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6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3317818 7-Dec-2024 16:05

Dochart: Bethell at 3 has done well so far, he just missed out his first century.

If we do decide to drop Conway and Mitchell then I agree with moving GP to 5 and let Ravindra open the batting with Young at 4. Chapman is also another option as well. He been in fine form at the moment with that massive double century the other day.

That is exactly what you are seeing, picking players specifically who can do what Baz wanted. Of course a shed load more to chose from.

But Im surprised its not NZ who have focused on high run rate test cricket, not Ind or Eng. But Stead is from a different era. So is Macca but at least hes super aggressive with batting.

This is the future of Test cricket, possibly 4 day matches with a spare day either side for rain, to induce results.

Im not sure about Rachin at 2, I dont know if its the best choice of our boy wonder. He is a Ross Taylor swap, but he is exactly the kind of player at #4 who should be batting like Brook.

Yes Chapman is flying under the radar with excellent avgs in all formats and yep that 276 was a good score for Auckland.

If Conway is not able to hit his way back then we need to start looking at #1/2/3 batsmen to open.

You could drop Mitchell for Chapman and Conway for Young, and Hay in for Blundell

1.Latham
2. Young
3. Williamson
4. Rachin
5. Phillips (who will avg mid 40s up the order)
6. Chapman
7. Hay
8. Smith
9. Henry
10 ORourke
11. B Sears

Or with Chapman, Rachin, GP all can bowl, possibly leave Sears out for an extra batsman

Either way, that team should be able to consistently hit aggresively like Eng have.

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TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3317825 7-Dec-2024 17:06

imo NZ should have known they "bowled" Ind 3-0

to be fair Eng should have been all out sub 200 day1 first test.

We cant just keep meandering along with 3 batsmen. players should be on alert or step down.

Pick a more positive style of play and bat too it, chose players who bat positive and are in form and change them as soon as they need to go back to domestic to find form.

We knew we didnt have the batsmen vs Eng and we knew Eng would take on our quality bowlers so even if they get rolled, instead of being 150 all out they end up 280 all out, big difference on a green top.

IMO Southee being picked for this series was not right, we didnt have a fair well series for Taylor, who I think we released too soon give how many others have failed since. Without Southee we could have gone 3 pace 3 spin options but extended the batting with Young who is a more positive see ball hit ball. Conway I think has just aged and Mitchell was FC 38avg before he started. Its all very sad, but we can easily turn out a team that can play ODI style red ball.

thermonuclear

575 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3318129 8-Dec-2024 20:04

Been doing some pre-Christmas house painting so listened to the coverage of NZ's dismal effort on Sport Nation today. Mssrs Smith, Coney, Elliott, and Galloway were all coming off the long run with regard to NZ's performance in this test. Seemed to be in complete agreement that Southee should not have been picked for the series. Also were alarmed about an interview the station had done with batting coach Luke Ronchi in which he said there are no technical difficulties in the top order.

Finally they are disappointed that NZ Cricket CEO, Scott Weenick, has already suggested Tim Southee is going to be picked for the final test in Hamilton. To a man they believe he has not warranted his place in the side and that it will be criminal if the well-performed Nathan Smith is dropped to make way for Mitch Santner or Will Young while retaining Southee.

Speaking of Smith, he has impressed as the rookie. Bowls wicket balls, if a little costly so far, and can handle himself with the bat. Looks the goods in the view of Coney and Ian Smith. As previously mentioned, Firebirds coach Shane Jurgensen really rates Smith so I'm not surprised he has made an immediate impression. Perhaps Jurgensen should be considered for Stead's job also, think he would be a good pick if they can't secure someone like Fleming or Macmillan for the role.

Blundell played his Henry Nicholls innings today. Still believe he should be dropped when they reconvene for the Zimbabwe tour next year. He was dropped on zero and shouldn't have got the chance to score this century. If he's smart, he will announce his retirement after next week. It's a good way to go out with a fresh ton to his name, leave on a relative high. No way he's the best keeper in the country, his work behind the stumps was not as good as the efforts of part-timer Pope in the opposition.

