at 50k. Lithium is a very rare metal. It's going to get even more rare.

EV prices are only going down. I'd say in the next couple years the options mentioned here will be getting close if not at OPs specified budget.

As for lithium being rare? No, lol

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#2732210 21-Jun-2021 18:19

Batman:

Lithium is a very rare metal. It's going to get even more rare.

dead dinosaurs are very rare as well….

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#2732214 21-Jun-2021 18:25

Batman:

time will tell

Sure will.

BBC: The new 'gold rush' for green lithium

Geothermal brine is a hot, concentrated saline solution that has circulated through very hot rocks and become enriched with elements such as lithium, boron and potassium. In other words, the energy-intensive process of extracting lithium from solid rock is powered by naturally occurring geothermal energy. The brine in the Cornish mines has concentrations of up to 260 milligrams per litre, flowing at a rate of between 40-60 litres (8.1 to 13.7 gallons) per second. That works out as about enough lithium for a typical smartphone battery (2-3g) passing through the production process every few seconds, according to Cornish Lithium’s estimates.

...

Technological advances are also helping to make it possible to extract lithium from brine. The team is planning to use a technique called Direct Lithium Extraction (DLE), which has been developed by various companies in the US, Germany and New Zealand.

The demand for Lithium means there is a lot of research being done to make production of lithium more effective and green. I don't think we will end up not being able to extract lithium, and I think it will become a lot greener and cheaper as the processes get better and more effective.

dafman

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#2732257 21-Jun-2021 19:44

@tripper1000: “I met a family that went full EV with both cars and when they went camping or skiing, they spent some of their EV fuel savings on hiring a 4x4 or van.” Good idea, but not really practical for me as there is no quality rental option near us. It can’t match the convenience of opening up the garage in the morning and heading off.

@davidcole: “Also what you don't mention in your 500km Wellington to Tauranga trip, how often, where and for how long do you stop on the way up. I assume after a couple of hundred km for lunch etc....that's a charging point top top up the battery.” Fair point, more than often we would stop for coffee, so maybe not a significant issue. Plenty of access at the moment given the low number of EVs, but I wonder if there will there be enough EV charging stations in Taupo in a few years to come as hundreds of EV users all descend simultaneously wanting a quick top up?

@obraik: “The new Outbacks are listed as 168g/km CO2, so would fall under the fee threshold.” Great news, I should have done my homework, I just assumed at 2.5l they would be caught. As an aside, I thought a read in another forum you had a Tesla written off, ordered a replacement, but then cancelled as on second thoughts it was too much money to invest in a car? You’ve got another Tesla?

@scott3: ”The Ioniq 5 would likely be the closet pure electric match to an outback on the market (well available for order) at the moment.” It looks outstanding, I just don’t that budget to spend. The Korean’s are really killing it in style and innovation, IMHO the best looking new cars on the market are the Koreans! The recently announced upcoming new Sportage looks absolutely stunning.

@batman: “Never never ever at that budget (55k)”. It used to be that $55k was a lot of money, it still is for me. Interesting, TV3 news tonight said global demand is pushing up EV prices, with one EV dealer saying he expects price rises will eliminate any benefit from the rebate.

It looks like any EV replacement for the Outback is just too expensive for me at present. I’ll will probably go EV at some future point, but it looks like I will replace current ICE with another ICE. Likely an Outback, but could be tempted with a new Tuscan or Sportage.

I will keep a keen eye on the EV market, it will be interesting to watch price and new product announcements, and how quickly consumers convert over.

jonathan18

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#2732258 21-Jun-2021 19:45

Scott3:
Yes. Range for 58kWh RWD ioniq 5 is 384km WLTP. Oddly they put the rated range low down in the specs under the sustainability tab.

From having spend a little time in a Kona, and based on that I would expect this car to get the rated range in the real world.

Thanks, that's good to know. My back of an envelope calculations, based on the stats of the larger capacity RWD model, were damn close to that!

384 km is a actually not too bad... Ideally I'd want a car that could do PN-Wgtn return without needing to charge, and I think this would be pushing it sadly...

Any word on the likely range (and price) of the Kia EV6, especially the smaller capacity battery?

jarledb

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#2732259 21-Jun-2021 19:48

jonathan18:
Any word on the likely range (and price) of the Kia EV6, especially the smaller capacity battery?

It is the same platform as the Ioniq 5, so should be similar.

jonathan18

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#2732260 21-Jun-2021 19:49

dafman:
@obraik: “The new Outbacks are listed as 168g/km CO2, so would fall under the fee threshold.” Great news, I should have done my homework, I just assumed at 2.5l they would be caught. As an aside, I thought a read in another forum you had a Tesla written off, ordered a replacement, but then cancelled as on second thoughts it was too much money to invest in a car? You’ve got another Tesla?

Wrong guy - you're thinking of linuxluver, who ended up replacing that Model 3 with an MG.

https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=162&topicid=197896&page_no=285#2625506

Obraik

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#2732263 21-Jun-2021 19:53

dafman:

@obraik: “The new Outbacks are listed as 168g/km CO2, so would fall under the fee threshold.” Great news, I should have done my homework, I just assumed at 2.5l they would be caught. As an aside, I thought a read in another forum you had a Tesla written off, ordered a replacement, but then cancelled as on second thoughts it was too much money to invest in a car? You’ve got another Tesla?

Nah that was another member here who that happened to. I believe he went with a MG ZS EV as a replacement.

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jonathan18

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#2732271 21-Jun-2021 20:01

jarledb: It is the same platform as the Ioniq 5, so should be similar.

Yeah, fair point! I had wondered if the touted differences between the two would be at the entry level end, but it looks like the power advantage of the Kias is limited to the higher capacity models:

The entry-level, single-motor, 58 kWh battery versions of each car serve up 168 hp and 258lb ft, while choosing the bigger battery moves those figures to 232 hp and a thumping 446 lb ft.

But then things diverge in the Kia’s favor. The two-wheel drive/big battery combination yields 215 hp in the Ioniq 5 but 225 hp in the EV6. Go dual-motor with the same battery and the Hyundai serves up 302 hp, but the Kia beats it with 321 hp. And topping the EV6 range is the 577 hp, 546 lb ft EV6 GT, a version Hyundai currently has no answer for.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.carscoops.com/2021/04/kia-ev6-vs-hyundai-ioniq-5-who-wins-the-on-paper-battle/amp/

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#2732558 22-Jun-2021 10:18

dafman:

I'm on my second Subaru Outback, intend to get another Outback to replace current one (yes, I like them that much!) but with the recent EV rebate announcement, it's probably a good idea to think about whether an EV could become my next car (esp. given the Outback cost will be going up as a consequence of the scheme).

I'm in a similar boat... only thing which has mildly piqued my interest is Outlander PHEV, but I'd prefer a wagon or if I'm going SUV 7 seats (but then you start looking at $$$) so will probably eek as much life out of current outback as I can and see what happens over the next few years.

EDIT: Actually the only other thing that I briefly considered when looking at this was one of those weird leaf based imported vans, I forget what they're called - I wondered about using something like at a daily driver then a cheap dirty 4WD banger on weekends\trips :D )

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JessieB

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#2732591 22-Jun-2021 11:40

The rebate is not the big issue here. By far the biggest issue is that a new ICE vehicle will depreciate very quickly. Especially for SUVs. This is because newer and far better technology is coming on stream very quickly. Even for farmers and trades-people, they would be better off waiting. Would it not be handy to have a PHEV, that can be used to run 240v tools out in the field?

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