Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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Forums › Politics › Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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Rikkitic

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#1765122 16-Apr-2017 19:52

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Geektastic:

joker97:

old3eyes:

Rikkitic:

North Korea has achieved the impossible. KJU actually makes the Donald look good by comparison. I wonder if his strategy is to eat the USA under the table. At the rate he is expanding, he will either be dead or unable to waddle by the end of the year.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/15/asia/north-korea-missile-test/index.html

Bet that some of the NK army people involved with this failed launch will be heading to the firing squad.

The default execution method seems to be using anti aircraft guns.

Expensive when a 30 cent .223 round would achieve the same outcome!

You could always volunteer to bash them over the head with a sledgehammer and then finish them off by eating their brains. That would also achieve the same outcome.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Batman

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#1765131 16-Apr-2017 20:17

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Eating brains is a potentially sign of honour, where the modern cannibal potentially acknowledges a superior mind, consuming it for self enhancement. I don't know if the Supreme Leader would show such respect for his enemies.

tdgeek

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#1765247 17-Apr-2017 10:07

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gzt:
tdgeek:

gzt: Part of a policy group announcement Friday:

NZHerald (AP Wire) But a U.S. military official, who requested anonymity to discuss planning, said the U.S. doesn't intend to use military force against North Korea in response to either a nuclear test or a missile launch. The official said plans could change in the unlikely event a North Korean missile targets South Korea, Japan or U.S. territory.

The timing of the policy announcement seems designed to reduce tension.

That has always been the policy, official or unofficial. The only thing that has changed is the old rant to get oil and food is fading. more pressure goes to PRNK. I can see PRNK acting bad, but silently hoping China brokers a deal. I'd hope that the US cuts off all trade with PRNK, and advises that while it will reduce the so called acts of aggression touted by KJU, the US will shoot any missiles that leave their waters or borders, and that it has no official intention to strike pre-emptively. Cards on the table.

Pres B.Clinton had a deal with NK for an exchange in exchange for halting nuclear development. It was working as designed, until Republican Party disruption effectively scuppered that outcome. After that, NK decided progress in nuclear and military development was the only way forward to guarantee security.

Imo USA should have officially ended the Korean war anywhere between 50 and 20 years ago. NK would not have pursued a nuclear path and it would be more like Vietnam or China today.

There is still time to restart that process. The current course of USA benefits absolutely no one.

Ive read a few articles on PRNK. Its a dictatorship, where if you dissent, you die. I see the rhetoric against the west as to scaremonger the people, that isn't going to change. They do a bad thing, we add sanctions, they say they want anymore, aid is given in terms of food and oil. Nothing changes. They do something, we send a ship in, they say its an act of war. Bottom line is you cannot negotiate a peaceful coexistence with them. Or in actuality, with the sole dictator. To remain in control, he needs absolute control.

The issue, would he attack? No. He cant attack as he will get attacked back, lose his position and/or lose face. For him to say that the US will pre emotively strike is him maintaining control over the people. The US won't strike, there is no need and no gain. If the tiger wont be nice, keep him in his cage, maybe one day the people will revolt, but with his iron hand, hard to see that. I favour increased sanctions. However that affects the people. Perhaps sanction everything possible, except food aid? Maybe SK allows free immigration to NK nationals?

Now, what happens if NK launches a missile and that gets shot down? That fine as he broke the rules so we shoot them down. If they got to Japanese airspace, thats technically an act of war, but lets be real and just shoot it down. But PRNK wills that we attacked their country. Thats the issue that means there is no means to negotiate on anything.

It could easily be, here is aid, be good, don't mess with us we wont mess with you, end of story. But he loses control as there is nothing to force the people to comply.

tdgeek

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#1765248 17-Apr-2017 10:14

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gzt:

There is still time to restart that process. The current course of USA benefits absolutely no one.

