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#2994183 10-Nov-2022 00:31

thermonuclear:

I'm sorry, I can't agree with this. The purpose of the Powerplay overs is to artificially constrain the field inside the circle to promote hitting to, and over, the boundary. Williamson wasted too many Powerplay balls only scoring singles (28 runs off 28 balls) before he smacked that six over square leg, clean as a whistle. He's as much to blame as the rest of the top order in digging the hole to put NZ squarely in the losing position.

When the others fell cheaply, it was even more incumbent on him to hit the 'go-switch' and use his undoubted huge skill to find the fence quickly and often. It's not good enough to say he's going to hold up an end and let the lesser guys at the other end hit. Williamson has more pure skill and ability than any of our other batters, and most in world cricket. Hanging in there until over ten, and having a bit more of a dart after the drinks break won't cut it against top opposition as Pakistan are now demonstrating.

Instead, he continued to swing across the line and knock the ball down to Long On for one. If you're going to risk and hit across the line anyway, he needed to go square and try and find the fence. The game was lost even before he got out.

I was more meaning his score compared to Conway, Allen and Philips.Yes the SR wasnt any good. Hard to say if staying in adds more value than going out when batting aggressively, given the others went cheapishly. But better to bat to a winnable score and lose all wickets than play slow. Isnt it a sin to be only 4 down after 20 overs?

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#2994184 10-Nov-2022 00:33

tdgeek:
thermonuclear:

I'm sorry, I can't agree with this. The purpose of the Powerplay overs is to artificially constrain the field inside the circle to promote hitting to, and over, the boundary. Williamson wasted too many Powerplay balls only scoring singles (28 runs off 28 balls) before he smacked that six over square leg, clean as a whistle. He's as much to blame as the rest of the top order in digging the hole to put NZ squarely in the losing position.

When the others fell cheaply, it was even more incumbent on him to hit the 'go-switch' and use his undoubted huge skill to find the fence quickly and often. It's not good enough to say he's going to hold up an end and let the lesser guys at the other end hit. Williamson has more pure skill and ability than any of our other batters, and most in world cricket. Hanging in there until over ten, and having a bit more of a dart after the drinks break won't cut it against top opposition as Pakistan are now demonstrating.

Instead, he continued to swing across the line and knock the ball down to Long On for one. If you're going to risk and hit across the line anyway, he needed to go square and try and find the fence. The game was lost even before he got out.

I was more meaning his score compared to Conway, Allen and Philips.Yes the SR wasnt any good. Hard to say if staying in adds more value than going out when batting aggressively, given the others went cheapishly. But better to bat to a winnable score and lose all wickets than play slow. Isnt it a sin to be only 4 down after 20 overs?

Definitely a sin with only 150 runs on the board.

Only two boundaries for us in the last 5 overs too!

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psychrn

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#2994185 10-Nov-2022 00:47

well that was pretty much a foregone conclusion once they posted the score. The pakistan bowling and fielding was excellent unfortunately

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Dochart

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#2994186 10-Nov-2022 00:59

thermonuclear:
tdgeek:

... Kane bails us out of a horror score. ...

I'm sorry, I can't agree with this. The purpose of the Powerplay overs is to artificially constrain the field inside the circle to promote hitting to, and over, the boundary. Williamson wasted too many Powerplay balls only scoring singles (28 runs off 28 balls) before he smacked that six over square leg, clean as a whistle. He's as much to blame as the rest of the top order in digging the hole to put NZ squarely in the losing position.

When the others fell cheaply, it was even more incumbent on him to hit the 'go-switch' and use his undoubted huge skill to find the fence quickly and often. It's not good enough to say he's going to hold up an end and let the lesser guys at the other end hit. Williamson has more pure skill and ability than any of our other batters, and most in world cricket. Hanging in there until over ten, and having a bit more of a dart after the drinks break won't cut it against top opposition as Pakistan are now demonstrating.

Instead, he continued to swing across the line and knock the ball down to Long On for one. If you're going to risk and hit across the line anyway, he needed to go square and try and find the fence. The game was lost even before he got out.

Agree, knowing what happened to Sri Lanka when they got 143, the score that NZ got was never going to be enough to win the game.

I wonder what NZC is going to do now. I would like NZC to hire a foreign based coach such as Justin Langer. Even before the World Cup NZ hasn’t been doing too well this past year. Lost more series/games than usual.

I think it’s time for Williamson to be dropped as captain. Field placements in today’s game was quite poor. It was so easy for Pakistan to score 4’s and 6’s through the gaps whereas NZ struggled. I didn’t think this was our best squad for the World Cup. Could have added Munro and Bracewell in the playing 11.

Dochart

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#2994187 10-Nov-2022 01:02

I think this loss hurts even more when they still had 6 wickets in hand with a score of 152/4. It feels criminal.

Handle9

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#2994188 10-Nov-2022 01:18

thermonuclear:
Handle9: Lol. Qualified top of the table for the semis and this thread thinks we’re terrible.

Correct. Embarrassing.

Yeah this thread is embarrassing.

GV27

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#2994204 10-Nov-2022 06:32

IDK you'd have a hard time arguing this team was firing on as many cylinders as the one that beat Australia.

Throw in the loss to England (comprehensive) and the narrow miss with Ireland (OK so not narrow but should have been a better performance) and you can chart a reasonable decline in how things were going for us.

You can't show up to a knock-out tournament and put in your tournament best performance in the first game.

