General Blackcaps Chat

Forums › Sports › General Blackcaps Chat

1 | ... | 137 | 138 | 139 | 140 | 141 | 142 | 143 | 144 | 145 | 146 | 147 | ... | 202

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840444 30-Dec-2021 13:27

Ross Taylor is retiring from International Cricket, this will be his final series.

Right at this point going on Test Runs, he is arguably NZs best batsman of all time. Clearly Kane will over take him very soon and Crowe is hard to place as he was not in such a team to be supported so one could make the argument he is the best of all time over Kane and Ross. Its very hard to place the 3. I think Martin shouldnt be rated as he is far more than numbers and stats, he was THE team at points in time, to score like he did and still be up and around these 2 other players cannot be over stated for importance.

Going to be a fight for his position with a number of young guys in the mix. But Id have thought GP has to be given a chance, even if moving Nicholls up the order. I think would be a mistake to play Mitchell, especially at 4. Also with Nicholls being under selection strain last season and got an overtly lucky 170, if he fails a number of times he also might be up for grabs, but Im sure if he does get dropped he will work on his consistency at FC level and not be out for long. GP is the only young player I can see that they were grooming for replacement of aging players (particularly Taylor). GP reminds me of Michael Clarke. Clarke had a similar downfall early on which was not hitting the ball along the deck often enough, he was caught out in covers a lot, where GP gets caught on the boundary. He needs to learn only play the 6 into open areas and in the others play it along the carpet. Either way, he would be good to get the run rate that often stagnates. Which is where Taylor would get things moving again, so need a similar style of player. Even if GP only ends up averaging high 30s, but Im sure he would be a 40-45 player, given many players end up scoring higher at Test level than FC. Marnus for Aus would be the most extreme example of that.

Lenovo

Lenovo computer and accessories deals (affiliate link).

Dochart

652 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2840472 30-Dec-2021 14:24

With Taylor retiring that means Will Young and Devon Conway will be permanent. Young as opener and Devon Conway at No 4. With the ODI Conway will be batting at No 4.

Jas777

838 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2840499 30-Dec-2021 15:58

TeaLeaf:

As I said, the 3 factors to not winning in the final for me were

Puke park looks gorgeous. IMO the most beautiful boutique ground in NZ. If it could fit more people it would be a great T20/ODI int pitch. But then that would ruin it, with hedging between the tier seating etc. Needs new Clay imo though.

You forgot the 4th factor which was the most important, they lost the toss.

Boundaries are far too short for international cricket, makes average sloggers look like world beaters.

Latham should not be in the T20 team, Keep him for cricket that needs technique not just front foot slogging.

The Super Smash would rank about 7th in world T20 competitions so picking players on a few good performances there is not a good idea, the problems is that the 4th 5th and 6th bowlers are not that good and when go up a level the players find the bowling so much tougher and holes in technique are found out so much quicker.

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840501 30-Dec-2021 16:00

Dochart: With Taylor retiring that means Will Young and Devon Conway will be permanent. Young as opener and Devon Conway at No 4. With the ODI Conway will be batting at No 4.

Definitely, at test level anyway. Young has put so much effort in, he deserves a strong commitment from NZC opening the tests.

In T20 and ODI, Id go with Guppy and Finn Allen, if Munro is totally and arrogantly blocked by NZC. In saying that there are sooooo many players who could be Guptils partner. Finn so far is having a mixed season, but he is 6 hitter leader. Im sure he will find consistancy again. He not only hits a long ball but he can hit them anywhere on the park including behind him, he is proficient in all the modern shots. Either way Im sure he is part of the NZC white ball future wherever he bats, but if he gets going at sr250 and hits 30 off 9 consistently and the occasional 80 off 30, it will take so much presure of Guptill who is showing he can open and finish t20 innings.

Its a hard time to select with SOOOO many good players now in every which way barre spin, but even that we have 8 or so quality spinners. Hard to think Vettori would be struggling to make the current BC teams, thats how far we have come.