Conway started his test career with a roar but continues to be dead man walking in this side. Can now perhaps understand why he wasn't on a pathway into the Proteas senior side when he emigrated to New Zealand. Looked like South Africa had lost a diamond initially, now it seems like they knew what they were doing. Maybe he should just cut his losses and concentrate on the T20 world circus. He's well-remunerated there.

With the series and WTC hopes gone, the Sport Nation crew think NZ should ring the changes and bring in a new keeper as well as a new opener, Canterbury's Rhys Mariu.

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3318292 9-Dec-2024 12:01

thermonuclear:

Blundell played his Henry Nicholls innings today. Still believe he should be dropped when they reconvene for the Zimbabwe tour next year. He was dropped on zero and shouldn't have got the chance to score this century.

Conway.

With the series and WTC hopes gone, the Sport Nation crew think NZ should ring the changes and bring in a new keeper as well as a new opener, Canterbury's Rhys Mariu.

I turned off in disgust seeing Blunders get lucky then pull a Nicholls, he still was rubbish this year. I was hoping he would leave with an avg below 30.

Its time to blood 3 or more young players, gettting them in the side vs Eng would be a brilliant pressure cooker, no expectations, plenty of them play there shots

Mariu showed very early signs. 19 FC innnings at avg 70 sr 62 is promising. 4x 100s, 4x 50s. White ball hes had the exact opposite start. Id rather Mariu join up with young team mates Orourke, Hay and maybe Foulkes. Latham might go well with him.

Im pretty unhappy with Latham as well right now, dropping that first test.

There is something special about this Canterbury high performance coaching setup.

Santner is pointless when we have good pace bowlers and GP plus Rachin. Mitch Hay is going well, top avg for Canterbury at 70 takes his fc up to 54. Him and Mariu, Foulkes, Orourke are all products of Canterbury Cricket High Performance coaching team.

1. Latham
2. Mariu (keep eye on him this season)
3 Williamson
4. Young
5. Ravindra
6. GP
7. Mitch Hay
8. Smith
9. Henry
10. Foulkes (top Cant wicket taker at avg 26, see how this season goes)
11. Orourke

Possibly dropping the 4th seamer for Chapman. but 4 high quality pace bowlers. batting to 9/10 should be plenty batting.

Providing these young guns get stuck into some more runs and wickets, that would be a fantastically balanced team with a book end between GP/Hay/Smith to give us back players to form partnerships to add those extra 150 runs you need for 500 consistently.

Plunket Shield, 2024/25 batting most runs career Records | ESPNcricinfo

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3319692 12-Dec-2024 18:44

It doesnt look like Stead is going to drop anyone before this final test, IMO he should be running through as many of the potential NZ Test players as he can. Orourke has fitted in well, I think fellow Cantab Mitch Hay should be put in for WK, but that big ton by Blundell after he was dropped is doing a true "Nicholls".

He has not stood up at #6 like he should be, then 6 of the last 8 tests GP has been left NO on a score. It is just so obvious to switch the two around. But long term Blundell needs to be gone by Ziimbabwe.

I think they should replace Mitchell at #5 with Young. Give Mitch Hay a go at WK #7, put GP to #6. That would be 3 easy fixes that dont need waiting upon by Stead. It wont happen.

Hopefully Mariu continues his blistering season for Cantab and we can sign up yet another Cantab. If so Conwy should be on his bike. I think Foulkes is worth keeping an eye on for a similar player to Henry, likely avg mid 20s with the ball or better and hopefully 20+ like Henry with the bat. That would be another high quality Bowling all rounder with so many injuries in Bowling, it would be so qood to have a high quality bowling all rounder to back up any of our pace attack. Santner would make a good second string spin all rounder, hard to get away putting pressure on the other end to score.

Stead just doesnt make obvous changes quick enough or blood players and keep them interested in red ball before they find another route.

WTC. its neither of the big fast scoring Eng and Ind im it looks like it will be South africa vs aussies.

NZ has dropped Brook back into top 4 and now #1. He's not invincible, his pre Test FC avg shows he wasnt that special, but hes batting how Baz wants him too and it suits him,. But there is no reason NZ cant up our pace to 320 minimum per day, but play the right balls.

thermonuclear

575 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3319741 12-Dec-2024 20:18

Expecting England to make it a 3-0 clean sweep in Hamilton, sorry to say. Stead's contract is up once the WTC final is played, which I think is before the Zimbabwe tour, so this should be his final outing as test coach.