Handle9

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#2994213 10-Nov-2022 07:28

GV27:
IDK you'd have a hard time arguing this team was firing on as many cylinders as the one that beat Australia.

Throw in the loss to England (comprehensive) and the narrow miss with Ireland (OK so not narrow but should have been a better performance) and you can chart a reasonable decline in how things were going for us.

You can't show up to a knock-out tournament and put in your tournament best performance in the first game.

We didn’t play particularly well yesterday. It happens, especially in T20.

It’s a far cry from an embarrassment or being a terrible team. This is New Zealand’s most successful cricket team ever with its most successful captain and best ever batsman.

tdgeek

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#2994220 10-Nov-2022 07:45

Handle9:

We didn’t play particularly well yesterday. It happens, especially in T20.

It’s a far cry from an embarrassment or being a terrible team. This is New Zealand’s most successful cricket team ever with its most successful captain and best ever batsman.

I think the issue is not that this team is terrible, no one has said that, its the wildy varying batting. Smashed by RSA in a warmup. Conway scored almost half, the runs, then Philips scores half the runs, then the top 3 fail, Kane does well finally, etc etc. IMO this is probably the best batting team I feel we have ever had. If any of the top 5 got 60 from 42, no one would bat an eyelid, they are that good. The top 5 are generally consistent and top flight players, Santner and Southee can get any high RR in their brief stint, Boult you cannot field to him, then there is Neesham etc. We bat great. But match to match this series its been all over the place. Yes T20 is fickle, but we seem delicate at the moment. TBH the bowling and fielding last night wasn't the usual top standard either. Not a skill issue, and generally not a Captain issue (although he is too passive,) it's between the ears

GV27

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#2994223 10-Nov-2022 07:52

Handle9:

We didn’t play particularly well yesterday. It happens, especially in T20.

It’s a far cry from an embarrassment or being a terrible team. This is New Zealand’s most successful cricket team ever with its most successful captain and best ever batsman.

I wouldn't say it's a terrible team, but you'd struggle to say they managed to maintain the standard they showed in the Australia game.

There's hit and miss, and there's there's hit, miss, miss, miss, miss.

Doesn't mean you're an embarrassment, but it does mean something clearly isn't working that was working then.

Handle9

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#2994227 10-Nov-2022 08:06

GV27:
Handle9:

We didn’t play particularly well yesterday. It happens, especially in T20.

It’s a far cry from an embarrassment or being a terrible team. This is New Zealand’s most successful cricket team ever with its most successful captain and best ever batsman.

I wouldn't say it's a terrible team, but you'd struggle to say they managed to maintain the standard they showed in the Australia game.

There's hit and miss, and there's there's hit, miss, miss, miss, miss.

Doesn't mean you're an embarrassment, but it does mean something clearly isn't working that was working then.

It’s a high variance game and Australia have been pretty poor in T20 for a while. They got comfortably beaten by India and England prior to the tournament.

Every team in this World Cup has had bad games - Pakistan lost to Zimbabwe and England lost to Ireland. Pakistan were out until South Africa lost to the Netherlands. We’ve had yet another very good tournament in a format which is our weakest.

artbloke

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#2994234 10-Nov-2022 08:36

Dochart: I think this loss hurts even more when they still had 6 wickets in hand with a score of 152/4. It feels criminal.

I'd normally agree, but that wicket was pretty difficult to bat on, unless you were fed a lot of loose bowling - unfortunately our bowling was crap from the start & we continued to bowl like that throughout most of the match... we bowled too short, and wide both sides of the wicket, whereas they bowled with accurately in their innings.

artbloke

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#2994237 10-Nov-2022 08:49

Handle9:
GV27:

IDK you'd have a hard time arguing this team was firing on as many cylinders as the one that beat Australia.

Throw in the loss to England (comprehensive) and the narrow miss with Ireland (OK so not narrow but should have been a better performance) and you can chart a reasonable decline in how things were going for us.

You can't show up to a knock-out tournament and put in your tournament best performance in the first game.

We didn’t play particularly well yesterday. It happens, especially in T20.

Yeah, 20/20 is a smash/bash game where any team can win... it really comes down to how well a side bowls whether you win or not, we obviously had a real shocker there.

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#2994254 10-Nov-2022 09:21

I could tell from the second over NZ were going to struggle in that game.

The Pakistan bowling was tight, the fielding was tight and boundaries were simply not happening.

As has already been said - T20 id smash and bash - it needs to be played that way - unfortunately, the Black Caps seemed to be playing more like a 50-over game last night when they were batting.

Conversely, Pakistan were excellent in the field and deserved to win after stifling NZ like that.

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risingstar

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#2994268 10-Nov-2022 09:48

We could have scored few more runs in the last five (credits to good bowling and slow pitch) but that is not the main reason for the failure last night.

In a knockout game 150+ is a decent score and we failed miserably in the fielding department (3 dropped catches and bad wicket keeping TBH) and bowlers failed to adapt to the conditions - Not much variation and failed to capitalise the slow pitch & were not accurate (3 wides vs 0).
We let easy singles and didn't challenge the batsman enough (who were struggling with form). A forgettable semis for Boult. Pak's Field placing was spot on and our field placing was one dayish and really didn't read the innings.

Kane is usually pretty smart but seems like he gave up (mentally) after first 3 overs.

With the form we were in before the WC, we peaked when we reached SF. Time to rethink and rebuild the T20 team.

P.S. Does Erasmus have any bone to pick with NZ ? He raises his finger against blackcaps for every slightest chance he sees.

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