I think we could make 2.5 teams that are significantly better than the teams between Crowe and Mccullum.

Jas777

838 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2840502 30-Dec-2021 16:07

TeaLeaf:

Dochart: With Taylor retiring that means Will Young and Devon Conway will be permanent. Young as opener and Devon Conway at No 4. With the ODI Conway will be batting at No 4.

Definitely, at test level anyway. Young has put so much effort in, he deserves a strong commitment from NZC opening the tests.

In T20 and ODI, Id go with Guppy and Finn Allen, if Munro is totally and arrogantly blocked by NZC. In saying that there are sooooo many players who could be Guptils partner. Finn so far is having a mixed season, but he is 6 hitter leader. Im sure he will find consistancy again. He not only hits a long ball but he can hit them anywhere on the park including behind him, he is proficient in all the modern shots. Either way Im sure he is part of the NZC white ball future wherever he bats, but if he gets going at sr250 and hits 30 off 9 consistently and the occasional 80 off 30, it will take so much presure of Guptill who is showing he can open and finish t20 innings.

Its a hard time to select with SOOOO many good players now in every which way barre spin, but even that we have 8 or so quality spinners. Hard to think Vettori would be struggling to make the current BC teams, thats how far we have come.

I think we could make 2.5 teams that are significantly better than the teams between Crowe and Mccullum.

Finn Allen has technique issues that international bowlers will find out, so don't expect consistency against the better bowling attacks. Against the good sides he might be 1 in 4 good innings

Interested to know who the 8 quality spinners are?

tdgeek

28585 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2840503 30-Dec-2021 16:12

Jas777:

Interested to know who the 8 quality spinners are?

Yeah. I can think of one though..... one bowler and 10 batsmen!

JarrodM

962 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2840511 30-Dec-2021 16:56

Tempted to book a trip to Christchurch to pay tribute for Ross’ last test

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840568 30-Dec-2021 17:44

Jas777:

Finn Allen has technique issues that international bowlers will find out

He is unique but that is how all the modern players seem to be, if technique was 100% batting, Steve Smith wouldnt be the best batsman of he modern era. Most of the good T20 players that play 360 degrees are facing 3/4 shoulders. Phillipe is the same in the BBL, and hes averaging 50 @ 150.

I hope Allen does get tested, hes a bright guy, I can see him countering any percieved technical weaknesses.

Jeet Raval showing a totally different side in this game. Batting at good SR and hanging in there giving them a chance, I thought they would have lost this one with ease, but not so. Still very much in it.

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840570 30-Dec-2021 17:59

JarrodM: Tempted to book a trip to Christchurch to pay tribute for Ross’ last test

Yeah thats a great idea, same. He is such an under appreciated player who has just kept plodding along with not much recognition as its all been on Williamson once he was given #3. But Taylor was looking to be our best ever batsman prior to Williamson, he really is going to be missed. Even if we find somebody who can average mid 40s and score at a good rate in all 3 formats, its not going to happen overnight and we are going to have a big hole for a while. I hope they are not looking to replace him with Mitchell, as much as I like him, for me at international level its either him or Ravindra depending on the pitch. Taylor missing just causes a massive headache.

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840571 30-Dec-2021 18:01

Northern Brave breeze in within 18 overs.

Jeet Raval 66 from 43. Sensational innings. Great skippers innings, much like Guppy the other night.

tdgeek

28585 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2840585 30-Dec-2021 19:53

TeaLeaf:
Yeah thats a great idea, same. He is such an under appreciated player who has just kept plodding along with not much recognition as its all been on Williamson once he was given #3.

Thats very ingenuous of you, you being a cricket fan

He has an awesome pedigree, that went down a tad or two until he resolved his eye issue. Later, as he got older, and key bowlers worked hm out he became less awesome, and likely to be considered to be dropped. Thats sport.

But if you look a the "overall" achievements, he has been great. Probably could have retired a bit sooner or focussed on one part of the game. i.e. entertainment T20/ODI or tests. Obviously the latter.

