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199 posts

Master Geek
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Lightbox

  Reply # 1593468 16-Jul-2016 10:00
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Thanks all. We'll do some tests and I'll report back :)

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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1593798 17-Jul-2016 10:20
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I watched quite a bit of Lightbox last night, all through a second generation Chromecast, initially casting from an Android phone and later from a Windows 10 notebook. There were some very noticeable differences in the volume of particular programmes, but I didn't notice any fluctuations within single programmes.


 
 
 
 


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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1593809 17-Jul-2016 10:51
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Thanks @andrew027 .... Which programs were you watching that were noticeably different, volume wise?

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  Reply # 1594265 18-Jul-2016 08:36
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We watched Life on Mars (S01E04) last night, and that had no sound issues.

 

We then watched The Good Wife (S04E06), and that had the AV Receiver re-evaluating the input audio signal every couple of minutes, resulting in audio constantly changing between 2.0 and 5.1. In the end, we gave up in frustration and watched another SVOD service.

 

This is streaming via a VDSL connection currently performing at around 55Mbps, with the streaming device connected via Ethernet to the router.


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Master Geek
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Lightbox

  Reply # 1595564 20-Jul-2016 12:09
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Hi folks, just a little update: we've had a few conversations here around this subject. We have some theories, but need to do some digging.

 

 

 

@dclegg / @andrew027 / @radomatic / @JimmyCorrigan / @MikeB4 (and anyone else who wants to join in) - if you have a moment, would you be willing to email me (george@lightbox.co.nz) with the email address(es) you use to login, and ideally some dates/times you experienced the volume issues....?

 

 

 

Thanks everyone :)


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  Reply # 1595581 20-Jul-2016 12:37
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LightboxGeorge:

 

Hi folks, just a little update: we've had a few conversations here around this subject. We have some theories, but need to do some digging.

 

 

 

@dclegg / @andrew027 / @radomatic / @JimmyCorrigan / @MikeB4 (and anyone else who wants to join in) - if you have a moment, would you be willing to email me (george@lightbox.co.nz) with the email address(es) you use to login, and ideally some dates/times you experienced the volume issues....?

 

 

 

Thanks everyone :)

 

 

 

 

Done. Feel free to let me know if there is any further information I can provide.


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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1597981 25-Jul-2016 10:02
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Hi all; a little update to keep you in the loop...

 

 

 

FYI we are now pretty certain our theory around why volume seems to go up & down is solid (it relates to the speed at which your player connects to the streaming service, and the audio configurations therein).

 

 

 

Worth pointing out that the 'speed your player connects at' is not the same as 'what kind of fibre/vdsl you have'. It will depend on network conditions, the type of modem/router you have, whether you have other users on the network, etc etc. Lots of factors.

 

 

 

We're looking at some tests to prove this, and then to work out a way to solve it. :)


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  Reply # 1597997 25-Jul-2016 10:15
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Im a bit more worried why a streaming service would be going up and down in quality on a functioning internet connection. Surely unless your connection is trash it should just go to 1080p with 5.1 and stick with it for the whole show? My connection is crap at the moment with chorus network being wet, which is the first time I have ever seen my TV drop down from 1080 when youtubing.

 

Is it really considered acceptable to be delivering anything less than the best quality to customers?





Richard rich.ms

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1598004 25-Jul-2016 10:23
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Hi @richms

 

Video streams constantly refactor the quality based on the network conditions at the time - ABR (Adaptive BitRate streaming) is a common method in streaming media to achieve this. Using ABR is a way to get around fluctuating network conditions.

 

Consider this example: you connect to Youtube. At that moment in time, your connection is Grade A, so it starts playing 1080p with 5.1 surround sound. Then someone else hops on your home network / one of your devices starts downloading an automatic update / something weird happens at the exchange / electrical interference screws with your router for while...if Youtube continued to deliver 1080/5.1, you'd quickly see buffering.

