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mattwnz
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  #1009895 20-Mar-2014 14:42
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Apparently if Malaysian airlines had subscribed to a $US10 service per flight, they would have a far better idea of where the plan now is.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9849214/Missing-plane-lacked-upgrade-vital-to-search

Maybe that is a question people should be asking airlines before they book with them. People wouldn't have any idea what services airlines have chosen to subscribe to. 
 I think the odds of now ever finding it are very low, if it has crashed into the indian. Pieces of it maybe found washed ashore, but that isn't probably going to pinpoint where it is, and there is probably only a few more weeks before the black box stops transmitting.

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tdgeek
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  #1009910 20-Mar-2014 15:04
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mattwnz: Apparently if Malaysian airlines had subscribed to a $US10 service per flight, they would have a far better idea of where the plan now is.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9849214/Missing-plane-lacked-upgrade-vital-to-search

Maybe that is a question people should be asking airlines before they book with them. People wouldn't have any idea what airlines are doing to save money.
I think the odds of now ever finding it are almost zero, if it has crashed into the sea. Pieces of it maybe found washed ashore, but that isn't probably going to pinpoint where it is, and there is probably only a few more weeks before the black box stops transmitting.


I thought the service would still ping, it just won't carry all the engine health info? 

If there is debris, they can calculate in reverse to its rough origin based on wind and currents. While it could be anywhere, I cannot see with all the efforts by multi aircraft and shipping that not one piece of debris has been found. There would be a lot, and it will spread out over time, and travel. Indicates it hasn't crashed at sea. Why fly for alleged hours then crash it? 

I cannot get over the GREAT clues that have since been false. The Kiwi who saw it (where it would have been) on fire, was false. Multiple Maldives sightings, detailed, appearing to match the low altitude reports, false.  Bizarre to say the least.

IMO, all the normal theoretical opinions are false as towhat has happened as it is not an investigation in a normal crash/disaster scenario. Its a man made situation, so the normal rules of assessing the possible location/causes is basically out the door. It is possible that a disaster on board could have caused the change of course, but not to continually avoid detection.  I know see a terrorist hijacking as a real possibility. "Look what we have done and can do, at any time"

Unless it did go down, semi controlled, to land at sea, at which point it develeoped large cracks from the impact but did not break up, and sunk in one piece? If that was in the Indian Ocean, that is very deep, that would match with the zero result so far. 

nicnzl
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  #1009913 20-Mar-2014 15:09
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+10 on this

tdgeek: 
I cannot get over the GREAT clues that have since been false.  


It's amazing how a theory or clue one day is just completely false the next.  No wonder the families are getting pretty p*ssed off!



mattwnz
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  #1009921 20-Mar-2014 15:13
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tdgeek:
mattwnz: Apparently if Malaysian airlines had subscribed to a $US10 service per flight, they would have a far better idea of where the plan now is.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9849214/Missing-plane-lacked-upgrade-vital-to-search

Maybe that is a question people should be asking airlines before they book with them. People wouldn't have any idea what airlines are doing to save money.
I think the odds of now ever finding it are almost zero, if it has crashed into the sea. Pieces of it maybe found washed ashore, but that isn't probably going to pinpoint where it is, and there is probably only a few more weeks before the black box stops transmitting.


I thought the service would still ping, it just won't carry all the engine health info? 

If there is debris, they can calculate in reverse to its rough origin based on wind and currents. While it could be anywhere, I cannot see with all the efforts by multi aircraft and shipping that not one piece of debris has been found. There would be a lot, and it will spread out over time, and travel. Indicates it hasn't crashed at sea. Why fly for alleged hours then crash it? 

I cannot get over the GREAT clues that have since been false. The Kiwi who saw it (where it would have been) on fire, was false. Multiple Maldives sightings, detailed, appearing to match the low altitude reports, false.  Bizarre to say the least.

IMO, all the normal theoretical opinions are false as towhat has happened as it is not an investigation in a normal crash/disaster scenario. Its a man made situation, so the normal rules of assessing the possible location/causes is basically out the door. It is possible that a disaster on board could have caused the change of course, but not to continually avoid detection.  I know see a terrorist hijacking as a real possibility. "Look what we have done and can do, at any time"

Unless it did go down, semi controlled, to land at sea, at which point it develeoped large cracks from the impact but did not break up, and sunk in one piece? If that was in the Indian Ocean, that is very deep, that would match with the zero result so far. 


