Formula 1 2022 Season Discussion

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#2965958 12-Sep-2022 08:10

Red flag is for danger to the recovery marshalls, or debris on the track, both didn't apply

There was time to reset the cars if the had a process to quickly reset the cars which is not hard, but they don't. Using the pitlane is an option for that, but no pitstop, let the lapped cars stay on the track and SC sits at the front of the pitlane, and exits with the cars when last lapped car passes the pitlane. Or slow all cars to a crawl, the lapped cars can pass all cars until they get to the lapped car they are behind. The leading unlapped car is at a crawl, the others can close the gaps

wratterus

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#2965971 12-Sep-2022 09:08

Gutted for Ricciardo. It seems odd that Maclaren do well around Monza. The circuit probably shouldn't suit their car?

And how good was De Vries. He must be stoked with that drive.

The FIA should be able to do something about a red flag in that situation if their primary objective (after safety) is putting on a good & fair spectacle. It's a bit difficult though, because if they start red-flagging more races, it becomes more of a lottery in regards to pit stops & tyre changes under a safety car or VSC before the race is red flagged, like if someone decides to stay out & then the red flag is thrown, they get a free pit stop. Not sure how they could make that more fair though. Is a difficult one to sort out.

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#2966019 12-Sep-2022 09:20

The issue is there is a problem less than 10 laps out. If you safety car it or red flag it, and that can vary, thats inconsistent. Perhaps a Red Flag means all go to pits, no pitstop, then leave pits, so the race is 100% suspended with no advantage/disadvantage. You could also use the trip to the pitlane to remove the lapped cars. The unlapped cars proceed to end of pitlane, the lapped cars hang back and feed it last. Then again, a Safety Car/VSC is part of the variables in F1 which would then disappear

I quite like my idea of slowing the unlapped cars to a crawl, immediately the lapped cars unlap themselves, you lose little race time as the "safety car" is crawling around till the lapped cars are clear, in fact why not let the SC crawl for all the SC period, as the cars dont overheat like they used to

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#2966022 12-Sep-2022 09:26

Yeah that is probably the best idea. They'll be complaining about tyre temp in that situation, but with the tyre blankets going completely in the near future, that shouldn't be an issue as it wouldn't be much different to warming tyres up from a pit stop.

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#2966023 12-Sep-2022 09:27

Benoire:
I think they could have out a red flag out there; they knew it would take a time to clear the McLaren as it wasn't near an exit and unlapping the cars would take too long... Red flag the race, sort out the cars in the pits, standing start and boom 3 laps of fun.

edit: I just don't think the FIA protocols are particularly setup to be exciting though and certainly not dynamic enough.

I'm impressed F1 followed protocol lol

Benoire

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#2966035 12-Sep-2022 09:59

This is true... As Hamilton stated he was happy that it was followed correctly this time... I wonder if there is a case to consider the situation, e.g. LeClerk appeared to be no where near Verstappen so a grid start could be considered to be unfair but if you had the front runners close behind each other there where overtakes goign to happen that would change the lead then maybe a red flag/grid start would be acceptable as otherwise the SC would rob the viewers of an exciting end...

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#2966037 12-Sep-2022 10:09

Benoire:

This is true... As Hamilton stated he was happy that it was followed correctly this time... I wonder if there is a case to consider the situation, e.g. LeClerk appeared to be no where near Verstappen so a grid start could be considered to be unfair but if you had the front runners close behind each other there where overtakes goign to happen that would change the lead then maybe a red flag/grid start would be acceptable as otherwise the SC would rob the viewers of an exciting end...

Yep, I get that. I have no issue if a VSC/SC/RF favoured a team/driver and unfavoured another team/driver, thats motorsport. But it needs to have a fixed rule as to when any of these occur, and if they want to secure more racing, less stoppages, as was the case last night, that's fine. It just has to be the same whether its lap 3 or 5 or less from the end

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#2966059 12-Sep-2022 11:33

Red Bull again untouchable, so that's pretty much the season sorted now.

Has been a solid shake up of a year, so that's been cool to see.
Mercedes out and Red Bull win convincingly and without controversy, so again good on that front.

Benoire

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#2966062 12-Sep-2022 11:47

The Redbull is mighty fast, decent in low speed and acceptable in mid/high speed corners... its probably the best all round package with one of the best drivers on the grid... Perez I'm not sure what has happened but he is well of Verstappens pace. The Ferarri has problems... LeClerk was told not to short shift which is a problem in tight corners with these engines due to the amount of torque so that suggests the engine reliability is not there... Ferarri have built a powerful engine with great traction deliverability from its hybrid system but it seems like the engine wants to go bang at any opporunity... Mercedes are clearly the 3rd fastest but potentially as quick as ferarri in race pace... They've got a handle on the car now.. its still too slow... more wind tunnel time next year compared to this year and compared to RB may allow them to imrpove their performance to more akin to RB... Ferarri need to hope they can get reliability out of their engines otherwise they may be screwed until the next engine changes in 2026.