Ups to him

And yes in the past I have wanted him dropped, as his time and space wasn't for T20/ODI. Although like any cricketer it could have been on any given day but not all days.

tdgeek

28585 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2840586 30-Dec-2021 19:54

TeaLeaf:

Taylor missing just causes a massive headache.

Or, its time for new young blood to show their wares.

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840804 31-Dec-2021 14:08

tdgeek:

TeaLeaf:

Taylor missing just causes a massive headache.

Or, its time for new young blood to show their wares.

Well more like we have no other option haha. I thought Ross said he was aiming for the WC2013. Which is why Id like to have seen GP given more than 1 test by this stage and any other young batsmen they think have the goods. At least Young was given a go through the winter touring along with Ravindra which they seem to fancy, but I want to see him produce runs and wickets. It might be a case of they blood him as he is so young then rest him while he works on his batting and refining his speed with the ball in FC while somebody like Santner is used, or possibly GP is used at some time this summer as batsman who can bowl a bit to replace Ravindra. Hes not in this test series so I guess we shall see how the replacement for Taylor pans out.

I think we have just been in such a golden decade or more once mccullum took over and players like Taylor were joined by other quality players, Willamson, Mccullum up top and Watling to keep, then Latham who has some stat like best opener in last 3 years, obviously Boult and Southee, then joined by Wagner and now Jamo. So I think its hard to appreciate what a standout Ross was in a team with some talent but mostly pretty avg players early on. At least his AVG hasnt slid for as long as Kholi's has. The Icc rankings are based on continual improvement of your avg (which is why Williamson is often #1 because he had such a low avg to start its just kept rising since 2014 in the same period Kohilis has gone the other way). I hope Ross finds some form to finish this stella career off.

So we have Watling who was near 40 avg who we need to replace some how with like for like, now Taylor, Im not expecting somebody as good but definitely needs to be avg 40+ but importantly the aggressor in the team.

Aus will go through similar soon, but I think NZ has some good young players to shuffle around the #4 and keeper spot. Almost a shame GP put the gloves away as he could either fit there or at 4/5 (perhaps move Nicholls up one).

NZ cricket is stronger than ever, unlike when Hadlee/Crowe era retired and Rutherford took over and we were pathetic for a long time including most of Fleming's early teams, we now have better domestic stock imo

Wow, looked like Hinds were going to win that and the all powerful Leah Tahuhu, the fastest bowler in the game wins it with a SR of 350. Hit one 6 I think a lot of the men would be doing to hit that far. But fast in womens cricket is 120kph. Still an awesome sight with the bat.

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840830 31-Dec-2021 15:50

Cleaver taking Cant apart, 52 off 25, then another 6. This is going to be a big score at Puke park, worth turning the stream/telly on for.

Edit: haha the captain went with him Tom Bruce gets the same 52 off 25. This team has some real big hitters.

Edit: Bruce ends up 93 off 36. Dang.

217 all out, now thats how its done. I think similar team to Auck stacked with heavy hitters. Possibly one more for the Stags. Could end up being the 2 in the final.

Wasnt fancy 360 hitting, just hitting the ball in the arc provided by the bowlers, ie going with the ball. I have always been frustrated with pre meditated batting. Bruce and Cleaver just used low risk big hitting rather than inventing boundaries.

TeaLeaf

5091 posts

Uber Geek

#2840934 31-Dec-2021 18:17

Wow the Kings chase down 217 with nearly 3 overs to go. Even if its Puke Park that is insane hitting, firstly by Stags but the Kings just take it to another level.

Meanwhile Munro is in the top 3 batsmen again in Aus, possibly #1 depending on how you look at it, him and Phillipe.

NZ will snub him again though. Could have won a world cup for us but we just ignore him out of bitterness that he wants to earn a fair living from his talent that only lasts 15 years of his life.

1 | ... | 137 | 138 | 139 | 140 | 141 | 142 | 143 | 144 | 145 | 146 | 147 | ... | 202