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Master Geek


  # 1759257 7-Apr-2017 20:42
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Can syria strike those warships that sent the  missiles?  they just sitting there in the middle of the ocean, or does russia need to provide the missles to do it.


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  # 1759275 7-Apr-2017 21:58
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cruxis:

 

Can syria strike those warships that sent the  missiles?  they just sitting there in the middle of the ocean, or does russia need to provide the missles to do it.

 

 

 

 

Pretty sure those warships are not 'just sitting there' without some fairly significant defences of their own...!






 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek


  # 1759287 7-Apr-2017 23:05
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tdgeek:

 

Furthermore, you dont like someone disagreeing

 

So you fight back as you dont want discussion.

 

As in a bully. Ironic dont you think?

 

I have stated my opinion, which in terms of volume is very very minor in this 200+ pages. 

 

 

Mate - multiple specific issues have been raised throughout this thread post inauguration re his actions, executive orders, proposed budget, key cabinet appointments, nepotism, his temperament and ignorance re foreign policy and what this means as a risk to global security, possible links to foreign governments etc etc.

 

And yes while many of these are covered by executive orders which still have to work through the process to come into effect - this does does not make them inconsequential.

 

Furthermore much of what he has done like his many dubious appointments - in the WH, State Department and now the Supreme Court - are in effect now and all point to a very different future direction for the USA - and this worries many people across the globe - myself included.

 

Yet so many times when someone has raised an issue or concern in this thread - your response is effectively "he's been blocked - not gonna happen - he doesn't matter"

 

But is just ain't that simple.

 

This prick has the power to seriously mess the world up and his actions and intentions matter a huge deal - and that is why we continue to talk about him.

 

I really hope you can see that it goes well beyond dissing and I know for myself it is about genuine concern for ALL of us.

 

One or 2 road blocks is not going to stop this man - and 4 years is a really long time for him and his cronies to do some real damage on a global scale.

 

 

 

PS: This BBC summary is a good wrap up of some of the significant issues posed by his Executive Orders - several of which have been raised in this thread.

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38695593 

 

 

 

 


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  # 1759298 7-Apr-2017 23:46
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driller2000:

 

tdgeek:

 

Furthermore, you dont like someone disagreeing

 

So you fight back as you dont want discussion.

 

As in a bully. Ironic dont you think?

 

I have stated my opinion, which in terms of volume is very very minor in this 200+ pages. 

 

 

Mate - multiple specific issues have been raised throughout this thread post inauguration re his actions, executive orders, proposed budget, key cabinet appointments, nepotism, his temperament and ignorance re foreign policy and what this means as a risk to global security, possible links to foreign governments etc etc.

 

And yes while many of these are covered by executive orders which still have to work through the process to come into effect - this does does not make them inconsequential.

 

Furthermore much of what he has done like his many dubious appointments - in the WH, State Department and now the Supreme Court - are in effect now and all point to a very different future direction for the USA - and this worries many people across the globe - myself included.

 

Yet so many times when someone has raised an issue or concern in this thread - your response is effectively "he's been blocked - not gonna happen - he doesn't matter"

 

But is just ain't that simple.

 

This prick has the power to seriously mess the world up and his actions and intentions matter a huge deal - and that is why we continue to talk about him.

 

I really hope you can see that it goes well beyond dissing and I know for myself it is about genuine concern for ALL of us.

 

One or 2 road blocks is not going to stop this man - and 4 years is a really long time for him and his cronies to do some real damage on a global scale.

 

 

 

PS: This BBC summary is a good wrap up of some of the significant issues posed by his Executive Orders - several of which have been raised in this thread.

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38695593

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wrong.

 

How any times have I stated my opinion???  Compared to the number of posts that are just dissing him, very very few. Or is it a problem that I have an opinion??? Clearly it is.

 

So its therefore not a discussion if someone disagrees with the world is ending scenario. Thats bullying, which others have also mentioned here. And ironic given the subject matter of the thread title.

 

 

 

Whats the problem if I and others have stated that he is a buffoon who isn't doing anything of note, and that he has become harmless?  I would expect others to post responses why in their opinion that not the case, but what happens here is not that, its the "no, no, you cannot say that" etc. Dictatorial.

 

Given the last 11 weeks, my opinion is not an out there statement. 

 

Im quite aware of the orders he has signed. Some of these would have been signed by another GOP POTUS. And Ive been on this thread all the way through, while some topics have been discussed, its generally cursory, and ultimately ends up about Trumps faults. I know his faults, Id rather discuss the issues, and not read his faults on most posts. 

 

He does have the power to mess things up, no one will disagree with that. So far, he cant get key stupid policies past his own party and/or the judiciary. So far at least, his power has been severely muted. If he had any brains he would tone down his stupid policies, market them, then get them through as he did in winning the election, fortunately he can't even do that. So, right now, that is why my opinion is as it is. Helped by his poor choices of his close at hand advisors, and so on.

