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Fred99
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  #2579430 5-Oct-2020 09:48
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The "official" reports on Trump's condition / prognosis are horse sh*t - it doesn't add up.

 

If he's sick enough to warrant use of steroids (dexamethasone) now, then that's fast - he's probably at about day 6 from infection, only a few days from developing symptoms (which were either severe enough to warrant oxygen - or they just put him on oxygen anyway).  

 

If he is going to get really unwell then that's probably not going to happen for days.

 

 


Batman
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  #2579437 5-Oct-2020 10:10
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Sideface:

 

The New York Times - What to Know About Sean Conley, the White House Physician

 

 

 


*  Doctors of osteopathic medicine, or D.O.s, are fully licensed physicians, according to the American Osteopathic Association.
Their training is similar to that of traditional medical doctors but differs in that they are trained to look at the body and its care holistically rather than just prescribing medicine for specific symptoms or illnesses.

 

 

this is how it probably works

 

Trump - cough cough - Sean, am i ok?

 

Sean - yeah just um ... take some ginger juice, i could give your spine a crack and you'll be right

 

WH- umm i think you need to get tested Sir

 

Trump - no i'm not - slumps into chair and can't breathe - give my the hydroxy or the bleach - which one is better?

 

WH - Sean, please call the Pulmonologist

 

Sean - ok. What's a Pumnolog - ok ok ... 

 

Pulmonologist - he got covid. his oxygen is low, please don't give hydroxy or bleach - i will get him some regeneron antibodies and remdesivir antivirals

 

Trump - Sean, what are those things? 

 

Sean - no idea. 

 

Pulmonologist - you need to go to hospital. 

 

Trump - Sean tell them i don't need to go to hospital, passes out from exhaustion

 

In hospital - Trump - I want Sean to talk to the media. Sean, make sure you tell them I'm in perfect health.

 

Sean - mixes up the timelines.

 

Trump - Sean, fix the timeline.

 

Antibodies antivirals antiinflammatories all work and Trump goes back to WH.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


 
 
 
 


Batman
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  #2579438 5-Oct-2020 10:11
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Fred99:

 

The "official" reports on Trump's condition / prognosis are horse sh*t - it doesn't add up.

 

If he's sick enough to warrant use of steroids (dexamethasone) now, then that's fast - he's probably at about day 6 from infection, only a few days from developing symptoms (which were either severe enough to warrant oxygen - or they just put him on oxygen anyway).  

 

If he is going to get really unwell then that's probably not going to happen for days.

 

 

 

 

He's going to be fine, he's got all the best treatments that Americans can't get.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


Fred99
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  #2579444 5-Oct-2020 10:27
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Batman:

 

He's going to be fine, he's got all the best treatments that Americans can't get.

 

 

Yet - unless the Regeneron antibody treatment is a "miracle treatment", there's no other treatment stated that he's been given that's not available to all (insured) Americans, and none of them have shown more than marginal benefit.   If Regeneron is a silver bullet, then as the US public paid for 80% of the development cost, the suggested US$60,000 cost to the US public for one shot seems a bit rich. 

 

 

Under a deal struck with Regeneron Pharmaceuticals, the federal Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority agreed to pay 80 percent of the costs of developing and manufacturing coronavirus treatments — without any requirement that the final products be affordable. Regeneron has the two highest-paid executives in the pharmaceutical industry.

 

(Source)


Sideface
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  #2579449 5-Oct-2020 10:39
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freitasm:

 

"Osteopathic medicine".

 

Nope. " Osteopaths in New Zealand are not fully licensed physicians." (Wikipedia). 

 

In the USA is very different. ...

 

 


Agreed.

 

Quite apart from the traditional rivalry between DOs and MDs and their very different approaches to medicine ...

 

a DO (Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine) degree is easier/faster to obtain than an MD (Doctor of Medicine) degree.

 

In the USA, basic MD training requires 7 years (including premed), and DO training requires 4 years.

 

[To declare my bias, I am a retired "MD", and trained in Australia for 8 years.]

 

 

 

 

 

 





Sideface


freitasm
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  #2579451 5-Oct-2020 10:43
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Sideface:

 

freitasm:

 

"Osteopathic medicine".

 

Nope. " Osteopaths in New Zealand are not fully licensed physicians." (Wikipedia). 

