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  # 1006282 15-Mar-2014 17:13
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Technofreak:
tdgeek:
I agree, it must be elsewhere, and if so, and if no comms, seems to indicate a planned intervention, hijacking or pilot suicide


I don't agree that it indicates planned intervention.

EDIT: Perhaps I should explain further.

If it was hijacking then there has to be a motive, either terrorism, blackmail/ransom demand, or theft.  

For terrorism to be the case there has to be someone claiming responsibility otherwise there is no point, there is no terror created.

For blackmail/ransom or theft to be that case the aircraft needs to have landed safely somewhere which also means a high level of very discrete co-ordination between a lot of people and a suitable discrete runway.  I see this as being highly unlikely.

If it was suicide why would the perpetrator fly on for another 4 to 5 hours before crashing the aircraft?


What about the Pan Am Flight 103. Noone has been proven to be responsible for that, but a lot of different organisation claimed responsibility. Also we don't know that noone hasn't actually claimed responsibility, it maybe all being kept quiet.  So I don't buy that.

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  # 1006286 15-Mar-2014 17:16
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turnin: 
1/Planes can have their engines running when not flying, we see this when they taxi along a runway and potentially after a crash  
2/ Possibly even in the water if the engines didn't ingress water, 4hrs might be a stretch but perhaps on land this is possible, 
3/
4+5 'suitable' gets stretched in instances like these I'm guessing an adrenalin filled pilot will land a burning plane, if it was buring, where ever he can , we don't know the pilots intentions, some media ( australia channel 7) have suggested the pilot was less than reputable. God knows if their is any truth in it, probably not.


I'm sorry but your suggestions don't stack up.  

Have you seen where the engines are on the 777?  Do you really think they wouldn't ingest water in a ditching?

If the plane was burning I can assure you that the only place they would be landing would be the water.  The survival time in an aircraft that is on fire is frightenlingy short, certainly no time to fly any distance.

Yes, suitable can get stretched.  As I said a night landing without runway lights at a proper airfield on a dark night (which this was) is extremely difficult and risky and almost certainly would not be accomplished anywhere else without activating the ELBA (emergency beacon).




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  # 1006287 15-Mar-2014 17:17
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joker97: Malaysian govt is not hammered for inconsistencies

It is being ridiculed because everyone has something different to say expec except for its prime minister who is missing in action


And as I speak another random blogg has conclusively concluded a hijacking as taken place




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  # 1006291 15-Mar-2014 17:24
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mattwnz:

What about the Pan Am Flight 103. Noone has been proven to be responsible for that, but a lot of different organisation claimed responsibility. Also we don't know that noone hasn't actually claimed responsibility, it maybe all being kept quiet.  So I don't buy that.


With PANAM 103 they had a wreckage so it was obvious there had been foul play. The terroism link was easy to conclude

Yes it could be be kept quiet but with today's technology it would be pretty well impossible for the perpetrators not to get their message out




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  # 1006293 15-Mar-2014 17:30
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Technofreak:
turnin: 
1/Planes can have their engines running when not flying, we see this when they taxi along a runway and potentially after a crash  
2/ Possibly even in the water if the engines didn't ingress water, 4hrs might be a stretch but perhaps on land this is possible, 
3/
4+5 'suitable' gets stretched in instances like these I'm guessing an adrenalin filled pilot will land a burning plane, if it was buring, where ever he can , we don't know the pilots intentions, some media ( australia channel 7) have suggested the pilot was less than reputable. God knows if their is any truth in it, probably not.


I'm sorry but your suggestions don't stack up.  

Have you seen where the engines are on the 777?  Do you really think they wouldn't ingest water in a ditching?

If the plane was burning I can assure you that the only place they would be landing would be the water.  The survival time in an aircraft that is on fire is frightenlingy short, certainly no time to fly any distance.

Yes, suitable can get stretched.  As I said a night landing without runway lights at a proper airfield on a dark night (which this was) is extremely difficult and risky and almost certainly would not be accomplished anywhere else without activating the ELBA (emergency beacon).


