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MikeB4
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  #2805054 1-Nov-2021 09:05
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cshwone:

MikeB4:


 


That scenario has been well and truly ruled out. Cost, geotech and seismic   engineering studies have shown it is not viable.



Glad those last two weren't a factor for the Rail Tunnel :)



The rail tunnel was built so long ago I doubt they gave it much thought. Rail tunnels are very different. They are narrow and in the case of the Remutaka track very low traffic. The central divide from the South Wairarapa coast to the Rauhine range has historically generated large earthquakes like the 8.5 in the late 1800s.

Geektastic
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  #2805060 1-Nov-2021 09:20
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raytaylor:

Geektastic:

I heard a version where they offered to build a second tunnel to the Wairarapa.


Thats a very good idea. 


A 7km long tunnel between where current SH1 entry into featherston and marchant road at kaitoke would be awesome and save 6kms off the journey over the rimutaka hill, while also being flat and save a bunch of energy. 


 



Agreed. It would also probably double our house values, so double agreed! 😁





Geektastic
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  #2805062 1-Nov-2021 09:26
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It's interesting that earthquakes are always an issue here but other countries with similar seismic conditions such as California or Japan overcome them.

The Shinkansen has never had an earthquake related incident. There's a system that stops all the trains on the line in the event of an earthquake I believe.







freitasm
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  #2805065 1-Nov-2021 09:36
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dfnt:

 

Even if it doesn't save much time, I'll be glad to never have to drive through Paremata, Plimmerton, Pukerua Bay and Paekakariki ever again.

 

By far the most tedious stretch of 50-100-50-80-70-80-100km/h road..

 

 

Ultimately all traffic into Wellington ends queueing up in Tawa. Are we going to see more cars coming into Wellington due to faster bypass? If so, what's the impact on the already gridlocked Wellington city traffic?

 

I hate to say it but it's likely more people will come into Wellington, making things a lot worst for city traffic.





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MikeB4
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  #2805074 1-Nov-2021 09:47
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@freitasm the only cure for congestion south bound is to get cars off the road. No matter how lanes it is always going to be a funnel.
Congestion will be far worse when transmission gully opens as more cars will join the queue.

Scotdownunder
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  #2805079 1-Nov-2021 09:53
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It would help if a large park and ride was built at the Kenepuru Dr end with a fast train shuttle to town.  Might need some smart signalling to allow the non-stop shuttles to pass the stopper trains through Tawa.


wratterus
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  #2805134 1-Nov-2021 10:04
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Great pics. Really looking forward to driving this when it's open.




  #2805138 1-Nov-2021 10:09
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freitasm:

 

dfnt:

 

Even if it doesn't save much time, I'll be glad to never have to drive through Paremata, Plimmerton, Pukerua Bay and Paekakariki ever again.

 

By far the most tedious stretch of 50-100-50-80-70-80-100km/h road..

 

 

Ultimately all traffic into Wellington ends queueing up in Tawa. Are we going to see more cars coming into Wellington due to faster bypass? If so, what's the impact on the already gridlocked Wellington city traffic?

 

I hate to say it but it's likely more people will come into Wellington, making things a lot worst for city traffic.

 

 

This is the reason that Wellington City mayors & councils were so keen on the Tawa/Grenada to Petone road ("P2G" Project): it would take all the Petone traffic -  especially trucks - off the Tawa to Ngauranga Gorge SH1 and Ngauranga to Petone SH2 route. It would make a lot of capacity available for Wellington City commuters (which was why WCC were so keen) and also make the journey to the airport a little less horrible.

 

Doesn't look like P2G will happen now, Waka Kotahi / NZTA have priced it off the table


wellygary
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  #2805142 1-Nov-2021 10:17
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freitasm:

 

dfnt:

 

Even if it doesn't save much time, I'll be glad to never have to drive through Paremata, Plimmerton, Pukerua Bay and Paekakariki ever again.

 

By far the most tedious stretch of 50-100-50-80-70-80-100km/h road..

 

 

Ultimately all traffic into Wellington ends queueing up in Tawa. Are we going to see more cars coming into Wellington due to faster bypass? If so, what's the impact on the already gridlocked Wellington city traffic?

 

I hate to say it but it's likely more people will come into Wellington, making things a lot worst for city traffic.

 

 

For Wellington bound traffic yes, But the Gully route will also likely change the commuting trends of many who work in the Hutt. 

 

They will no longer have to head toward Wellington down the Ngauranaga Gorge and along the Hutt road,

 

They can now use Transmission Gully, get off at Pauatahanui and go 10 mins over the hill to Haywards, 

 

 

 

 


Flippikat
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  #2805147 1-Nov-2021 10:21
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dfnt:

Even if it doesn't save much time, I'll be glad to never have to drive through Paremata, Plimmerton, Pukerua Bay and Paekakariki ever again.


