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  # 1351728 25-Jul-2015 21:17
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Dreal: Don't you currently have to pay GST on everything imported into NZ over $50 bucks?


If the GST and duties (where applicable) which could be collected is greater than or equal $60, then customs will deem it worth collecting it.  At 15% GST, that comes to about $400 (product + shipping combined total) for most things, 400*0.15 = $60.  




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  # 1351729 25-Jul-2015 21:28
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It is interesting that the article mentions the US, Canada and the UK as examples. These are countries we are importing from as they have lower prices. It also forgets to mention that the UK has to abide by the free transfer of goods within the EU principle, that creates a big market with significant competition. A lot of local retailers wouldn't know how to compete

 
 
 
 


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  # 1351756 25-Jul-2015 22:45
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Lostja: It is interesting that the article mentions the US, Canada and the UK as examples. These are countries we are importing from as they have lower prices. It also forgets to mention that the UK has to abide by the free transfer of goods within the EU principle, that creates a big market with significant competition. A lot of local retailers wouldn't know how to compete


I've never purchased anything in the euro, because the exchange rate has been consistently terrible. The US on the other hand, before our NZD crash, was virtually a steal at some points.




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  # 1351758 25-Jul-2015 22:48
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sleemanj:
Dreal: Don't you currently have to pay GST on everything imported into NZ over $50 bucks?


If the GST and duties (where applicable) which could be collected is greater than or equal $60, then customs will deem it worth collecting it.  At 15% GST, that comes to about $400 (product + shipping combined total) for most things, 400*0.15 = $60.  


A lot of things being less than $400 dollars, than favours international purchasing against our local economy. Imagine if every day purchases worked like that. I wonder what the reasoning is. 




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  # 1351763 25-Jul-2015 23:04
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Dreal:  I wonder what the reasoning is. 


The reason for having a threshold, is that the costs which would be incurred to setup and operate systems for collecting amounts below the threshold are deemed to be higher than the GST collected.  

In other words, it effectively would cost customs an extra $60 (staff, storage, letters, phone calls, documentation...)  to collect that $59 worth of GST from you.





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  # 1351764 25-Jul-2015 23:10
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Dreal:
Lostja: It is interesting that the article mentions the US, Canada and the UK as examples. These are countries we are importing from as they have lower prices. It also forgets to mention that the UK has to abide by the free transfer of goods within the EU principle, that creates a big market with significant competition. A lot of local retailers wouldn't know how to compete


I've never purchased anything in the euro, because the exchange rate has been consistently terrible. The US on the other hand, before our NZD crash, was virtually a steal at some points.


It hasn't crashed yet. I recall not that many years ago it was below 50 cents. It is a concern that the NZ dollar is so weak though, because the US has been printing money, which devalues the US dollar against the NZ dollar. Bu if they cut the OCR by much more, it is only liekly to continue dropping. This will put quite  a bit of pressure on people importing, because they won't want to put prices up, as that means it is likely less people will buy.

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  # 1351765 25-Jul-2015 23:14
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Dreal:


Well, that's how profit works and especially for a really very VERY small market like NZ it stands to reason that even the local retailers of this cheap stuff are not getting much better prices than available to retail customers going direct via Aliexpress etc...



No that's exactly right. Small businesses are not the 'robbers'. There are taxes (very high), services like banks and so on, insurance, marketing - everyone 'bigger' takes a cut of any small business. The majority of money made on any small margin enterprise is the govt, followed by big corporate service agencies. If this were a tax and overhead low world, the prices would be lower in NZ retail, simple as that.  The overheads are simply higher than the consumer realises. 
 


It isn't helped by these large overseas retailers that have setup in NZ, that can be very aggressive in their pricing, and sell in great volumes allowing them to undercut the competition. NZ businesses though are at a disadvange with GST, as 15% being addition to teh price is a lot. I also wouldn't be surprised if we see GST rise again up to 17.5% or even as high as 20%. The problem with newer taxes like GST, is once they are in, they can keep increasing them, when they should really be decreased once there has been a recovery in the economy.

 
 
 
 


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  # 1351767 25-Jul-2015 23:29
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mattwnz:
Dreal:


Well, that's how profit works and especially for a really very VERY small market like NZ it stands to reason that even the local retailers of this cheap stuff are not getting much better prices than available to retail customers going direct via Aliexpress etc...



No that's exactly right. Small businesses are not the 'robbers'. There are taxes (very high), services like banks and so on, insurance, marketing - everyone 'bigger' takes a cut of any small business. The majority of money made on any small margin enterprise is the govt, followed by big corporate service agencies. If this were a tax and overhead low world, the prices would be lower in NZ retail, simple as that.  The overheads are simply higher than the consumer realises. 
 


It isn't helped by these large overseas retailers that have setup in NZ, that can be very aggressive in their pricing, and sell in great volumes allowing them to undercut the competition. NZ businesses though are at a disadvange with GST, as 15% being addition to teh price is a lot. I also wouldn't be surprised if we see GST rise again up to 17.5% or even as high as 20%. The problem with newer taxes like GST, is once they are in, they can keep increasing them, when they should really be decreased once there has been a recovery in the economy.


