Formula 1 2023 Season Discussion

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25 posts

Geek

#3157951 10-Nov-2023 10:53

GV27:

Thrown out.

And yet...

. Given that, notwithstanding the formal outcome of this Decision, the Stewards have seen
individual pieces of evidence that show what appear to be potential track limit breaches at the
apex of Turn 6, they find their inability to properly enforce the current standard for track limits
for all competitors completely unsatisfactory and therefore strongly recommend to all
concerned that a solution to prevent further reoccurrences of this widespread problem be
rapidly deployed.

I'll admit, I'm not too surprised, probably more surprised the stewards acknowledged this, and also used as part of their reasoning the fact using the cherry picked onboards by Haas meant that it'd be inconsistent (i.e. what about all the drivers that had no one in front/behind).

As much as I wanted it to succeed from an integrity POV, I can't fault the stewards reasoning, and honestly my hunch was that the stewards would basically say "We looked at the broadcast on board cameras and noticed the broadcast used this angle the entire race so how is it new?".

The stewards have surprisingly been a bit critical of the FIA in a few decisions, pointing out rules that weren't really fit for purpose, and their Austrian decision critiqued the enforcement of track limits too. Question now is if something will change.

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tdgeek

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#3157977 10-Nov-2023 12:02

I agree with track limits. I agree with the stewards locating and enforcing them. In any sport, stuff will be missed, that's life.

As stated above if viewers/drivers/teams get nit picky over it, use gravel or bare soil to apply the penalties

Jaxson

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#3158031 10-Nov-2023 13:49

Yeah if it's going to a big thing (and frankly it hurts the sport a bit compared to say Indycar where they just go nuts racing finding the fastest line) then they'll need to add some sensor or high speed camera tech to track the cars and make the decision for the stewards.

Doesn't really feel like the thing you restrict down to just the TV angles they happen to be shown etc.

GV27

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#3158036 10-Nov-2023 14:05

This has to be something that AI can adjudicate and process.

tdgeek

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#3158039 10-Nov-2023 14:11

Surely gravel or sand is the easiest and most effective solution? And cheapest

GV27

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#3158040 10-Nov-2023 14:13

tdgeek:

Surely gravel or sand is the easiest and most effective solution? And cheapest

I mean this is the best option, but if we continue to have massive kerbs and concrete run-offs than it's inevitable drivers will take the piss to the extent that the rules allow.

And rules are only as good as the likelihood of them being enforced.

Benoire

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#3158049 10-Nov-2023 14:26

tdgeek:

Surely gravel or sand is the easiest and most effective solution? And cheapest

Most of these circuits are used in other formulas and gravel/sand is not the preferred for motorbike racing as it can cause riders to flip as the wheels get caught.

tdgeek

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#3158050 10-Nov-2023 14:26

GV27:

I mean this is the best option, but if we continue to have massive kerbs and concrete run-offs than it's inevitable drivers will take the piss to the extent that the rules allow.

And rules are only as good as the likelihood of them being enforced.

Yep. They could put a sand layer 2 metres from the white line, and it be 2 metres wide on the bends, that should be enough for concrete kerbs, and the sanitised concrete run off is still there. If they go off track limites, they enter sand horror, that possibly a 2 second loss of laptime, per offence. And no three strikes rule. Super easy and super cheap.

1 x Concrete Cutter

1 x Truck of Sand

4 x Spades

One time when the cheap option would be the best option

tdgeek

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#3158052 10-Nov-2023 14:31

Benoire:

Most of these circuits are used in other formulas and gravel/sand is not the preferred for motorbike racing as it can cause riders to flip as the wheels get caught.

Very good point. Could they fabricate some lighter concrete strips or pads to add back after the F1 race? Actually many bike circuits have gravel. They often manage to stay upright. Sand is less harsh, and its only a strip 2 metres wide, 2 metres from the white line.

mudguard

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#3158085 10-Nov-2023 15:58

Just have tiny sprinklers on the curbs. Turn them on at the start of the race. And off at the end. That'll learn em 😁

Benoire

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#3158093 10-Nov-2023 16:26

Lets go one further and get some blowers, the cars are terribly susceptible to cross winds... a bit of water AND wind and whoosh they'll all keep clear of the edge of the track!

tdgeek

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#3160676 17-Nov-2023 19:11

Vegas looks boring. Given the track failed havent seen much of it, but the safety car camera view that Karun showed, shows its boring. Primarily as its narrow. if you've ever watched a Long Beach Indycar race you will know what I mean. Narrow. Too narrow.

Ocon got damage too. The drains are welded, except the frame they are welded to, failed.

mdf

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#3160678 17-Nov-2023 19:17

USD 500 million. Absolute mindblowing city scape background. And they got 9 minutes of running time because of a drain cover.

Benoire

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#3160680 17-Nov-2023 19:18

I don't believe they will be able to fix it safely. The surface looks to be asphalt and while that can be milled and relayed fairly fast, it will be nasty due to the oils that need to be released (they take about 6 weeks to fully disappear and can be slippy until then) but the main issue is the concrete, that cannot be just cast and left to cure it will take upwards of 2-3 days to cure sufficeintly and safely. Using a 50/60mpa concrete, curing to walking on is ~2 hours but for it to last and be durable will take a few days.

There would have to be some very large civil works to either cover the lid and asphalt over it with a bigger patch but even then that will take time and could impact FP2 and FP3.

snj

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Geek

#3160681 17-Nov-2023 19:22

The most exciting part of FP1 was on F1TV's pre-bit with Blue Man Group completely freaking Laura Winters out.

But what an awful situation, assuming FP2 even happens (who knows) Sainz and Ocon are unlikely to participate based on statements by the teams. Zhou also had damage, but noone has really talked about the extent. Saw a photo on Reddit from ESPN that showed that Sainz's floor was basically obliterated. Fred has already said that the monocoque, engine and energy store are ruined (source - hmmm Twitter link seemed to get nixed, replaced).

Really hoping that FIA suspend any racing penalties because of this for the repairs, would be extremely unfair otherwise (hopefully also dragging FOM who are the organisers for this race in front of the stewards too).

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