Landing on land could be a better option than the ocean in some cases.
I'm not making any assumptions, predictions, assertions or suggestions, to do so would be naive, as I've said several times now there is much that we don't know. simply I have linked to various reports such as the non siesmic event in the ocean very close to the 1.07 am position and a chinese university that monitored the sensors. I've also linked to a contradictory report from the US that suggests another route, I also linked to cell coverage in that area. The only 'suggestion' I made was that it might be possible for an engine to run for 4 hours after an event. If you disagree that's fine but no one to my knowledge knows if, where or how the thing landed. If you have more information by all means share it.  

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  # 1006295 15-Mar-2014 17:32
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Landing on land in the middle of nowhere in the middle of the night?




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  # 1006296 15-Mar-2014 17:38
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joker97: Landing on land in the middle of nowhere in the middle of the night?


depends who you believe, if you go with the theory it flew on for 4 hours that would be around 5.30 -6 AM in KL timezone
if you go with the observation of a burning plane from the oil rig and the non-seismic event then it sounds unlikely

 
 
 
 


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  # 1006297 15-Mar-2014 17:42
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Not if it flew west it will be dark




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  # 1006333 15-Mar-2014 18:27
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Technofreak:
mattwnz:

What about the Pan Am Flight 103. Noone has been proven to be responsible for that, but a lot of different organisation claimed responsibility. Also we don't know that noone hasn't actually claimed responsibility, it maybe all being kept quiet.  So I don't buy that.


With PANAM 103 they had a wreckage so it was obvious there had been foul play. The terroism link was easy to conclude

Yes it could be be kept quiet but with today's technology it would be pretty well impossible for the perpetrators not to get their message out


Well from the news, it says it is very likely it has been hijacked.

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  # 1006336 15-Mar-2014 18:33
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mattwnz:
Technofreak:
mattwnz:

What about the Pan Am Flight 103. Noone has been proven to be responsible for that, but a lot of different organisation claimed responsibility. Also we don't know that noone hasn't actually claimed responsibility, it maybe all being kept quiet.  So I don't buy that.


With PANAM 103 they had a wreckage so it was obvious there had been foul play. The terroism link was easy to conclude

Yes it could be be kept quiet but with today's technology it would be pretty well impossible for the perpetrators not to get their message out


Well from the news, it says it is very likely it has been hijacked.


Yes, this CNN article is quite compelling

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/03/14/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-plane/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

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  # 1006343 15-Mar-2014 18:45
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The Malaysian government has now done a complete about face and stated that there is "incontrovertible evidence" that the plane has been hijacked.
(TV1 News)




Sideface


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  # 1006371 15-Mar-2014 19:17
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Sideface: The Malaysian government has now done a complete about face and stated that there is "incontrovertible evidence" that the plane has been hijacked.
(TV1 News)

 

I think they need to put the US in charge of this now, I have far more faith in what the US are saying about this.

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  # 1006372 15-Mar-2014 19:35
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Sideface: The Malaysian government has now done a complete about face and stated that there is "incontrovertible evidence" that the plane has been hijacked.
(TV1 News)


Actually this is just media speculation.  There is a live conference going on right now, and they have mentioned that they are still investigating and have to consider many things, but no announcement as to cause just yet.

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  # 1006378 15-Mar-2014 19:42
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as far as I can remember the Malaysian government has ever said two things - "everything everybody else in malaysia has said is not true", and "we don't know everything"




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  # 1006379 15-Mar-2014 19:43
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macuser:
Sideface: The Malaysian government has now done a complete about face and stated that there is "incontrovertible evidence" that the plane has been hijacked.
(TV1 News)


Actually this is just media speculation.  There is a live conference going on right now, and they have mentioned that they are still investigating and have to consider many things, but no announcement as to cause just yet.


Well it is probably going to be impossible to 100% prove, until they find the wreakage, as it is impossible to know what actually went on in the plane. But the investigators have ruled out mechanical failure and pilot error, which doesn't leave much else.

With technology the way it is now, you would think that airlines would now start to put in full 24 hour video and audio surveillance onboard, that was always being broadcast back to the airline,  that was impossible to disable by the pilots.  The whole 'blackbox' thing is pretty archaic. 

The thing about this case, is that it has highlighted something that no one, not even pilots knew before. And that is that the aircraft is always 'pinging' it's location to satellites, even if everything is disabled. Really crude technology, but it has been invaluable in this mystery.

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