tukapa1:
Still, game not over yet. Time for a miracle?

Kopkiwi: After this disgrace anyone that still thinks Foster is the right man for the job shouldn’t have their opinion taken seriously with regards to rugby ever again.

Ian Foster:  "Quick Mark, who haven't I thrown under the bus yet to save my job ... get the strapper and the bag man in here!"

Handle9:

Kopkiwi:

Won't be getting out of the group at the WC. Genuinely wouldn't be surprised to see Argies do a number on us too, they will be fired up after smashing a decent Aussie outfit and our players will have fallen back on the "only need to show up" mentality. 

So is NZ losing to Italy or Namibia or Uruguay??

Yep back to being consistent 😂

I could quote my posts from 3 weeks back and they would still be the truth.

- We are wanting at center.  Havili was back to his usual self, unable to beat the line, static passing.  Ioane I think passed once, he is a winger, built like a center, but he is still a center..

- Where was our saviour where out thou O Mounga, shows the dissimal ball Barrett played with makes any number 10 look awkward.

- Why did he sub his entire front row at 44mins?

- MVP goes to coach, won another gong, First time Argentina wins in NZ - at this point all I can do is laugh

- Sam Cain is just not the best in his position, and as I have said before, he isnt the best captain, so is he just taking up a spot?

I think Robinson has to go surely. Never mind Foster - he'll be dealt with by whoever comes in to clean up this mess.

Well, that was bloody disappointing.

We took the ball through a lot of phases, but most of the time the ref hardly pinged the Argies for off-side... if the ref isn't going to ping them it's up to our 9 & 10 to adjust by executing diagonal kicks behind to turn them around.

That loss was basically a combo of our poor discipline & our ball carriers getting isolated so much that we gave away a heap of easy penalties.

We have two smart blokes in Schmidt & Ryan that have only had their jobs for a pretty short time, so it's going to take a while for them to rid of the players bad habits, so we can consistently play like an actual All Black team again.  

Kopkiwi: 

After this disgrace anyone that still thinks Foster is the right man for the job shouldn’t have their opinion taken seriously with regards to rugby ever again.

What disgrace? That we lost? Its sport, people lose. The issue is that some think the AB's are invincible so a loss isnt acceptable. The fact is we arent that great anymore, its a trough that all sports go through. Re the incessant penalties, thats a player problem not a coach problem. Probably a consequence of not dominating so we choke, again. When I saw AUS beat RSA beforehand, that told me that us beating RSA wasnt a great win, it was just a win, where it seems there are no star rugby teams in the TRC. If that is the case, then its more about nailing the basics more than anything else.

artbloke:

 

That loss was basically a combo of our poor discipline & our ball carriers getting isolated so much that we gave away a heap of easy penalties.

 

You cant keep blaming penalties on something else. ARG had penalties as well, but generally mistakes or technical penalty, being out scrummed for example. Many of ours seemed reckless and careless. You cannot coach that, its a player problem. First time Ive seen a team penalty dished out.

ARG had the passion, and the defence. IMO that caused us to choke, too much pressure, (of which recent coach bashing/armchar critics  account for a lot of that)

tdgeek:

 

artbloke:

 

That loss was basically a combo of our poor discipline & our ball carriers getting isolated so much that we gave away a heap of easy penalties.

 

 

You cant keep blaming penalties on something else. ARG had penalties as well, but generally mistakes or technical penalty, being out scrummed for example. Many of ours seemed reckless and careless. You cannot coach that, its a player problem. First time Ive seen a team penalty dished out.

 

ARG had the passion, and the defence. IMO that caused us to choke, too much pressure, (of which recent coach bashing/armchar critics  account for a lot of that)

 

Of course penalties come from all areas of the game, fact is though our discipline was poor, so was our lack of protection for our ball carriers... having a pedantic ref didn't help either, making it a stop start game, which suited the Argies style of game.

The idea mate is to actually adapt on the field, thinking your way around problems during a match, we clearly didn't, all we did was keep running into a brick wall, when the best solution a lot of times as said, was to use diagonal kicks in behind them to make them scramble backwards.

Most of the players pick themselves, unfortunately we have a poor head coach, so he has the final say on the starting 15.

Aaron Smith is slow in all areas of his game at 9... if Fakatava isn't injured, he should replace Smith.

R. Ioane doesn't offer much on attack from the midfield... would slot J.Barrett into his position.

Cane needs to be replaced at 7... Savea is great at either 7 or 8, so could play Savea at 7, and bring in Sotutu at 8.

In my opinion both Cane and Taylor should be dropped.

Cane has not been the same since coming back from his broken neck and no longer seems to be able to lead by example (in a McCaw or Read kind of way). His off the ball tackle of Matera was dumb, but also a great piece of acting on Matera’s part. Acting any Argentinian footballer would be proud of. The definition of insanity is to keep making the same mistakes and expect a different outcome. A Captain needs to be able to adapt the game plan. Cane (and the other senior players) don’t seem to be able to do this. I do concede that the pace of the game at international level and oxygen debt does hamper decision making, but they are highly paid professionals.

As for Taylor. A hooker has two specialist jobs on top of general field play.
1. Secure the scrum feed by hooking the ball back.
2. Throw the ball into the lineout such that your team secures possession.
I don’t know what kind of warm up routine he does before coming on as a sub, but it obviously doesn’t include enough calibration of his throwing arm. Three times at crucial parts in the game he failed.
In fact I believe the rot started when the complete front row was replaced at once. The forward drive, including two-up tackles just seemed to fade away.

On scrum dominance alone the ABs should have been able to win that match. But they don’t seem to be able to ‘win boring’ by forcing a scrum penalty in a kickable position and incrementing the score in threes. Particularly when rush defences are stifling their running game. And of course winning your own lineouts.

Unless the rules have been changed, I thought the tackler had to show a clear release of the tackled player and regain his feet before trying to secure a turnover. The final penalty awarded to the Argentinians was a classic example of this and extinguished any hope of a miracle comeback. (And had me swearing at the screen).