Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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Forums › Politics › Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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#1696617 30-Dec-2016 21:51

JimsonWeed:

As far as lies are concerned.. we all lie.. full stop.

I don't - prove me wrong.

People who didn't like John Key tried for 8 years to pin him with lying - that failed.

I could fill a page with Trump lies. Too bad you can't see it (or choose not to).

blakamin

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#1696619 30-Dec-2016 21:55

Fred99:

I could fill a page with Trump lies.

Only one???? Try 59,000,000 Trump lies

Fred99

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#1696620 30-Dec-2016 21:59

networkn:

Fred99:

JimsonWeed:

freitasm: You insult me by insinuating I read either Fox or Huffington Post. They're both terrible rags.

No, no... I was asking you not to reference them in the off-chance that you did read them. You're right... they represent both ends of the spectrum. :)

They're actually far from the "ends of the spectrum".

The present American delusion seems to be based on some concept that "balance" can be achieved by averaging propaganda.

Trump has been telling huge lies. Half-way "compromise" between a lie and the truth still isn't the truth. That's not a "left vs right" thing, verifiable truth isn't in itself partisan.

Then you get to the other side of Trump - apart from the filthy lies - he's a racist, misogynistic, petulant pig.

How many more pages of this thread can you fill saying the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over?! I think it's a well accepted fact (and I am happy to speak on behalf of EVERYONE in the thread) that you don't like him. We get it! Honestly.

It's their country, their right to vote in whomever they wish and it's them primarily that have to deal with the consequences.

You keep applying *your* logic to the argument which clearly doesn't apply to them because of their history and culture and no amount of going on and on about it, will change that. America wanted a change and he is a change no matter what you say.

I'll keep replying so long as Trump "apologists" keep appearing.

Even the "it'll be alright" attitude underestimates the danger posed by Trump.

As well as a NZer, I'm a citizen on Planet Earth.

Fellow citizens sat back while Hitler ascended a couple of generations ago. It was a near thing that fascism didn't become a "legitimate" movement throughout the western world.

(note - Godwin's is permitted in this thread - as it's appropriate)

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#1696622 30-Dec-2016 22:17

Running Hillary Clinton was seriously one of the stupidest moves ever.

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#1696629 30-Dec-2016 22:39

darylblake: Running Hillary Clinton was seriously one of the stupidest moves ever.

This.

Don't blame Trump for winning.

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#1696634 30-Dec-2016 22:53

JimsonWeed: in that context, without expanding to include the Communist Manifesto and/or the Protocols of the Elders of Zion... Yes, they are on the extreme ends of the spectrum from one another. So, in the context as described, comparing only these two organisations with one another in relation to conservatism and liberalism... Yes, they are the extreme of the spectrum.

Wait a minute. These are very different things. the Communist Manifesto was an actual book by Marx and Engles, while the Protocols of the Elders of Zion was a hoax, propaganda material created to fuel anti-semitism. You know that, right?

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dejadeadnz

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#1696637 30-Dec-2016 23:19

America's Democracy Has Become Illiberal

I am not always a fan of Zakaria but he's right in this instance.

JimsonWeed

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#1696672 31-Dec-2016 01:51

freitasm:

JimsonWeed: in that context, without expanding to include the Communist Manifesto and/or the Protocols of the Elders of Zion... Yes, they are on the extreme ends of the spectrum from one another. So, in the context as described, comparing only these two organisations with one another in relation to conservatism and liberalism... Yes, they are the extreme of the spectrum.

Wait a minute. These are very different things. the Communist Manifesto was an actual book by Marx and Engles, while the Protocols of the Elders of Zion was a hoax, propaganda material created to fuel anti-semitism. You know that, right?

What do you mean when you say it was a hoax? The book exists but, as far as the logic and reasoning that went in behind it... I couldn't tell you. I just know that hoax or not, there are plenty of turkeys that believe in the ideology it espouses.

NOTE: I edited this post after researching the book a bit... and to your point, yes, I am well familiar with the origin and how it came into being. Regardless of all that... as a hack, a forgery, a rip-off, or the wandering scribbling of a madman, there is indeed a book called, The Protocols of .... etc., etc. And yes, I'm quite confident the Jews did not write such rubbish as their "master plan" :) It's ludicrous to even think that. So yeah... I think we both agree on that point.

Anyhow... the purpose for the reference was this; that book and the Communist Manifesto are on opposite ends of the spectrum from one another. So, I was using them as examples of what to include in the discussion when comparing Fox and Huffington. That's all that was.

JimsonWeed

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#1696673 31-Dec-2016 01:59

Fred99:

JimsonWeed:

As far as lies are concerned.. we all lie.. full stop.