Need to have a proper clean-out of all the coaching, Stead, Ronchi and Oram. I can't remember where I heard it recently, think it was Ian Smith talking to the Sky UK Cricket Podcast with Atherton and Hussain, but apparently McMillan wanted the Black Caps head coach job but was passed over in favour of retaining Stead. Why he stepped back from the batting coach role supposedly. Staggering if that is actually correct.

Amazing how Conway's impending birth has been rolled out as an excuse to spell him for this match. Normally these things are signaled well in advance of a tour. Should have been dropped long ago, but always a handy injury or birth conveniently available to save Stead from actually making a hard decision.

Didn't Southee stand down from the captaincy because his form didn't warrant automatic selection to the first XI? Hardly been sighted out of the team since that 'decision' was made. Can only presume he had to hand over the armband because he's a useless captain then. He's been a great player for NZ, one of our best ever bowlers when he was partnered with Boult and bowling at 140+ clicks as they both did for several seasons.

But seeing him barely over 120kph with the new ball and getting thrashed through the field with impunity is a sad end to his career and tainting that fine record. Should have gone when Boult became a gun for hire, and probably would have done so if he was rated as highly by the T20 moneymen as Boult was. But he wasn't, so he clung onto his NZ career to the detriment of guys like O'Rourke and Sears. No way O'Rourke should be fielding at third man at the start of every bowling innings while Southee labours to the crease bowling club cricket standard meat pies. Very sad for all concerned.

Anyway, guess we will see what we see on Saturday. Don't favour Young opening the innings, they should push either Blundell, Ravindra or even Williamson up there, given he's normally in early with the crap opening pair. New coaching and, with it, a good cleanout is in the Black Cap's future as they head into the new WTC cycle.

Dochart

804 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3319748 12-Dec-2024 21:02

If they don’t want to move Ravindra opening since he has done it for Wellington they should definitely move Williamson to opening as he usually goes in early. I don’t know about Young opening again but he should definitely be played at 3,4 or 5 instead.

Recently Rohit Sharma decided to move from Opening to the middle order to keep the Jaiswal/Rahul partnership going at the top. Virat Kohli moved from 3 to opening the batting for the T20 World Cup. I have never seen Williamson done something like that before and he should definitely open the batting for the betterment of the team.

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3319848 13-Dec-2024 09:21

thermonuclear:

Oram.

Hes been handy for the Otago sides but for our men's team, I just dont think he has what it takes. Vettpri seemed to be a pretty good t20 coach. Mccullum or Macca is what Im hoping but it might be hoping in vane.

I do wonder if Mccullum would even be interested in Coaching NZ, I assume Eng offers significantly more money. He does an awesome job teaching people how to bat quality t20 pace. Or would Macca take the "Head Coach" role......

Either of those two would be good. But our next era is going to be dominated by our bowling, Id love to have Shane Bond doing for these youngsters what he did for Boult/Southee.

If Blundell is going to be in the team, he may as well take the job of opening, which can be a lottery, well it is most of the time. And tell him to bat like that last innings, if we get 200 on the board, it makes 500 consistently easier. I dont believe batting a few hours is going to be overly taxing for a WK. If they all played like it was an ODI, I think these players are better offensive strikers, Only Williamson has the skill and patience to "navigate" his way through the new ball. But hes much better when hes left to score big rather than expectations.

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3319850 13-Dec-2024 09:44

Interesting ODI on right now between WI vs Bang. WI were looking likely with Carty on 95/88 but gets caught. Jangoo 66/61, WI 233/5 current RR 6.3, required RR 6.85 from 13ov, or 88 from 77 balls.

Id say WI look likely despite windex putting them at 25%, they are in an ideal position with just 7rpo will do it, no high risk shots needed, just good placement.

Edit: just as they lose their 6th, but still one player on 70 odd and a couple of all rounders to come.

thermonuclear

575 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3319892 13-Dec-2024 12:22

TeaLeaf:

thermonuclear:

Oram.