 

Using ABR, the quality refactors up or down to avoid this.

 

This way we are striving to deliver the best quality to our customers, given the conditions that are outside our control.


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1598404 25-Jul-2016 17:50
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Hi

I noticed I can't get 5.1 audio anymore on Apple TV - this was working on a few shows, including happy valley and Vikings ?

This feature is so important considering the quality of the production on shows these days. Can you confirm if it's going to be fixed ? It used to work which shows your platform can handle it

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  Reply # 1598407 25-Jul-2016 18:06
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GeorgefromLightbox:

 

Hi @richms

 

Video streams constantly refactor the quality based on the network conditions at the time - ABR (Adaptive BitRate streaming) is a common method in streaming media to achieve this. Using ABR is a way to get around fluctuating network conditions.

 

Consider this example: you connect to Youtube. At that moment in time, your connection is Grade A, so it starts playing 1080p with 5.1 surround sound. Then someone else hops on your home network / one of your devices starts downloading an automatic update / something weird happens at the exchange / electrical interference screws with your router for while...if Youtube continued to deliver 1080/5.1, you'd quickly see buffering.

 

Using ABR, the quality refactors up or down to avoid this.

 

This way we are striving to deliver the best quality to our customers, given the conditions that are outside our control.

 

 

 

 

perhaps an option to set the audio/video "ideal" rate is in order?

 

This would avoid the fluctuation, as i'm sure some people would rather wait for  3-5 min buffer and watch the whole thing in "glorious" 7.1/HD, while other might rather switch down to 720P (or less?) just to limit bandwith use when mobile, or to avoid this annoying sound fluctuation issue (for e.g.)

 

 

 

I love that NFlix/youtube allow me to set my content to 720p (especially when watching on a smaller screen like an iPad/iPhone or non-HD older TV) as this not only allows me to optimise it to my current network speed (I occasionally suffer from rainfade - Skinny BB), but also to restrict my download rate when approaching my monthly download limit.


Glurp
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  Reply # 1598448 25-Jul-2016 18:56
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richms:

 

Im a bit more worried why a streaming service would be going up and down in quality on a functioning internet connection. Surely unless your connection is trash it should just go to 1080p with 5.1 and stick with it for the whole show? My connection is crap at the moment with chorus network being wet, which is the first time I have ever seen my TV drop down from 1080 when youtubing.

 

Is it really considered acceptable to be delivering anything less than the best quality to customers?

 

 

My RBI connection goes up and down like a yo-yo all the time. It is a major source of frustration. I used to be able to compensate somewhat by choosing a lower resolution but with this bloody adaptive streaming I can't do anything. It is an absolute pain in the posterior. I hate smart crap. The smarter it gets, the more problems it causes.

 

 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


199 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 1598825 26-Jul-2016 10:42
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Thanks everyone. Sounds like the ability to choose bitrate/quality would be useful...


199 posts

Master Geek
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Lightbox

  Reply # 1598857 26-Jul-2016 11:11
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Kickass: Hi

I noticed I can't get 5.1 audio anymore on Apple TV - this was working on a few shows, including happy valley and Vikings ?

This feature is so important considering the quality of the production on shows these days. Can you confirm if it's going to be fixed ? It used to work which shows your platform can handle it

 

 

 

Hey @Kickass

 

ATV can certainly handle 5.1 - however the stream may switch to 2.1 audio it if the bandwidth isn't available. Perhaps check the audio output settings.

 

There are 3 choices-

 

  • Best Available – outputs as PCM
  • Dolby Digital – Dolby encoded stream
  • Stereo – outputs as stereo

 May need to toggle between 1 and 2 dependent on the receiver (i.e what you're plugging the Apple TV into) you are using.


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  Reply # 1598863 26-Jul-2016 11:18
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Particularly bad on Sunday night for us

 

Watching SOA Episode 7.13 via iPad and Chromecast.





Mike

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