I believe that that is the service that did 'ping', but from the info that has been released, it doesn't pin point the location, it just creates a radius from the satellite, hence the arcs that it could have traveled on. If they had subscribed to the service, it would have also sent a lot of other information, at least that is what the story says. There was an air france plane that crashed a few years ago where they used that info to locate it eventually. Although that too took a long time, but they knew the rough location. But if that took a long time, then imagine how long it would take if they didn't have a rough location.
How much debris there is, depends on how it crashed. It may have even landed on the sea, largely intact, but then sunk, where there may  be little debris. There are planes that have disappeared in the past and still have never been found.



tdgeek
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  #1009924 20-Mar-2014 15:17
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mattwnz:
tdgeek:
mattwnz: Apparently if Malaysian airlines had subscribed to a $US10 service per flight, they would have a far better idea of where the plan now is.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9849214/Missing-plane-lacked-upgrade-vital-to-search

Maybe that is a question people should be asking airlines before they book with them. People wouldn't have any idea what airlines are doing to save money.
I think the odds of now ever finding it are almost zero, if it has crashed into the sea. Pieces of it maybe found washed ashore, but that isn't probably going to pinpoint where it is, and there is probably only a few more weeks before the black box stops transmitting.


I thought the service would still ping, it just won't carry all the engine health info? 

If there is debris, they can calculate in reverse to its rough origin based on wind and currents. While it could be anywhere, I cannot see with all the efforts by multi aircraft and shipping that not one piece of debris has been found. There would be a lot, and it will spread out over time, and travel. Indicates it hasn't crashed at sea. Why fly for alleged hours then crash it? 

I cannot get over the GREAT clues that have since been false. The Kiwi who saw it (where it would have been) on fire, was false. Multiple Maldives sightings, detailed, appearing to match the low altitude reports, false.  Bizarre to say the least.

IMO, all the normal theoretical opinions are false as towhat has happened as it is not an investigation in a normal crash/disaster scenario. Its a man made situation, so the normal rules of assessing the possible location/causes is basically out the door. It is possible that a disaster on board could have caused the change of course, but not to continually avoid detection.  I know see a terrorist hijacking as a real possibility. "Look what we have done and can do, at any time"

Unless it did go down, semi controlled, to land at sea, at which point it develeoped large cracks from the impact but did not break up, and sunk in one piece? If that was in the Indian Ocean, that is very deep, that would match with the zero result so far. 


I believe that that is the service that did 'ping', but from the info that has been released, it doesn't pin point the location, it just creates a radius from the satellite, hence the arcs that it could have traveled on. If they had subscribed to the service, it would have also sent a lot of other information, at least that is what the story says. There was an air rance plance that crashed a few years ago where they used that info to locate it eventually. Although that too took a long time, but they knew the rough location.
How much debris there is, depends on how it crashed. It may have even landed on the sea, largely intact, but then sunk, where there may  be little debris. There are planes that have disappeared in the past and still have never been found.


Yep, agree with you.

frankv
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  #1009929 20-Mar-2014 15:26
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From the stuff article

The satellite industry official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the investigation, likened the Swift system to a cellphone that sends data to a satellite. He described ACARS as akin to an app for a mobile phone.


Well, if I'd said that, I'd want it to be on condition of anonymity too.embarassed

Anyone who thinks for a moment would realize that cellphones do NOT send data to satellites. And what exactly is the difference between a cellphone and a 'mobile phone'?

More junk reporting, either by junk reporters or junk 'satellite industry officials'. yell

And junk editing, by editors so desperate to get *something* on this story that they'll print anything without thinking about it for a moment.

But there is in fact something similar, available for about that price. That's Spidertracks (http://www.spidertracks.com), which *does* send your position by satellite, back to a website, every 30 seconds or so IIRC. Unfortunately, this excellent safety measure cannot be legally installed on an airliner, because it is not certified by civil aviation authorities. Instead, 'black boxes' that cost megabucks must be carried and found (hopefully still readable) in the wreckage. Assuming the wreckage can be found.

