Formula 1 2023 Season Discussion

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#3118721 21-Aug-2023 17:34

There's always two sides to any initiative here.

At the moment tyre choice (doesn't seem to be much between any of the compounds currently?!) and aero setting are the gambles for the racing.
Take those away and you start to create the perfect car option and you know one team is going to totally nail that. ie more Red Bull 2023 domination scenarios.

Likewise if you keep changing up the rules, you don't give any team the opportunity to catchup.

You need the opportunity to make mistakes. Manual gear shifts, no antilock breaking, refueling, tyres that only last 20 laps and dramatically fall off the cliff etc.
These things each gave the opportunity for a mistake, but even then it has to be significant enough for the mistake to be pounced upon, like there are consequences and you're passed, rather than just a slip up blip and back on with it.

To what degree the sport is manufactured for this though is the game. You can't call yourself the pinnacle of motorsport if you're not using antilock breaking etc. That's then fully artificially limiting the technology that is available.

Extrapolate that out though and we're into full self driving and AI capabilities to supplement the driver. That would be the state of where we are at in modern terms, plus extensive use of electric motors and battery tech etc, both of which start to hit at the core of what F1 DNA is etc. The engines are already dramatically quieter now to accommodate the eco aspects, and the cars wider and heavier than ever. Definitely not a quick fix solution and pros and cons to everything.

/EndRant

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Jaxson

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#3120362 26-Aug-2023 08:47

Boom it's all on!

Kiwi driver Liam Lawson will make his F1 debut at the Dutch Grand Prix this weekend as an injury replacement for AlphaTauri driver Daniel Ricciardo.

Ricciardo will miss this the race after fracturing his left hand on Saturday (NZT) in a crash during practice ahead of the Formula One race.

The 34-year-old Australian was injured when he crashed into the barriers during the second practice in Zandvoort and was taken to a hospital for evaluation.

AlphaTauri said Ricciardo fractured a bone in his left hand and will be replaced by reserve driver Lawson.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/motorsport/300958336/kiwi-driver-liam-lawson-to-make-f1-debut-at-dutch-grand-prix-this-weekend

thermonuclear

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#3120583 26-Aug-2023 13:48

Rookie mistake from Ricciardo in not taking the hands off the wheel, but one man's misfortune and all that.

After his forgettable outing in SF last Sunday, things could have hardly landed better for Lawson six days later. Judging by the FP1 efforts I watched last night it's going to be a challenging debut for him, a narrow track and variable winds catching quite a few of the drivers out.

Hope he can acquit himself well and has a clean couple of days in quali and the race. He has the prospect of Monza to look forward to next weekend as well, which will be a far easier track to showcase his skills. Will probably enjoy going up against his former team mate in Sargeant as well, with the latter's seat seemingly on the line.

Great to have a Kiwi driver back in F1, even if only temporarily at this stage.

tdgeek

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#3121075 28-Aug-2023 10:12

Today we had the 10th Kiwi to drive in Formula 1. Liam Lawson ran 13th of 20, it was a stellar drive as he is reserve driver, had to step in for Free Practice 3, never got a chance to get up to speed missing the other 2 practice sessions, then it rained he hasn't been in an F1 car on inters or the wet, so ended up qualifying last. Race was dry then wet then dry then wet, held his place well, and kept the car on the black stuff. Talk about the deep end.

Compare to Sargeant and deVries, even Tsunoda when a rookie. Pretty darn good IMHO. Had he had full practice sessions, dry race, even better I feel.

Horner feels Singapore return for Danny Ricc, so assume we will see Liam at Monza this weekend

langi27

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#3121101 28-Aug-2023 11:23

Solid effort for Lawson, got the feeling he was tip toeing around nowhere near 100%. Hopefully he gets some dry running at Monza and can prove he deserves to be there. Timesheets will show he bet his team mate which on debut is very important.

tdgeek

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#3121110 28-Aug-2023 11:34

langi27:

Solid effort for Lawson, got the feeling he was tip toeing around nowhere near 100%. Hopefully he gets some dry running at Monza and can prove he deserves to be there. Timesheets will show he bet his team mate which on debut is very important.

Deduct his 10 second pit penalty he was 9th. Sure, his race would have been different if he had no penaty so we will never know, but the time classification shows that

hairy1

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#3121169 28-Aug-2023 14:02

His fastest lap was 1.4 seconds faster than Yuki, placed higher than Riccardos two last races. A very solid debut. Amazing conditions for his first start.

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thermonuclear

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#3121354 28-Aug-2023 19:08

Very solid outing from Lawson on his debut, couldn't ask for more really. Kept his nose clean, off the walls and out of the gravel. Already looking forward to seeing him at a hopefully dry Monza.

It's being suggested by quite a few that Singapore might be a little too challenging for a return for the recovering Ricciardo, so Liam could potentially have a third race as well. That would sink his potential FP1 sessions for AT and RB, but would provide an additional measure for AT/RB to consider if he goes well in the next two races.

I'm not sure either Tsunoda or Ricciardo would be happy about three impressive drives from Lawson. I remain unconvinced that Ricciardo is the the answer to any driver question on the basis of his efforts in two races with AT so far. He comes back after Singapore and still isn't comprehensive against Yuki, then how is Liam not a better prospect moving forward, younger and much cheaper.