 

 

 

While we cannot expect him to enact laws in short order, your right, its only been a short while, IMHO there has been a lot of proof that he struggles to get anything done. He has succeeded in making himself the laughing stock of the world. 

 

The bottom line is, will he turn the world upside down or not? I dunno. So far, he doesnt appear to have what it takes to do that, thanks to his party and the legal system

 

However, back to the topic at hand, I read these posts every day, and my post that you responded to still stands IMO, the trend is heavily about dissing, and less about content. Ive noticed many people have gone from here. A few new ones pop in. But it is actually quite bare of poster volume. 

 

I'll just leave it at that. But tks for the time you spent responding. Cheers

 

 


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  # 1759301 8-Apr-2017 00:19
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Geektastic:

 

cruxis:

 

Can syria strike those warships that sent the  missiles?  they just sitting there in the middle of the ocean, or does russia need to provide the missles to do it.

 

 

 

 

Pretty sure those warships are not 'just sitting there' without some fairly significant defences of their own...!

 

 

Haha, exactly.

 

I read that big brother Putin is not happy. 

 

WWIII? Remotely possible, depending on how Putin feels.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


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  # 1759303 8-Apr-2017 00:31
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tdgeek:

 

Fred99:

 

Benoire:

 

Neither are the breitbarters, the comments are quite toxic about Trump!

 

 

Guessing (as there's no way to know) that the removal of Steve Bannon from the security council a couple of days ago could be more than coincidence.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I cant see that. Bannon vs Syria? Bannon is an idiot, Syria is serious.

 

However, there are a few queries. 

 

Did Trump put this forward as an option to strike or was it the US military leaders?

 

If a strike happened Jan 21, 22, 23, that would be a huge concern. Given the potential Trump "do before think". But the recent acts could be seen as a good reason to strike back, OR a good reason for him to get some brownie points from the US populous and the globe. Two extremely different reasons. Regime change here is a real option as compared to WMD/Oil theories in Iraq. 

 

So, does this thread see this strike as warranted or not?

 

Me, I think yes. But I can see another "we will finish it quickly" turning into many years. Its a mess. Ironically, the innocent citizens make it a mess. They need to be protected, and that is the problem. Pity we cannot ship them out. Strip the country then ship them back in. Maybe that silly idea is actually a good idea.

 

 

Bannon is many things - but "idiot" is not one of them.

 

Of course he's been sidelined and would have been opposed to the attack on Syria.  Don't know if he would have been sidelined because of his opposition, or if that doubt about him came before.  He'd obviously had disagreement with Kushner, who is incidentally jewish (and with past liberal leanings), and is Trump's "golden boy" of the moment.

 

Bannon certainly wants war, but global war, and not the war Trump may have started, which IMO is the possible beginning of unknown future proxy-wars between the USA and Russia.  Just like the good old days.

 

Russia / Putin is really seriously p!ssed.  On one side, Putin has some valid arguments about the legality of the US action, some cynicism about Trump's motive.  On the other, he's an evil SOB clearly supporting Assad, this at a cost to world stability, IIRC almost 700,000 casualties so far, many millions of refugees and displaced, and no sign of real long term solution. 

 

So, your question - "does this thread see this strike as warranted or not?".  

 

Not sure that "this thread" has a collective view.  Speaking for myself, I'm not sure if I see it as "warranted" or not.  I have a certain cynicism about chemical weapons - there's an obvious abhorrence to killing people like flies using techniques and chemicals similar to agricultural pesticide, thus enforcing a "no tolerance" policy seems like a good idea, but it needs to be consistent (IMO). The same level of outrage should be expressed when civilians are killed (and indeed targeted) using any form of military might.  I doubt if during your last moments of life after you and your family had been burned or shredded, you'd be thinking "this is okay - they used "legal" weapons - damned glad they didn't gas us".

 

"Get them out" of Syria - why sure. But it seems nobody wants "them".  Political careers and movements have appeared founded mainly on rejecting the plight of those victims, by creating fear that they're going to kill us.

 

Trump has used that (rejection of refugees) to stir up populist xenophobic support.  It'll be sad if he's launched military action as "morally justified" action against a relatively minor atrocity, but continues to not give a f*^% about the plight of innocent civilians


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  # 1759304 8-Apr-2017 00:35
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joker97:

 

Geektastic:

 

cruxis:

 

Can syria strike those warships that sent the  missiles?  they just sitting there in the middle of the ocean, or does russia need to provide the missles to do it.

 

 

 

 

Pretty sure those warships are not 'just sitting there' without some fairly significant defences of their own...!

 

 

Haha, exactly.

 

I read that big brother Putin is not happy. 

 

WWIII? Remotely possible, depending on how Putin feels.

