Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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Forums › Politics › Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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#1670148 13-Nov-2016 16:49

Fred99:

joker97:

Fred99:

joker97:

At the end of the day, the American people have spoken. They don't want to be ruled by the elites.

How many times in this thread does that crop up. It is wrong.

If the American people didn't want to be ruled by elites, then they wouldn't have elected a billionaire who flies over them in a gold-plated 757.

They elected Trump because he played to their fears. Xenophobic and ignorant, but that's what happened.

I didn't say the Americans got it right. Just that the result makes sense if you analyse the components.

No it doesn't. It actually doesn't make sense at all. What does make sense and what they voted for was a convenient excuse and euphemistic "establishment" that was representing the interests of those you don't like, fear, and resent.

Americans love the elites. FFS - they don't have native royalty, so spend the last 1/2 century creating royalty out of Kennedys and Clintons, Kardashians - and now, unfortunately, Trumps.

The Trump royal family are sitting around the throne, appointed by King Donald I of America to official duties.

It's an incredibly surreal spectacle. But it is real.

Is (common) sense defined by a textbook you get from a library or does it need cultural context?

tdgeek

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#1670149 13-Nov-2016 16:50

networkn:
tdgeek:
Rikkitic:

networkn:

I recall but can't find video, of footage of Obama after his first such security briefing and how worried and ashen he looked. I also recall hearing GWB vomited after or during his. Not sure where I heard that, but I can believe it.

That must have been when they were told about the alien mothership in Jupiter's orbit.

Oh dear. No. The incursions at threatened incursions or plots that exist are far more than what gets reported. Which is quite understandable given the size of the US and the terrorist threat, and the secrecy needed.

I must say I don't envy the people who keep those secrets. I envy even less the person who gets told how close the world comes to ending every few days, for the first time.

I agree. The public reads the news. Stuff happens . Hit in the real world which we don't see it's like a James Bond movie. Scarey

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#1670150 13-Nov-2016 16:53

joker97:
networkn:

joker97:

Jimmyshergal:

Most of the comment says Hilary Clinton will win, most of the statistics said Hilarry Clinton will win.

But, finally she lost. I still don't get that. How come Mr. Donald Trump won the presidency after all this.

Can anybody explain this o me? All I see is that, no matter who they support the crowd said Hilary Clinton will win.

Umm ... most people said AB would beat Ireland of all people. Right? Wrong.

One of the many Reasons (no I'm not expert but I do know a thing or two about stats and sampling)

You hire people to do a poll. Who will they pick to poll? People with iphones? People with Linknd accounts? People who are tech savvy? Or the farmers in rural America? The Western Baptist who don't do social media/use technology? The people who aren't listed on the white pages because they're too poor, the unseen, the invisible in society? Each of those have one vote. Same number of vote as a lawyer or Bill Gates. One.

I hate to break it to you, 1/2 of America voted for Trump. 1 in every 2 people.

People didn't want to be honest when polled, they felt publically voting for Trump would cause them grief with their friends. Little did they know their friends voted for him as well. I know a few minority women in the USA who voted for him :) They didn't care what he said about them I get the feeling.

I despise Trump as a heinous specimen of the human race. But he won it. As I had dreadfully knew possible when you pit Hillary against him Trump. But it is what it is now. I'm not going to fly to the US to participate in protests. At best everything goes on like clockwork and he is a puppet figure. At worst his dynasty become the antichrist. Anything is possible.

Back to your statement. Indeed less than 1/2 voted for Trump I thought. Hillary won the popularity vote didn't she. In fact about 20% voted for him (the turnout was what 40+%?).

When the ABs win 8-7 they win the RWC. Nobody cares that France was one yard away (missed a penalty by a few yards) from taking the RWC.

As Bernie said, "what good is it now"? I did say they should step Hillary down and put Bernie there but they were too arrogant and believed in the CNN polls.

I think the turnout was 55%. She won the popular vote but it was close.

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#1670153 13-Nov-2016 16:59

Rikkitic:
networkn:

Rikkitic:

I wonder if Americans will enjoy their three times more expensive half as reliable poor fuel economy made in USA death traps?

When was the last time you actually DROVE an American car?

Many, many, many years ago. Around the time, in fact, when America still made good cars, some of them, at least. But I have a friend who is an Americaphile and he regularly goes over there and brings back a container of cars that he drives for awhile then sells when he tires of them to pay for his trips. It is a good way of life. He gets months in the USA and then makes a profit on it. The cars he brings back are popular. Invariably, they also clatter and clank, leak oil and airco coolant, have horns that don't work, and so on. A measure of car quality is how well they hold up after a few years. Compared to any Japanese car, any American car I have seen since about 1965 is a rolling scrap heap. They still have sex appeal for some reason, but quality? Nah.

Classic cars yes . Today's cars fall well short.

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#1670159 13-Nov-2016 17:13

joker97:
tdgeek:
joker97:

Rikkitic:

How can anyone with even the IQ of a grass-eating goat possibly think that a billionaire who doesn't pay taxes is not part of the elite?

Now you are questioning the IQ of an American? Or saying the result shouldn't stand?