Hes been handy for the Otago sides but for our men's team, I just dont think he has what it takes. Vettpri seemed to be a pretty good t20 coach. Mccullum or Macca is what Im hoping but it might be hoping in vane.

I do wonder if Mccullum would even be interested in Coaching NZ, I assume Eng offers significantly more money. He does an awesome job teaching people how to bat quality t20 pace. Or would Macca take the "Head Coach" role......

Agree on Oram and I'm a CD supporter, just don't think he's shown enough to be considered a quality coach, much like Ronchi.

I'd bite both hands off to get McMillan into the Black Caps role, either he's the luckiest man alive or he generally has a positive impact on the sides he's been involved with. What's that saying, the more I practice the luckier I get. There's something about him whereby he is able to get to the crux of the matter. It comes across in his commentary work, he definitely knows his onions. Possibly a better coach than a player and he was a pretty decent player. The easiest guy to get once Stead is shown the door I would have thought.

Guys like Fleming, Vettori, Bond, McCullum, even Hesson are too in demand to even look at NZ as a job opportunity in the short term. Don't think McCullum would even look at the job twice at the moment, regardless of the money NZ Cricket might be able to throw at him. He's further entrenched in the English set-up with the imminent takeover of the white ball sides as well. Plus, you know he wants to be the man to coach England to take back the Ashes and probably on Australian and English soil. Until he has those accomplishments on his CV, he won't step away from his job over there.

Also think NZ Cricket should look at Shane Jurgensen, he's a good coach. Probably the man most responsible for the best bowling attack NZ has had ever. Okay, he's an Aussie, but I think he's pretty much settled in NZ now for good. I'd back him to give a good account. Another one in that boat, but seems like he's gone for good, is South African Heinrich Malan. He coached Central Districts for six years and won five titles with the Stags in the various comps. Took the 'county bumpkins' of a geographically disperse lesser association and made them a quality side against the more fancied city-based associations. Unfortunately he's with Irish Cricket now, and probably in the sights of South African cricket once that contract ends. May have seen the last of him in NZ but he's definitely a quality coach in my opinion.

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3320088 13-Dec-2024 16:04

thermonuclear:

much like Ronchi.

Ronchi when he was announced I struggled to understand why would we not keep macca over ronchi. I didnt consider its much more complicated than that.

Ronchi was an ok WK in t20 but nothing spectacular. I dont think has the same skill set as mccullum who to be fair was not great when he started. But watching him do master classes now you can tell hes a guru at sport psychology and how to dominate the opponent with ya bat.

Martin Guptil is a very technically proficient player both red and white ball with aggressive streak. Like Mccullum, Guppie has extensive offensive skills, his straight drives for me are the best in NZ, in the air or along the ground. Hes good at picking swing and pace bowlers.

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3320098 13-Dec-2024 16:26

West Indies paced that ODI to perfection. The Book End players did so well stopping anymore wickets at 6 down. Jargon steered it home with one Ball remaining hit a 6 plus no balled, so a 7NB shot to win.

Blundell needs to do the same but pace himself by the sessions etc, he has to hit a big score straight up, not when the game is done and dusted.

thermonuclear

575 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3320281 13-Dec-2024 20:33

Brendon Egan from The Press runs his eye over some up-and-comers which should be blooded next year in the NZ test side

https://www.thepress.co.nz/sport/360520330/five-fresh-faces-who-could-bolster-black-caps-next-world-test-championship-cycle

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3320414 14-Dec-2024 11:53

thermonuclear:

Brendon Egan from The Press runs his eye over some up-and-comers which should be blooded next year in the NZ test side

With these super fast bowlers we producing like Fisher, I say get them in before the inevitable injuries. However hes not that tall which will help negate injuries.

I think Ive banged on enough about all of those potentials.

But Blundell is likely to be in as long as Stead is, effectively blocking somebody of much greater talent in Mitch Hay.

Good to see Will Young in the team today.

TeaLeaf

6299 posts

Uber Geek

#3320424 14-Dec-2024 12:10

Geeze Will Young can drive with the best of them, he always looks his best when looking to smack it back down the ground.

and yes having left/right openers, they can put the bowlers off.

edit: Well that is the best session of cricket this summer. I hope Young goes on for a ton, he needs that.

it feels like we are deprived of home cricket this year.

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