 

In the USA is very different. ...

 

 


Agreed.

 

Quite apart from the traditional rivalry between DOs and MDs and their very different approaches to medicine ...

 

A DO (Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine) degree is easier/faster to obtain than an MD (Doctor of Medicine) degree.

 

In the USA, basic MD training requires 7 years (including premed), and DO training requires 4 years.

 

[To declare my bias, I am a retired "MD", and trained in Australia for 8 years.]

 

 

I would add that having a DO instead of MD in the White House tells a lot about the mindset of these people.





 

 

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GV27
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  #2579453 5-Oct-2020 10:52
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Be honest, how many of you haven't ducked out of a hospital after being diagnosed with a contagious disease during a global pandemic to rip a few skids in the hospital carpark and show off to the nurses at shift change-over?


 
 
 
 


Fred99
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  #2579454 5-Oct-2020 10:56
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freitasm:

 

I would add that having a DO instead of MD in the White House tells a lot about the mindset of these people.

 

 

Theodor Morell was a real doctor.


Batman
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  #2579459 5-Oct-2020 11:08
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freitasm:

 

I would add that having a DO instead of MD in the White House tells a lot about the mindset of these people.

 

 

True story. I once met a professor of history who was dying of cancer. The professor, upon diagnosis of early stage of cancer, was referred to cancer doctor and surgeon who said that there was a very high chance of cure with surgery.

 

Professor declined the therapy and chose to be treated by a naturopath who offered equal or better chances with their treatment.

 

On the deathbed the professor did not seem troubled. I did not ask if they had another chance would they choose modern treatment or stick with alternative treatment.

 

If a doctor forgets something they face the Health Disability Commissioner over a period of a few years and get absolutely trashed by their lawyers to the point of suicidal. If a naturopath lies about curing cancer - nothing happens, they just carry on with their services and offer the same thing to others over and over again.

 

A question I like to ask people - when they want to fly to Australia if they prefer a modern pilot or alternative pilot?





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


Rikkitic
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  #2579460 5-Oct-2020 11:09
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nathan:

Mainstream media, both CNN and Fox, lie to us. There’s a reason the “fake news” name sticks to the MSM. Both take a fact and fit that fact to fit in their narrative. News is entertainment for them

I watched CNN for a few mins last night, they said the WH is lying to the public about Trumps health, but made no mention of other times WH has reported on a sick President status, and made no mention of the times a President willingly invoked 25th Amendment, while they were under anesthesia

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

I usually don't bother replying to you but I feel obligated to point out here that you are full of crap. Most of what you spout is just unsubstantiated opinion, and some of it is just pure nonsense, like this gem:

 

'Pro-birth has a purpose

US society demands fresh uneducated meat from flyover states, to feed into the forever perpetual endless wars that the corporate defense businesses shareholders demand'

 

Apart from that, I watch CNN a lot (as well as other sources) and while reporting on Trump's health, they repeatedly cited other times the White House had reported on the status of an ill president, as well as the attempts to hide Eisenhower's heart attack, and also the transference of presidential authority to VP Cheney when Bush underwent a colonoscopy and when Reagan underwent surgery.

 

Maybe you should have watched CNN for more than a few minutes. You might have learned something.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


Batman
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  #2579461 5-Oct-2020 11:14
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Rikkitic:

 

nathan:

Mainstream media, both CNN and Fox, lie to us. There’s a reason the “fake news” name sticks to the MSM. Both take a fact and fit that fact to fit in their narrative. News is entertainment for them

I watched CNN for a few mins last night, they said the WH is lying to the public about Trumps health, but made no mention of other times WH has reported on a sick President status, and made no mention of the times a President willingly invoked 25th Amendment, while they were under anesthesia

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

I usually don't bother replying to you but I feel obligated to point out here that you are full of crap. Most of what you spout is just unsubstantiated opinion, and some of it is just pure nonsense, like this gem:

 

'Pro-birth has a purpose

US society demands fresh uneducated meat from flyover states, to feed into the forever perpetual endless wars that the corporate defense businesses shareholders demand'

 

Apart from that, I watch CNN a lot (as well as other sources) and while reporting on Trump's health, they repeatedly cited other times the White House had reported on the status of an ill president, as well as the attempts to hide Eisenhower's heart attack, and also the transference of presidential authority to VP Cheney when Bush underwent a colonoscopy and when Reagan underwent surgery.

