Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9
16507 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4606

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1981890 23-Mar-2018 10:37
Send private message quote this post

itxtme:

 

MikeB4 the suggestion on the ground in Kapiti is that it did make money, but they are short of staff for those types of planes, and can use them on routes that are more lucrative like WLG to CHC.

 

@networkn - where your opinion differs from mine is that you hold no weight on the fact of who owns majority share and the fact they may have an opinion on these moves. Equally you hold no weight on the concept that a national carrier may have some responsibilities larger than just printing money for record profit after record profit.

 

 

 

 

I hold SOME weight on both of those things. The difference is how much, and also the fact that the Government as a major shareholder has prescribed ways it can approach these things, instead of letting Shane Jones carry on like a complete fool saying inflammatory things, with no way to back them up. 

 

Calling for the Chair's head is the height of stupidity, but it's the trademark of a NZF policitian. The chances are that Shane Jones has very little knowledge as to the real reasons behind these changes. 

 

If AirNZ came out and said it was going to cost 50M a year to support these regions and if the board accepted the Governments proposal, the dividend for ALL shareholders would cut by a specific amount ongoing, is it going to get shareholder approval?

 

 

 

I have no issue with the Government objecting to the changes and even asserting it's rights as a major share holder (or actually even as a minority), however I have a major issue with how it was done, how ineffective it was but how it caused people to get all emotional about it, when it's a logic problem. 

 

They need to raise their concerns through the correct channels, but then in my view if this was done every time, NZF wouldn't have a reason to exist. 

 

 

 

 

 

 


16507 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4606

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1981892 23-Mar-2018 10:38
Send private message quote this post

elpenguino:

 

if that's a shot at me you'll have to note I didn't comment on the financial merits of pulling the service one way or the other .

 

 

It wasn't a shot at anyone (well slightly at people like Shane Jones and Mayors of affected areas) , it was a general comment made about emotional vs logical arguments. If you feel that applies to you, then ok, but if not, don't worry about it :) 

 

 


 
 
 
 


Try Wrike: fast, easy, and efficient project collaboration software
549 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 205


  Reply # 1981896 23-Mar-2018 10:41
Send private message quote this post

networkn:

 

elpenguino:

 

if that's a shot at me you'll have to note I didn't comment on the financial merits of pulling the service one way or the other .

 

 

It wasn't a shot at anyone (well slightly at people like Shane Jones and Mayors of affected areas) , it was a general comment made about emotional vs logical arguments. If you feel that applies to you, then ok, but if not, don't worry about it :) 

 

 

 

 

Ah , your quoting led me to that conclusion.

 

Belay the handbag !!


2777 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 669


  Reply # 1981898 23-Mar-2018 10:45
Send private message quote this post

MikeB4: If those routes were making a profit I am certain the AirNZ management would keep hold of them, there is no logic in handing profit to competitors.



There’s been claims by some that the Kapiti route is profitable; it’s potentially more an issue that Air NZ believes it can extract more of a profit from diverting those resources to another route.


227 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 89


  Reply # 1981909 23-Mar-2018 10:55
Send private message quote this post

jonathan18:
MikeB4: If those routes were making a profit I am certain the AirNZ management would keep hold of them, there is no logic in handing profit to competitors.


There’s been claims by some that the Kapiti route is profitable; it’s potentially more an issue that Air NZ believes it can extract more of a profit from diverting those resources to another route.

 

 

 

Surely that's good business... We see banks do it with their branch locations too...

 

 

 

It astounds me the uproar that people seem to think that domestic/low volume routes should be subsidised - and then they remark about how they can fly to Australia for less... They then fail to consider the overheads of small aircraft vs large on a per-seat basis, and even the fuel burn of a flight (say) from Auckland to Wellington. A large portion of fuel is used getting that aircraft to its cruise altitude and then they power back for x minutes until they descend... You'll find the per km fuel burn rate much higher on the smaller routes...

 

 

 

The options here for them are:

 

  • Ensure all routes are profitable and maximise profit by focussing on the best performing routes
  • Subsidise the poorer routes with the dearer ones (and will a punter flying to Australia really accept - hey you're paying $50 so we can fly a 30 seater (or whatever) into Kerikeri)
  • Make all the routes cheaper and make less/no profit (and then not pay dividends to the investors of which Government is one) and later on ask for a bailout from Government
  •  

I wonder if the dividends returned to the Government so far has actually been enough to cover the cost of the bailout in the first place.


16507 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4606

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1981958 23-Mar-2018 11:08
Send private message quote this post

DaveDog

 

I wonder if the dividends returned to the Government so far has actually been enough to cover the cost of the bailout in the first place.

 

 

I don't believe so, but they still have their "asset" so it's not really a big problem. 

 

Their asset has increased hugely in value. 

 

 




6811 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3191

Subscriber

  Reply # 1981959 23-Mar-2018 11:08
Send private message quote this post

I have heard from multiple sources that Air NZ overcharges on domestic routes where it can get away with it to subsidise International ones. I don't know if this is true but a lot of people seem to believe it is. 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


16507 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4606

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1981960 23-Mar-2018 11:09
Send private message quote this post

Rikkitic:

 

I have heard from multiple sources that Air NZ overcharges on domestic routes where it can get away with it to subsidise International ones. I don't know if this is true but a lot of people seem to believe it is. 