I agree. 15% is already too high. They mix these taxes, income, GST and so on, and then they rise faster than inflation because govt costs are mismanaged. 

There is one counterpoint that remains true - you cannot get the service, and personal care/interest from a large corporation that you can from a small business with a genuine passion. Every small company that becomes large, vodafone being a good example, loses its interest in serving people, in actually doing what they do, over profit - no matter how they try to do otherwise. Corporations serve shareholders, not consumers, ultimately.  



 




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  # 1351770 25-Jul-2015 23:54
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Dreal:

There is one counterpoint that remains true - you cannot get the service, and personal care/interest from a large corporation that you can from a small business with a genuine passion. Every small company that becomes large, vodafone being a good example, loses its interest in serving people, in actually doing what they do, over profit - no matter how they try to do otherwise. Corporations serve shareholders, not consumers, ultimately.  



 


It does depend on the product though. For example, a digital camera, you can do far more research and watch reviews online, or read amazon reviews, than you will usually get from someone in store.   Infact if you go to the store having done your research, you will probably know more about the product than the seller.So once you have done that research , you are buying on price, so it just becomes a commodity. However you will always get the type of customer who doesn't do their research, and will pay more to get that advice from the store, and will buy what the store staff recommends. I am using digital cameras as an example because I am going through this process, and will buy from a NZ store just for that piece of mind. I could save a few hundred buying from a parallel importer/drop ship company (with a NZ domain and phone number but based overseas), but will buy from a kiwi store because I get that extra buyer protection.

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  # 1351772 26-Jul-2015 00:11
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mattwnz:
Dreal:

There is one counterpoint that remains true - you cannot get the service, and personal care/interest from a large corporation that you can from a small business with a genuine passion. Every small company that becomes large, vodafone being a good example, loses its interest in serving people, in actually doing what they do, over profit - no matter how they try to do otherwise. Corporations serve shareholders, not consumers, ultimately.  



 


It does depend on the product though. For example, a digital camera, you can do far more research and watch reviews online, or read amazon reviews, than you will usually get from someone in store.   Infact if you go to the store having done your research, you will probably know more about the product than the seller.So once you have done that research , you are buying on price, so it just becomes a commodity. However you will always get the type of customer who doesn't do their research, and will pay more to get that advice from the store, and will buy what the store staff recommends. I am using digital cameras as an example because I am going through this process, and will buy from a NZ store just for that piece of mind. I could save a few hundred buying from a parallel importer/drop ship company (with a NZ domain and phone number but based overseas), but will buy from a kiwi store because I get that extra buyer protection.


Well that's true too. I do a lot of research when I make major purchases. And some people do just go to the biggest nearest large chain store, usually paying for it in the process based on branding, when even quite techy chain stores, don't provide a highly knowledgeable level of advice. It's a lot of trade offs, price being one of them. 

It's a shame that technical specialists don't often know more, but I think thats part of the whole franchise/big corp thing. When PB tech was a smaller company, their employees went wild on technical help. Now, its kind of dick smith levels. And for something like a camera, you want knowledge in the salesperson. 

What camera did you decide on btw? 




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  # 1351848 26-Jul-2015 10:05
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wasabi2k:
bazzer: You mean like this guy?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11434179


No, I have a legitimate company (that is registered for GST) that I do my IT contracting through.

The dodginess would be claiming the GST of stuff that isn't related to the operation of my business. I could possibly argue that tablets/PC stuff was, other stuff not so much.





I used to get pissed by a friend claiming the 18 foot boat as a business asset/GST for his diary farm...

I'm happy to pay a local premium of 20% to support local shops as empty shops on the high street depresses me.

A.


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  # 1352275 27-Jul-2015 08:57
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afe66:
wasabi2k:
bazzer: You mean like this guy?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11434179


No, I have a legitimate company (that is registered for GST) that I do my IT contracting through.

The dodginess would be claiming the GST of stuff that isn't related to the operation of my business. I could possibly argue that tablets/PC stuff was, other stuff not so much.





I used to get pissed by a friend claiming the 18 foot boat as a business asset/GST for his diary farm...

I'm happy to pay a local premium of 20% to support local shops as empty shops on the high street depresses me.

A.



Get pissed at the law, not your friend

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  # 1352276 27-Jul-2015 08:58
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mattwnz:
Dreal:
Lostja: It is interesting that the article mentions the US, Canada and the UK as examples. These are countries we are importing from as they have lower prices. It also forgets to mention that the UK has to abide by the free transfer of goods within the EU principle, that creates a big market with significant competition. A lot of local retailers wouldn't know how to compete


I've never purchased anything in the euro, because the exchange rate has been consistently terrible. The US on the other hand, before our NZD crash, was virtually a steal at some points.


It hasn't crashed yet. I recall not that many years ago it was below 50 cents. It is a concern that the NZ dollar is so weak though, because the US has been printing money, which devalues the US dollar against the NZ dollar. Bu if they cut the OCR by much more, it is only liekly to continue dropping. This will put quite  a bit of pressure on people importing, because they won't want to put prices up, as that means it is likely less people will buy.


demand for commodity currencies like NZ and AU will continue to go down

55 U.S. cents by Xmas is my guess

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