MurrayM
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  #1009953 20-Mar-2014 15:53
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mattwnz: Apparently if Malaysian airlines had subscribed to a $US10 service per flight, they would have a far better idea of where the plan now is.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9849214/Missing-plane-lacked-upgrade-vital-to-search

Maybe that is a question people should be asking airlines before they book with them. People wouldn't have any idea what services airlines have chosen to subscribe to. 
 I think the odds of now ever finding it are very low, if it has crashed into the indian. Pieces of it maybe found washed ashore, but that isn't probably going to pinpoint where it is, and there is probably only a few more weeks before the black box stops transmitting.

 

I read this too and the part that I thought funny was:

 

Asked why an airline might choose not to buy an application that sells for a relatively modest cost, the official said, "Every pound on an aircraft is fuel consumed. As in all matters, it always comes down to cost."

 

If it's a software application then surely it has no weight?



Batman
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  #1009965 20-Mar-2014 16:06
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how did they know the flight change was programmed and they can even say when it was programmed?




Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


tdgeek
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  #1009967 20-Mar-2014 16:09
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joker97: how did they know the flight change was programmed and they can even say when it was programmed?


That is item 563, unknown if it goes into the fact, fiction, rumour, exaggeration, or newsworthy theory to sell more papers pile.

As someone here said a while back, so much clutter.

Batman
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  #1009972 20-Mar-2014 16:14
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yeah so much junk has come up since, I can't even remember which bit is fact and which aren't ...

all I know now is - it took off, it disappeared, no one's found anything. maybe i'll go back to the wiki page ...




Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


mattwnz
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  #1009988 20-Mar-2014 16:30
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MurrayM:
mattwnz: Apparently if Malaysian airlines had subscribed to a $US10 service per flight, they would have a far better idea of where the plan now is.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9849214/Missing-plane-lacked-upgrade-vital-to-search

Maybe that is a question people should be asking airlines before they book with them. People wouldn't have any idea what services airlines have chosen to subscribe to. 
 I think the odds of now ever finding it are very low, if it has crashed into the indian. Pieces of it maybe found washed ashore, but that isn't probably going to pinpoint where it is, and there is probably only a few more weeks before the black box stops transmitting.
I read this too and the part that I thought funny was:

 

Asked why an airline might choose not to buy an application that sells for a relatively modest cost, the official said, "Every pound on an aircraft is fuel consumed. As in all matters, it always comes down to cost."

 

If it's a software application then surely it has no weight?


You have to wonder if these people really know what they are talking about.I wonder if Air NZ subscribes to it. I think consumers should be demanding more info from airlines now. Airlines could use this sort of thing as a point of difference to use them over other providers.

I looks like they may have found something off Australia

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/9850222/Objects-linked-to-missing-plane-found

tdgeek
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  #1009990 20-Mar-2014 16:31
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CNN alert just now

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said Thursday that authorities have found objects in the Indian Ocean that could possibly be related to the search for missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, Australian media reported.

networkn
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  #1010005 20-Mar-2014 16:34
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tdgeek: CNN alert just now

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said Thursday that authorities have found objects in the Indian Ocean that could possibly be related to the search for missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, Australian media reported.


Sadly I think this is it?


tdgeek
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  #1010026 20-Mar-2014 16:50
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networkn:
tdgeek: CNN alert just now

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said Thursday that authorities have found objects in the Indian Ocean that could possibly be related to the search for missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, Australian media reported.


Sadly I think this is it?



We are probably all tempted to say, nah, another false alarm, then it will but correct. But it does sound like it will be. If so they can backtrack wind and current and hopefully it will all match in and give closure to the families

mattwnz
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  #1010027 20-Mar-2014 16:54
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tdgeek:
networkn:
tdgeek: CNN alert just now

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said Thursday that authorities have found objects in the Indian Ocean that could possibly be related to the search for missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, Australian media reported.


Sadly I think this is it?



We are probably all tempted to say, nah, another false alarm, then it will but correct. But it does sound like it will be. If so they can backtrack wind and current and hopefully it will all match in and give closure to the families


Hope it is it. Won't probably find out until tomorrow if the plane won't get there until 2.15 AEDT. Hope they haven't sunk in the meantime, or don't turn out to be like the chinese sat photo of objects they saw.

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