 

Maybe you should have watched CNN for more than a few minutes. You might have learned something.

 

 

To be fair, I've watched a lot of 'news' in the last few months. I've learnt over time that every 'news' whenever politics is involved, is very biased to one party. So you can say they are all "lying" to us. But I think that's what politics does to people. I do not even bring up politics with my in laws as they start shouting!

 

In America however, everything is politicised. So one can say that practically everybody is "lying" all the time! But I know how to separate facts from emotion (?CNN) and propaganda (?Fox).





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


Rikkitic
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  #2579464 5-Oct-2020 11:26
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There is no question CNN has a leftward bias and an extreme dislike of Trump. I am not questioning that and they are not the only news source I follow. 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


Batman
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  #2579465 5-Oct-2020 11:34
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Fred99:

 

Yet - unless the Regeneron antibody treatment is a "miracle treatment", there's no other treatment stated that he's been given that's not available to all (insured) Americans, and none of them have shown more than marginal benefit.   If Regeneron is a silver bullet, then as the US public paid for 80% of the development cost, the suggested US$60,000 cost to the US public for one shot seems a bit rich. 

 

 

Under a deal struck with Regeneron Pharmaceuticals, the federal Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority agreed to pay 80 percent of the costs of developing and manufacturing coronavirus treatments — without any requirement that the final products be affordable. Regeneron has the two highest-paid executives in the pharmaceutical industry.

 

(Source)

 

 

insurance eh ... tried making a claim on your house damaged by the Chch earthquake? i have. 

 

insured doesn't mean you get top treatment. Probably can't even get a test until you're half dead.

 

Trump gets 24hr one on one care by the top doctors and nurses. It's not something an average insured American gets.

 

It's the antibodies as well as the 24hr care package from instant access to the test right up to the hourly checks by top doctors round the clock.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


Gurezaemon
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  #2579467 5-Oct-2020 11:37
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Batman:

 

On the deathbed the professor did not seem troubled. I did not ask if they had another chance would they choose modern treatment or stick with alternative treatment.

 

A question I like to ask people - when they want to fly to Australia if they prefer a modern pilot or alternative pilot?

 

 

Sadly reminiscent of Steve Jobs' situation. 

 

This reminds me of
Q: What do you call alternative medicine that been proven to work?

 

A: Medicine.





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freitasm
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  #2579470 5-Oct-2020 11:40
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"‘This is insanity’: Doctors aghast at Trump’s ‘surprise’ SUV tour"

 

 

Trump made a surprise visit to supporters outside Walter Reed National Military Medical Center in Bethesda, Md., late Sunday afternoon, waving from inside a vehicle that drove by the crowd.

 

Footage on CNN showed the president, wearing a face mask and seated in the back of a black SUV, waving to supporters as the motorcade passed by the crowd.

 

Medical professionals reacted with horror Sunday to President Trump’s decision to leave the hospital in an SUV for an impromptu tour, calling the move irresponsible and saying others in the car are risking their lives for “political theater.”

 

The president could be seen wearing a mask as he waved to a crowd from the back of the vehicle, after announcing that he would “pay a little surprise to some of the great patriots that we have out on the street.” But experts said that was little comfort.

 

“Every single person in the vehicle during that completely unnecessary Presidential ‘drive-by’ just now has to be quarantined for 14 days,” tweeted James P. Phillips, a doctor affiliated with Walter Reed National Military Medical Center, where Trump is receiving treatment. “They might get sick. They may die. For political theater. Commanded by Trump to put their lives at risk for theater. This is insanity.”

 

Phillips said that the risk of viral transmission inside the car is “as high as it gets outside of medical procedures.”

 

Jonathan Reiner, a professor of medicine and surgery at George Washington University, also blasted Trump’s move as “the height of irresponsibility.” Reiner noted that people inside a hospital wear extensive protective gear — gowns, gloves, N95 masks and more — when they will be in close contact with a coronavirus patient such as Trump.

 

“By taking a joy ride outside Walter Reed the president is placing his Secret Service detail at grave risk,” he tweeted.

 





 

 

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