 

 

 

 

Conjecture. I'd like to see some facts to support that.

 

 


227 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 89


  Reply # 1981963 23-Mar-2018 11:13
Send private message quote this post

networkn:

 

DaveDog

 

I wonder if the dividends returned to the Government so far has actually been enough to cover the cost of the bailout in the first place.

 

 

I don't believe so, but they still have their "asset" so it's not really a big problem. 

 

Their asset has increased hugely in value. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So the asset has increased in value which is probably a good thing. It's safe to say, that if the airline was not returning a profit (which some people seem to think it shouldn't) then that asset would not be worth what it is.


16507 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4606

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1981971 23-Mar-2018 11:23
Send private message quote this post

 

So the asset has increased in value which is probably a good thing. It's safe to say, that if the airline was not returning a profit (which some people seem to think it shouldn't) then that asset would not be worth what it is.

 

 

Well logically this is true, however, some companies (tech usually) end up with massive values despite never returning a profit. Netflix Et al. 

 

Having said that, in this case it's probably true. 

 

If it failed to make a profit for 1-2 years and there was a good reason, then the company value wouldn't likely contract much, but without a good reason, it would take a hiding. 

 

 

 

 


1733 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 97


  Reply # 1981989 23-Mar-2018 11:47
Send private message quote this post

All this chatter about regional fares reminds me when I was on the other side, ground at wellington.

 

Some punter would arrive late for his $69 grabaseat Wellington to Auckland

 

First you break the news that it was a use it or lose it (That was fun!)

 

Then they tell you "Well get me on the next flight"

 

"Sure that will be $469 as there are only standard fares left "

 

You know that look people give you when they want to rip your heart out and stomp on it?





Is an English Man living in New Zealand. Not a writer, an Observer he says. Graham is a seasoned 'traveler" with his sometimes arrogant, but honest opinion on life. He loves the Internet!.

 

gnfb on trademe travelkit.nz

GNFB Geeks Out on Geekzone

Email Me


227 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 89


  Reply # 1982006 23-Mar-2018 11:54
2 people support this post
Send private message quote this post

gnfb:

 

All this chatter about regional fares reminds me when I was on the other side, ground at wellington.

 

Some punter would arrive late for his $69 grabaseat Wellington to Auckland

 

First you break the news that it was a use it or lose it (That was fun!)

 

Then they tell you "Well get me on the next flight"

 

"Sure that will be $469 as there are only standard fares left "

 

You know that look people give you when they want to rip your heart out and stomp on it?

 

 

 

 

Maybe this is off topic - but maybe I'm just plain abnormal in my belief that if you buy a ticket that leaves at time Y and you need to have checked by time X then that's it ... It isn't X+5 or X+10 ... I would expect to receive that very treatment should I not be there on time.




6811 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3191

Subscriber

  Reply # 1982348 23-Mar-2018 20:35
Send private message quote this post
1671 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 640

Subscriber

  Reply # 1982353 23-Mar-2018 20:44
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

Oh for God's sake. "Force the airline"?

It's a business, that's owned by its shareholders. It's not a plaything to be directed by idiot mayors.

11891 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5518

Trusted

  Reply # 1982355 23-Mar-2018 20:48
Send private message quote this post

Rikkitic:

 

https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018637516/air-nz-has-lost-the-identity-as-nz-s-national-carrier

 

 

 

 

 

 

RNZ will reach the level of Stuff soon. Shall we call Jetstar our national carrier then or Sounds Air that will impress the tourists.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

Amazon launches the International Shopping Experience in the Amazon Shopping App
Posted 19-Apr-2018 08:38


Spark New Zealand and TVNZ to bring coverage of Rugby World Cup 2019
Posted 16-Apr-2018 06:55


How Google can seize Microsoft Office crown
Posted 14-Apr-2018 11:08


How back office transformation drives IRD efficiency
Posted 12-Apr-2018 21:15


iPod laws in a smartphone world: will we ever get copyright right?
Posted 12-Apr-2018 21:13


Lightbox service using big data and analytics to learn more about customers
Posted 9-Apr-2018 12:11


111 mobile caller location extended to iOS
Posted 6-Apr-2018 13:50


Huawei announces the HUAWEI P20 series
Posted 29-Mar-2018 11:41


Symantec Internet Security Threat Report shows increased endpoint technology risks
Posted 26-Mar-2018 18:29


Spark switches on long-range IoT network across New Zealand
Posted 26-Mar-2018 18:22


Stuff Pix enters streaming video market
Posted 21-Mar-2018 09:18


Windows no longer Microsoft’s main focus
Posted 13-Mar-2018 07:47


Why phone makers are obsessed with cameras
Posted 11-Mar-2018 12:25


New Zealand Adopts International Open Data Charter
Posted 3-Mar-2018 12:48


Shipments tumble as NZ phone upgrades slow
Posted 2-Mar-2018 11:48



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.