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#2966063 12-Sep-2022 11:51

What I like (and yes I am an RBR fan as well as McLaren and the odd other driver) is that RBR isn't carrying extra horsepower, making it untouchable. Its not the fastest in the speed trap, its not No.1 in Quali, and there have been races where they said, Ferrari was just too fast

But they have the best package of car, team and driver. Arguably, not 10/10 on anything, but 9/10 on everything

Also, Sergio is a good driver, if RBR had two Sergio's, it would be a close fight, but you'd probably see Ferrari edging away most race weekends

Max, love him or hate him, is the one making the difference, in a car that is not outstanding on anything. If they are quick in a speed trap, they ran a smaller wing, like anyone can. They did that at Spa. At Monza, another high speed track they actually ran more wing than most.

They seem to be nailing a lot, and IMHO deserve what they are earning this season

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#2966067 12-Sep-2022 11:52

Six rounds left so the maximum available points is 6x26 = 156
Max Verstappen is on 335, Charles Leclerc is on 219: a 116 point gap

If Verstappen wins the next race (Singapore) and has fastest lap, he'll be on 361.
If Leclerc is second he'll be on 237, a 124 point gap; third gets 234, a 127 point gap; fourth 231, a 130 point gap

There'd be 130 points left, so if Verstappen finishes first in Singapore, and Leclerc finishes fifth or worse, that's it: #1 for Max in 2023

Would that - five rounds still to go - be the earliest a Formula 1 Championship has been decided?

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#2966068 12-Sep-2022 11:53

Benoire:

The Redbull is mighty fast, decent in low speed and acceptable in mid/high speed corners... its probably the best all round package with one of the best drivers on the grid... Perez I'm not sure what has happened but he is well of Verstappens pace. The Ferarri has problems... LeClerk was told not to short shift which is a problem in tight corners with these engines due to the amount of torque so that suggests the engine reliability is not there... Ferarri have built a powerful engine with great traction deliverability from its hybrid system but it seems like the engine wants to go bang at any opporunity... Mercedes are clearly the 3rd fastest but potentially as quick as ferarri in race pace... They've got a handle on the car now.. its still too slow... more wind tunnel time next year compared to this year and compared to RB may allow them to imrpove their performance to more akin to RB... Ferarri need to hope they can get reliability out of their engines otherwise they may be screwed until the next engine changes in 2026.

Im wondering if Ferrari are running higher engine mappings, more than others. You can create artificial speed with wings, but with the engine you will pay, either failures, breakdowns or penalties. Just my speculation

Benoire

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#2966069 12-Sep-2022 11:54

tdgeek:

What I like (and yes I am an RBR fan as well as McLaren and the odd other driver) is that RBR isn't carrying extra horsepower, making it untouchable. Its not the fastest in the speed trap, its not No.1 in Quali, and there have been races where they said, Ferrari was just too fast

But they have the best package of car, team and driver. Arguably, not 10/10 on anything, but 9/10 on everything

Also, Sergio is a good driver, if RBR had two Sergio's, it would be a close fight, but you'd probably see Ferrari edging away most race weekends

Max, love him or hate him, is the one making the difference, in a car that is not outstanding on anything. If they are quick in a speed trap, they ran a smaller wing, like anyone can. They did that at Spa. At Monza, another high speed track they actually ran more wing than most.

They seem to be nailing a lot, and IMHO deserve what they are earning this season

I'd agree with the RB position. Mercedes have stated that its similar in power ouput to theirs but its a more efficient aero package and has less overall drag. The Ferarri is the most powerful engine (as Binotto has stated) but will have reliaiblity issues and potential to go boom at any moment.

I'd really love to know the difference between Max and Checo... how the drivers drive the car and respond to the cars characteristics.

Benoire

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#2966070 12-Sep-2022 11:57

tdgeek:

Benoire:

The Redbull is mighty fast, decent in low speed and acceptable in mid/high speed corners... its probably the best all round package with one of the best drivers on the grid... Perez I'm not sure what has happened but he is well of Verstappens pace. The Ferarri has problems... LeClerk was told not to short shift which is a problem in tight corners with these engines due to the amount of torque so that suggests the engine reliability is not there... Ferarri have built a powerful engine with great traction deliverability from its hybrid system but it seems like the engine wants to go bang at any opporunity... Mercedes are clearly the 3rd fastest but potentially as quick as ferarri in race pace... They've got a handle on the car now.. its still too slow... more wind tunnel time next year compared to this year and compared to RB may allow them to imrpove their performance to more akin to RB... Ferarri need to hope they can get reliability out of their engines otherwise they may be screwed until the next engine changes in 2026.

Im wondering if Ferrari are running higher engine mappings, more than others. You can create artificial speed with wings, but with the engine you will pay, either failures, breakdowns or penalties. Just my speculation

Binotto said they focused on power output and hoped to fix the reliability of doing so in the season and afterwards under the banner of making the engine more reliable which teams can do... I've always found that a bit cheeky tbh.

tdgeek

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#2966081 12-Sep-2022 12:35

Benoire:

Binotto said they focused on power output and hoped to fix the reliability of doing so in the season and afterwards under the banner of making the engine more reliable which teams can do... I've always found that a bit cheeky tbh.

Yep :-)

Back in the day an engine lasted 750 miles, one race weekend. Or drop a new one on in Quali and race. Now they run about 11000 rpm instead of 21000 odd, and also tone down the mappings for a longer life. I guess you can push that, I felt Mercedes was doing that, and then Lewis took 3 engine installs in one day and 75 places on the grid, but was only the length of the grid. now thats cheeky, and I think since banned

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