 

 

No. Buts its a terrible situation. Its many civil wars in the one country, it isn't Side A vs Side B. Different groups fighting each other, some in certain regions fighting in that region. 

 

If they captured or killed Assad, what would change? Probably his followers will continue fighting. I cant see an end for decades, thats the Middle East way. Its inbred into the culture. Even if they tired of it, there are kids yet to be born who will live a life where fighting is the norm. Better to repatriate every citizen to another country, and leave just the fighters there. Probably logistically impossible, and a bad precedent. Then Russia and Iran move in. Sanctions? No, that hurts the people, and Russia and Iran will prop up the Govt. 

 

Humans are hopeless, they can do anything, go anywhere, land a device on comets, but can't get along.


 
 
 
 


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  # 1759305 8-Apr-2017 00:47
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Fred99:

 

So, your question - "does this thread see this strike as warranted or not?".  

 

Not sure that "this thread" has a collective view.  Speaking for myself, I'm not sure if I see it as "warranted" or not.  I have a certain cynicism about chemical weapons - there's an obvious abhorrence to killing people like flies using techniques and chemicals similar to agricultural pesticide, thus enforcing a "no tolerance" policy seems like a good idea, but it needs to be consistent (IMO). The same level of outrage should be expressed when civilians are killed (and indeed targeted) using any form of military might.  I doubt if during your last moments of life after you and your family had been burned or shredded, you'd be thinking "this is okay - they used "legal" weapons - damned glad they didn't gas us".

 

"Get them out" of Syria - why sure. But it seems nobody wants "them".  Political careers and movements have appeared founded mainly on rejecting the plight of those victims, by creating fear that they're going to kill us.

 

Trump has used that (rejection of refugees) to stir up populist xenophobic support.  It'll be sad if he's launched military action as "morally justified" action against a relatively minor atrocity, but continues to not give a f*^% about the plight of innocent civilians

 

 

Its certainly a tough one. Syria wise I feel its justified, I dont see it as a Trump issue. Obama drew a line in the sand on chemical warfare, although he never acted on it. But, whats the benefit? None. Its a mess there, that doesn't change. I cant see an end for a long long time, and if that was the case, you could argue to pull out as you cannot really make any headway. I feel regime change is no point. New leader, same issues. Te world agrees it is justified, except off course the Russians, Iranians and default Chinese response.

 

But given that the US and 60 countries are there fighting ISIS, and this was just against another foe, and apparently was to be a one off, its really just an atrocity responded to against an arch enemy, but it will get more press than that. 


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  # 1759346 8-Apr-2017 09:13
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FWIW, satellite images of the airfield, showing targets hit.

 

 

more here.


Lock him up!
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  # 1759359 8-Apr-2017 09:25
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This thread, like many others that deal with a controversial subject and attract many replies over a period of time, evolves with developments and the accumulated responses. It started out mainly as a shock! horror! reaction to the unexpected election of Trump and speculation about the consequences of that. It has dealt with Trump’s behaviour and actions as president, and some of the disturbing aspects of his personality. It has also made fun of him, an easy thing to do and probably a necessary response for those of us who are genuinely horrified by his character. It has also dealt with the murkier details of his election, particularly potential Russian involvement. As happens with such a lengthy thread, some people come and go. I see nothing unusual or illegitimate in any of this. The thread should and will continue as long as there are people who remain interested in it and continue to contribute. Whatever direction it takes is the direction it should take. That is the nature of the beast.

 

This thread is not just about dissing on Trump, or making fun of his foibles, or crying that the sky is going to fall. It is an ongoing discussion about Trump as president of the USA, and the effect that has on international developments. Some contributions will be serious, others less so. They all have a place. Let us continue.





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


gzt

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  # 1759366 8-Apr-2017 09:38
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tdgeek:

Trump did get Jeff Sessions confirmed as Attorney General. Head of the Justice Dept. A guy who could not get confirmed as a federal judge under the Reagan administration due to concerns about past racism.

That's an achievement.

Sessions has been very clear in his intent that the Justice Dept will be taking few if any civil rights prosecutions from now on. As Attorney General he has the power to decide that.


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  # 1759411 8-Apr-2017 10:58
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Fred99:

 

FWIW, satellite images of the airfield, showing targets hit.

 

 

more here.

 

 

 

 

Surprised that they did not also strike the runway surface to deny it's use.






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  # 1759418 8-Apr-2017 11:27
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Now, come on. They didn't want the thing to be taken seriously, surely? Economical impact only, warned the Russians hours before, etc, etc. Pretty much another one of those actions to misdirect attention, surely...





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  # 1759424 8-Apr-2017 11:44
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Geektastic:

Surprised that they did not also strike the runway surface to deny it's use.



Tomahawks aren't really the ideal weapon to do long term damage to a runway surface.



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  # 1759425 8-Apr-2017 11:48
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$2 million each * 59 missiles. That's a fair chunk of change.


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