I don't - prove me wrong.

People who didn't like John Key tried for 8 years to pin him with lying - that failed.

I could fill a page with Trump lies. Too bad you can't see it (or choose not to).

Yes... we all lie :) There is no need to "prove you wrong".

Actually... I would just ~love~ to see some of the pages and references everyone keeps going on about... Please, cite your sources but, if it's hear-say drivel from some media outlet, keep it. It's useless.

I'm sure Trump lies... again.. we all lie.

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#1696674 31-Dec-2016 02:56

Jarle Dahl Bergersen | Referral Links: Want $50 off when you join Octopus Energy? Use this referral code
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#1696706 31-Dec-2016 08:32

JimsonWeed:

I will agree it probably favours corporations but, we live and breath by their success also. I completely agree with his idea of reducing corporate taxes to stimulate growth. It is economically sound and serves to stimulate investment and the need for resource utilisation. With regard to minimum wage increases... I don't think people really understand that it is a short-lived solution. Ultimately, the cost is spread to the rest of the population through the ripple effect. You pay higher wages, you raise you prices.

We don't live and breathe by corporate success; if Sony-Time-Warner or Disney disappeared without trace, no-one is going to die. The trickle-down effect has been well and truly debunked... giving tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy does not improve the lot of anyone but the wealthy.

Fundamentally, when a rich person gets richer, the wealth is removed from the economy. They save the money, or buy assets & toys (land, superyachts, yachts, cars) with no return to the economy. When a poor person gets richer, they spend it and the economy improves. If, instead of buying a superyacht, Graham Hart had spent his $700M in NZ, or it had been distributed amongst the NZ population via tax cuts and wage increases, we would all (except Graham Hart) be better off.

Actually, what we should be looking for is more leisure time... that's an economic benefit that could be given to the middle classes that would create jobs.

Fred99

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#1696709 31-Dec-2016 08:46

JimsonWeed:

Fred99:

JimsonWeed:

As far as lies are concerned.. we all lie.. full stop.

I don't - prove me wrong.

People who didn't like John Key tried for 8 years to pin him with lying - that failed.

I could fill a page with Trump lies. Too bad you can't see it (or choose not to).

Yes... we all lie :) There is no need to "prove you wrong".

Actually... I would just ~love~ to see some of the pages and references everyone keeps going on about... Please, cite your sources but, if it's hear-say drivel from some media outlet, keep it. It's useless.

I'm sure Trump lies... again.. we all lie.

@blakamin gave you an easy link on the previous page:

https://www.google.com/search?q=trump+lies

Take your pick - amongst the millions of results there are some partisan sites for sure, plenty of neutral sites, few "alt:right" sites though.

Please don't accuse me of lying again. Speak for yourself - don't include me in your "royal we".

I assume you're talking about "manners" etc and "white lies" - where for example if Trump asked me "how are you" I'd probably reply "very well thank you" even though I felt like puking.

White lies are by definition harmless and trivial. Trump's lies are malicious and serious.

Fred99

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#1696715 31-Dec-2016 08:57

Thought I'd post this, seeing as "Liberal" has become a dirty word / insult being thrown around (liberally ha!) by the ~25% of American voters who elected Trump:

Hey kids- lets play a game - what's the opposite of "liberal"?

Oh that's easy - it's "narrow minded, bigoted, conservative, and reactionary".

Thank goodness the libtards didn't win!

Fred99

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#1696716 31-Dec-2016 09:06

The bromance deepens:

freitasm

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#1696747 31-Dec-2016 11:27

JimsonWeed:

freitasm:

Apparently Democrats reduced unemployment, made healthcare more accessible to the poorest and middle-class and improved minimum wage. Exactly what Republicans don't want.

With all due respect, can you cite your sources? [Snip]

If you have sources other than the Huffington Post or Fox News, by all means, share it.

Unemployment rate in the USA is now lower than when Obama started - 50% lower actually. If you look at the charts you will see who was in charge when unemployment went up. Go on, make your own charts here (US Bureau of Statistics).

Uninsured population is now the lowest in eight years, according to Gallup. You can play with numbers from KFF.org here.

So, once again (thanks for your replies on Fox and Huffington), don't ever accuse me of reading those rags. Or the local rags.

JimsonWeed:

Actually... I would just ~love~ to see some of the pages and references everyone keeps going on about... Please, cite your sources but, if it's hear-say drivel from some media outlet, keep it. It's useless.

I'm sure Trump lies... again.. we all lie.

Ah, the Dr House School of Dislike of Others.

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