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  #2447795 27-Mar-2020 11:11
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It's something worth considering and having an unselfish realistic look at it. Look at the Venice example with the waterways clearing. There is a large environmental cost attached to tourism and travel that maybe the planet cannot afford.





Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

Be it ever so humble, there is no place like home.


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  #2447866 27-Mar-2020 11:56
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MikeB4: Look at the Venice example with the waterways clearing. There is a large environmental cost attached to tourism and travel that maybe the planet cannot afford.

 

 

 

 

I was using that example yesterday and someone said that it's more sediment related than anything with Venice...no paddles/props stirring up the sediment = clear waterways. 

 

Apparently not all pollution related (but undoubtedly there are benefits to the lack of pollutants, too). 





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Handsome Dan is currently WFH.

 

Handsome Dan is perplexed...and a little stir crazy.


 
 
 
 




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  #2447894 27-Mar-2020 12:33
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I forgot to mention cruise ships as something on the nice to have not necessary list.  


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  #2447904 27-Mar-2020 12:38
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I think it will be interesting to see how many businesses, that have got people working from home successfully, suddenly go, why are we leasing this massive building?


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  #2447957 27-Mar-2020 13:23
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amiga500:

 

I forgot to mention cruise ships as something on the nice to have not necessary list.  

 

 

If we are paring down to essential living, I think you might be shocked at how little you'll be buying going forward. The list of essentials for life are vey small :)

 

 


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  #2447966 27-Mar-2020 13:28
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Isolation notes, Day 2. The crazies have landed :P




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  #2448051 27-Mar-2020 14:21
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networkn:

 

amiga500:

 

I forgot to mention cruise ships as something on the nice to have not necessary list.  

 

 

If we are paring down to essential living, I think you might be shocked at how little you'll be buying going forward. The list of essentials for life are vey small :)

 

 

 

 

I only mentioned cruise ships as they seem to have worked extremely well as petri dishes.  What I am really saying is that the World seems unable to develop vaccines quickly enough to stop a pandemic so we need to protect ourselves in other ways.   What is about to happen in places such as Gaza, Yemen, Syria, and other places with extreme poverty or civil wars, is going to be absolutely horrendous.   And mainly because air travel has become so affordable & available.


 
 
 
 


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  #2448086 27-Mar-2020 14:45
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amiga500:

 

 

 

I only mentioned cruise ships as they seem to have worked extremely well as petri dishes.  What I am really saying is that the World seems unable to develop vaccines quickly enough to stop a pandemic so we need to protect ourselves in other ways.   What is about to happen in places such as Gaza, Yemen, Syria, and other places with extreme poverty or civil wars, is going to be absolutely horrendous.   And mainly because air travel has become so affordable & available.

 

 

Covid is a VERY small part of a set of illnesses that roam the world people killing people every year, though people kill almost as many people each year as illness does. Illness is a part of life as is death.

 

I am not saying this isn't bad, but if I was going to make huge sweeping changes to the world right now, addressing the number of people killing other people would seem to be something to concentrate on.


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  #2448088 27-Mar-2020 14:45
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amiga500:

 

I only mentioned cruise ships as they seem to have worked extremely well as petri dishes.  What I am really saying is that the World seems unable to develop vaccines quickly enough to stop a pandemic so we need to protect ourselves in other ways.   What is about to happen in places such as Gaza, Yemen, Syria, and other places with extreme poverty or civil wars, is going to be absolutely horrendous.   And mainly because air travel has become so affordable & available.

 

 

We will always have extreme poverty and civil wars etc.  To shutdown all international travel (air or otherwise) to prevent pandemic spread is not a long-term solution that will stick.  Skype and all other forms of communication does not let me cuddle the grandkids in Australia or experience a tropical holiday during the NZ winter.





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  #2448116 27-Mar-2020 15:21
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Kiwi's don't fly and save the planet.
Conferences by web, justly as we are from home now.




:)


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  #2448121 27-Mar-2020 15:29
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Option B accelerated human mass extinction. More or less a forgone event.
The planet will keep spinning and continue to evolve.




:)


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  #2448159 27-Mar-2020 16:09
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Things have needed to be change for a long time. All the pollution from air travel was unsustainable as it was, and it has been predicted that a pandemic like this was around the corner. We are lucky that this does not have the death rate of small pox, or even ebola, which kills a lot more. 


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  #2448198 27-Mar-2020 16:51
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Something that has interested me is people who have sued the reduction in environmental impact associated with lockdown to point out that it proves we could easily have a greener society.  These people seem to ignore the massive economic harm that results from the reduction in activity and consumption.  people have lost jobs, govts are spending money they don't have to keep people and companies afloat.  Business is terribly hard in an essential business,  I shudder to think how bad it is if you had to close.

 

To get back on topic ... can we afford not to have tourism (which conferences are subset of).  It's massive part of the world economy and aircraft carrying tourists are also important for air freight of perishable good.

 

Now cruise ships .. those floating petri dishes should all be torpedoed.  The way some of the cruise ship operators have conducted themselves, is appalling.





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  #2448202 27-Mar-2020 16:54
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Hopefully this post will come back to haunt me, & serve as a reminder to STFU when my thoughts are outside the given norm. But...

 

I think it's naive to compare this pandemic with previous events & expect similar outcomes. Covid-19 is a lot nastier than the statistics show & a lot nastier than anything we've seen before. It's worse than Ebola or any of the hemorrhagic fevers, worse than the Spanish & Hong Kong flu's - there's no obvious way to fight it on a global scale.

 

Check the mortality rate in USA - 60%, Denmark - 94%, Brazil - 92% or Netherlands where out of 437 resolved cases, 434 are dead & only 3 survived. The overall world mortality rate has been steadily climbing - probably correcting itself after low-ball Chinese numbers set the initial baseline. From the original 3-4%, it's now 16%. With the devastation that's occurring USA & is going to get a lot worse very quickly, that overall mortality rate is going to shoot up & really make people aware of the danger we're in.

 

Don't expect the USA to exist in its current form & don't expect USA to be able to afford to act as the world's policeman. Don't expect $US to be the standard for currency any more - the strength of fiat currency is based on belief that the issuer can pay out the sum promised on their money, I don't see any hope whatsoever that the faith will be justifiable for that to continue.

 

There's every likelihood that large tracts of earth are left stateless, with no functioning government in existence. If the frightening current mortality rates in Europe & America continue, & the contagion continues unabated, there may not be enough population to hold such structures together.

 

NZ is in a very fortunate position with no land borders & significant ocean distances from other populations. We have the chance to beat this thing, although we didn't take our first & best opportunity. Who wouldn't, given a time-machine, shut the borders a month earlier than we did? Although we have the chance to get away from Covid-19 with relatively minimal damage, most of the world does not. USA is simply f****ed - every consideration goes against them, from environment to infrastructure.

 

So don't necessarily expect to hop on a big old jet airliner, smile as you turn left upon entry & enjoy a few glasses of champagne on your way to LAX & on to the rest of the world from there. It may be a long, long time before travel like that is possible again.





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  #2448221 27-Mar-2020 16:59
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mattwnz:

 

Things have needed to be change for a long time. All the pollution from air travel was unsustainable as it was, and it has been predicted that a pandemic like this was around the corner. We are lucky that this does not have the death rate of small pox, or even ebola, which kills a lot more. 

 

 

Here's some current mortality figures:

 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/netherlands/

 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/brazil/

 

Ebola kills between 25 & 50% of those infected. Infection however, is a lot more difficult than Covid-19

 

 





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