It's all in Lawson's hands, he's got to make the next two drives really count.

tdgeek

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#3121369 28-Aug-2023 21:05

thermonuclear:

Very solid outing from Lawson on his debut, couldn't ask for more really. Kept his nose clean, off the walls and out of the gravel. Already looking forward to seeing him at a hopefully dry Monza.

It's being suggested by quite a few that Singapore might be a little too challenging for a return for the recovering Ricciardo, so Liam could potentially have a third race as well. That would sink his potential FP1 sessions for AT and RB, but would provide an additional measure for AT/RB to consider if he goes well in the next two races.

I'm not sure either Tsunoda or Ricciardo would be happy about three impressive drives from Lawson. I remain unconvinced that Ricciardo is the the answer to any driver question on the basis of his efforts in two races with AT so far. He comes back after Singapore and still isn't comprehensive against Yuki, then how is Liam not a better prospect moving forward, younger and much cheaper.

It's all in Lawson's hands, he's got to make the next two drives really count.

We all know what Helmut Marko is like. Its a perfect storm in a good way for Liam. HM knows that whatever goodness Lawson shows there will be ongoing improvement

Jaxson

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#3121459 29-Aug-2023 00:28

Perez has huge questions of him now.
Consistently off Max to a degree no one can understand.

thermonuclear

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#3121465 29-Aug-2023 08:00

Jaxson: Perez has huge questions of him now.
Consistently off Max to a degree no one can understand.

When you watch Perez there's an element of a kid learning to ride a bike. It's never fully comfortable and you're always expecting him to fall off at any moment.

I accept that he is probably doing enough to keep P2 in the Drivers, and contributes towards the Constructors, but you do wonder if Ricciardo could do the same job with far less fuss. That has to be the proposition which Red Bull are considering. Will likely be very costly to buy Checo out of the last year of his deal though.

On the other hand, Danny Ricc would bring a fair bit to the marketing table with his profile and likeability.

Jaxson

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#3121704 29-Aug-2023 20:02

Yep Danny Ric is now more valuable for his personality and marketability than anything else at this point. He’s got the skills to at least match Perez but brings someone who is comfortable on chat shows etc too. He’s probably more valuable than just sponsorship alone.

thermonuclear

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#3123216 3-Sep-2023 10:43

Great quali effort from Lawson overnight, P12 and just a tenth off Tsunoda. A lot of people are saying it's an easy circuit but the same is true for the other nineteen drivers, who all have more experience in an F1 car than him, so credit where it's due. He's making every post a winner so far.

Are the AT's a chance of points tonight? After the progression Liam's made in one and a half weekend's running so far, you wouldn't entirely discount the possibility if there's shenanigans further up the track. I'd put even money on Ferrari's race management screwing up spectacularly yet again.

tdgeek

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#3123381 3-Sep-2023 17:51

thermonuclear:

Great quali effort from Lawson overnight, P12 and just a tenth off Tsunoda. A lot of people are saying it's an easy circuit but the same is true for the other nineteen drivers, who all have more experience in an F1 car than him, so credit where it's due. He's making every post a winner so far.

Are the AT's a chance of points tonight? After the progression Liam's made in one and a half weekend's running so far, you wouldn't entirely discount the possibility if there's shenanigans further up the track. I'd put even money on Ferrari's race management screwing up spectacularly yet again.

Best quali I have ever watched. Now we are all F1 fans. Its usually about your team. RBR is my team due to Mark Webber. McLaren obviously.

But this quali was awesome. Liam was over FP's, 6/10 5/10 but generally 3/10 behind Tsunoda. That closed over quali, now 1.5/10 thats pretty awesome. Im not sure how much you can evaluate Tsunoda's experience to Lawsons. But I imagine 3/10, that favours Lawson, making Liam Lawson better. There may or may not be a bias there... :-) But in all honesty he is punching well above his weight. Tsunoda is not slow, he is very decent. And like most rookies he is fraught with mistakes, just like Vettel and Verstappen, both of whom did ok I heard..... Liam Lawson is right there but no rookie issues so far (ok its early)

Piastri (a Kiwi cuzzy bro) and a McLaren driver is also punching above his weight.

I REALLY rate Albon. Really rate him, he did well

Ferrari, its their track they did well, good to see

RBR, my team, did well. Max did well, thats it. Im more than ok with that, due to the points above. Barring accidents, Max will win, but that's not the point, it was a great quali for Kiwi's and Down Unders.

Re your post that Monza is easy, its not. Less corners, so less chance for the cream to rise to the top.

Race wise, Ferrari probably dont have race pace. They turned the wick up to look good, not uncommon. RBR do the opposite, tune it for the race. Mercedes looked average bt also looked very good, at times, I expect them to be like RBR, better in the race, and most likely very strong at the end

Perez, go to the UB40 website and fill in the form....

hairy1

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#3123383 3-Sep-2023 18:01

Yuki is in his third season of F1. Liam is in his third day... He is punching well above his weight. Bringing it home at the Dutch Grand Prix was pretty amazing considering the conditions.

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