By far the most tedious stretch of 50-100-50-80-70-80-100km/h road..


 



It's gonna be a real game changer for traveling from the Hutt Valley to Kapiti (and points north of there on SH1) and vice versa... heck, even travel between Upper Hutt & Porirua.

No more snaking around the inlet!
No more speedtrap at Pukerua Bay!
Hurrah!

We just need upgrades to SH58 (Haywards to Pauatahanui) to cope with it being a big gateway in and out of the Hutt Valley - especially with Petone to Grenada stuck on the drawing board indefinitely.

Yes I know there's some SH 58 upgrades being done, but I suspect it may need more, given the volumes TG will funnel into it.

dfnt
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  #2805166 1-Nov-2021 10:43
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freitasm:

 

Ultimately all traffic into Wellington ends queueing up in Tawa. Are we going to see more cars coming into Wellington due to faster bypass? If so, what's the impact on the already gridlocked Wellington city traffic?

 

I hate to say it but it's likely more people will come into Wellington, making things a lot worst for city traffic.

 

 

You're probably right, but I'm only travelling that route on the odd weekend so hopefully it won't be as bad


Flippikat
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  #2805192 1-Nov-2021 11:17
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wellygary:


For Wellington bound traffic yes, But the Gully route will also likely change the commuting trends of many who work in the Hutt. 


They will no longer have to head toward Wellington down the Ngauranaga Gorge and along the Hutt road,


They can now use Transmission Gully, get off at Pauatahanui and go 10 mins over the hill to Haywards, 


 


 





While TG is a huge improvement on the current state, it just emphasizes the lack of decent and direct connections between Tawa-Porirua-Kapiti and Petone-Lower Hutt-Upper Hutt - especially as far as public transport goes.

It's absolutely appalling that the reliable public transport between those two "arms" is taking a train all the way down to Wellington Station, then up the other line.

We need to get away from the "all roads lead to Wellington" focus we've had for years, and transition to inter-connected nodes.

Lias
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  #2805200 1-Nov-2021 11:34
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Technofreak:
MikeB4: I would rather see the electrification of the main trunk rail line and decent fast passenger trains.


We don't have the population to support fast or slow passenger trains. We don't have the right track infrastructure for fast trains.

For trains (or buses or the like) to work the service needs to be frequent. The train between Hamilton and Auckland is only surviving because of the massive subsidies. During the week days the patronage is poor. Saturday is the only day that gets worthwhile loadings

 

Back in the mid-late 90's I tiki toured round the north island several times, using a combination of trains, buses and hitching. Back then the price of a train fare was a fraction of an airfare, only slightly more than an intercity bus, making it a preferable option. Then some genius decided to reduce the services and try and turn the trains into tourist experiences and jacked the prices up through the roof.  Last I checked taking a train from WLG -> AKL was double the price of a bus, and it was often cheaper to fly than train, even on Air NZ if you purchased the tickets somewhat in advance. 





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Lias
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  #2805203 1-Nov-2021 11:39
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Flippikat:

 

Yes I know there's some SH 58 upgrades being done, but I suspect it may need more, given the volumes TG will funnel into it.

 

Not wrong.. also struck me as incredibly short sighted that NZTA is sinking hundreds of millions into SH58 that's already redundant because they aren't making it a 4 lane expressway between TG and SH2.





I'm a geek, a gamer, a dad and an IT Professional. I have a full rack home lab, size 15 feet, an epic beard and Asperger's. I'm a bit of a Cypherpunk, who believes information wants to be free and the Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it.


Lias
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  #2805206 1-Nov-2021 11:45
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Flippikat: While TG is a huge improvement on the current state, it just emphasizes the lack of decent and direct connections between Tawa-Porirua-Kapiti and Petone-Lower Hutt-Upper Hutt - especially as far as public transport goes.

It's absolutely appalling that the reliable public transport between those two "arms" is taking a train all the way down to Wellington Station, then up the other line.

We need to get away from the "all roads lead to Wellington" focus we've had for years, and transition to inter-connected nodes.

 

As someone who in theory (mostly WFH) works in the Hutt and lives in Kapiti, couldn't agree more. These days I mostly only go into the office if we're having drinks or something, meaning I'm not driving so have to train into town then back out and it's just painful. The total and utter lack of late night public transport between Wellington and Kapiti is also worth mentioning.. Last train is 1am, after that it's 6am Saturday or 7am Sunday. The entirety of the Hutt and everywhere else up to Plimmerton at least gets a late night bus service till 3am, Kapiti has nothing. It's just a no brainer to me that the trains should be operating through the night on Friday and Saturday nights so that people can get home safely. They do it on New Years etc, but it should be year round.





I'm a geek, a gamer, a dad and an IT Professional. I have a full rack home lab, size 15 feet, an epic beard and Asperger's. I'm a bit of a Cypherpunk, who believes information wants to be free and the Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it.


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