Maybe you are the grass eating goat ? About the comment I would expect TBH

It's ok to question the IQ of the average American. It's pretty obvious what the answer is. But it's not ok to repeatedly moan at the result. The man won it. Or rather they gave it to him.

I agree except you cannot argue about their IQ. If your downtrodden you react. They did just that

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#1670160 13-Nov-2016 17:15

tdgeek:
Fred99:

No it doesn't. It actually doesn't make sense at all. What does make sense and what they voted for was a convenient excuse and euphemistic "establishment" that was representing the interests of those you don't like, fear, and resent.
Americans love the elites. FFS - they don't have native royalty, so spend the last 1/2 century creating royalty out of Kennedys and Clintons, Kardashians - and now, unfortunately, Trumps.

The Trump royal family are sitting around the throne, appointed by King Donald I of America to official duties.

It's an incredibly surreal spectacle. But it is real.

I disagree. The demographic that went for him can't manage the status quo. They went with him instead

I don't think you're giving the Trump voters enough credit for being able to work things out, that Trump was "the elite" choice.

They're clearly happy with that part of the status quo - having the rich rule. What they don't like are blacks and women in power, hispanics, latino, muslims. That's what they want Trump to deliver on as a path to "Make America Great Again.

By the way, the provisional figure on voter turnout was 57%. Trump and Clinton got about 26% each support from the voter age population. Do you think one in four US citizens might be happy with a racist, misogynist, xenophobic president? I do, but it's much higher than that in Alabama.

Democracy has probably just set the USA back 50 years.

Rikkitic

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#1670163 13-Nov-2016 17:21

Here is an intriguing speculation: I was just watching an item on Paddy Power's losses and it suddenly occurred to me that maybe some of the pollsters actually did get it right, but didn't believe their result and were afraid of looking foolish so they massaged the numbers to produce the 'right' answer.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

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#1670164 13-Nov-2016 17:23

joker97:

Is (common) sense defined by a textbook you get from a library or does it need cultural context?

No / neither. The choice (to vote for Trump) was clearly not logical if you didn't want to be "ruled by elites".

Batman

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#1670173 13-Nov-2016 17:42

Fred99:

joker97:

Is (common) sense defined by a textbook you get from a library or does it need cultural context?

No / neither. The choice (to vote for Trump) was clearly not logical if you didn't want to be "ruled by elites".

You ask the Americans! There's something deeper than that. Since the horror which I knew was possible right from day 1, happened, I've been trying to get my head around why the Clintons are hated so much. Still haven't gotten to the truth, but mentions of all sorts of heinous unprintable atrocities etc etc etc, still digging (no I don't spend that much time on this just trying to make sense of this, from an average American's point of view). Not that I care too much, I don't dwell on things that cannot be changed. But the fact that nobody heeded the warning bells and remove Hillary when Trump was all over her, well, it's their fault.

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#1670190 13-Nov-2016 18:06

@networkn:

I hate to break it to you, 1/2 of America voted for Trump. 1 in every 2 people.

I hate to break it to you, but 1/2 of the people eligible to vote didn't, so you're wrong. It's actually 1/4 of America voted for Trump, 1 in every 4 people.

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#1670209 13-Nov-2016 18:33

freitasm:
@networkn:

I hate to break it to you, 1/2 of America voted for Trump. 1 in every 2 people.

I hate to break it to you, but 1/2 of the people eligible to vote didn't, so you're wrong. It's actually 1/4 of America voted for Trump, 1 in every 4 people.

There is a lesson here, vote vote vote or you can end deep in the sticky stuff

Batman

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#1670213 13-Nov-2016 18:52

Or Mike will buy a new car. What car did you buy?

networkn

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#1670215 13-Nov-2016 18:58

freitasm:

@networkn:

I hate to break it to you, 1/2 of America voted for Trump. 1 in every 2 people.

I hate to break it to you, but 1/2 of the people eligible to vote didn't, so you're wrong. It's actually 1/4 of America voted for Trump, 1 in every 4 people.

The people who don't vote, they don't count. If you don't vote, you get whatever the others voted for and you stay nice and quiet about it, since you opted to not have an opinion.

I have little or no patience with people who don't vote, who then complain.

So I stand by my comment that half of Americans voted for Trump.

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#1670235 13-Nov-2016 19:06

What about those who were disenfranchised by the new voting restriction laws, or were intimidated by the goons supposedly there (on questionable authority) to monitor for voter 'irregularities'?

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

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#1670251 13-Nov-2016 19:50

Rikkitic:

What about those who were disenfranchised by the new voting restriction laws, or were intimidated by the goons supposedly there (on questionable authority) to monitor for voter 'irregularities'?

Or the ones that couldn't get time off work to vote on the work day because Republicans don't want elections on the weekend, the 1/3 of black males excluded from voting under 13th amendment.

It's a kind of "pretend democracy" in the US. NZ is much better since MMP. Despite flaws and complaints - look how stable it's been compared to much of the rest of the developed world over the past 20 years.

Lesson to NZ on what not to do when we become a Republic - don't hobble democracy in the future by writing a constitution which is so fixed, then as language, customs, and technology shift around it, you're forever locked in a past century. (ToW is bad enough).

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