This course of the USA is supported by the western countries. And its no different to any other responses. Given the actions of PRNK, the US response is weak, intentionally so, just reminding them we are here. Its actually non confrontational, given what has caused these responses. PRNK is proactive, the west is reactive. Now if the US was doing nuclear tests for the stated purpose of the PRNK threat, and firing missiles across their airspace, and land (as PRNK has done to Japan in the past), then the world would go ape at the US. But thats exactly what PRNK does, repeatedly. You cannot deal with that, you can only muzzle it.

Geektastic

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#1765255 17-Apr-2017 10:46

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Rikkitic:

Geektastic:

joker97:

old3eyes:

Rikkitic:

North Korea has achieved the impossible. KJU actually makes the Donald look good by comparison. I wonder if his strategy is to eat the USA under the table. At the rate he is expanding, he will either be dead or unable to waddle by the end of the year.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/15/asia/north-korea-missile-test/index.html

Bet that some of the NK army people involved with this failed launch will be heading to the firing squad.

The default execution method seems to be using anti aircraft guns.

Expensive when a 30 cent .223 round would achieve the same outcome!

You could always volunteer to bash them over the head with a sledgehammer and then finish them off by eating their brains. That would also achieve the same outcome.

You could. Although a pistol shot to the head seems cheaper and less messy. I don't find brains go well with Chianti.

DarthKermit

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#1765258 17-Apr-2017 11:15

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I'd eat Trump's brain, but it would be the equivalent of that last anorexic M&M at the bottom of the bag.

gzt

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#1765341 17-Apr-2017 16:11

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tdgeek:
gzt:
tdgeek:

gzt: Part of a policy group announcement Friday:

NZHerald (AP Wire) But a U.S. military official, who requested anonymity to discuss planning, said the U.S. doesn't intend to use military force against North Korea in response to either a nuclear test or a missile launch. The official said plans could change in the unlikely event a North Korean missile targets South Korea, Japan or U.S. territory.

The timing of the policy announcement seems designed to reduce tension.

That has always been the policy, official or unofficial. The only thing that has changed is the old rant to get oil and food is fading. more pressure goes to PRNK. I can see PRNK acting bad, but silently hoping China brokers a deal. I'd hope that the US cuts off all trade with PRNK, and advises that while it will reduce the so called acts of aggression touted by KJU, the US will shoot any missiles that leave their waters or borders, and that it has no official intention to strike pre-emptively. Cards on the table.

Pres B.Clinton had a deal with NK for an exchange in exchange for halting nuclear development. It was working as designed, until Republican Party disruption effectively scuppered that outcome. After that, NK decided progress in nuclear and military development was the only way forward to guarantee security.

Imo USA should have officially ended the Korean war anywhere between 50 and 20 years ago. NK would not have pursued a nuclear path and it would be more like Vietnam or China today.

There is still time to restart that process. The current course of USA benefits absolutely no one.

Ive read a few articles on PRNK. Its a dictatorship, where if you dissent, you die. I see the rhetoric against the west as to scaremonger the people, that isn't going to change. They do a bad thing, we add sanctions, they say they want anymore, aid is given in terms of food and oil. Nothing changes. They do something, we send a ship in, they say its an act of war. Bottom line is you cannot negotiate a peaceful coexistence with them. Or in actuality, with the sole dictator. To remain in control, he needs absolute control.

The issue, would he attack? No. He cant attack as he will get attacked back, lose his position and/or lose face. For him to say that the US will pre emotively strike is him maintaining control over the people. The US won't strike, there is no need and no gain. If the tiger wont be nice, keep him in his cage, maybe one day the people will revolt, but with his iron hand, hard to see that. I favour increased sanctions. However that affects the people. Perhaps sanction everything possible, except food aid? Maybe SK allows free immigration to NK nationals?

Now, what happens if NK launches a missile and that gets shot down? That fine as he broke the rules so we shoot them down. If they got to Japanese airspace, thats technically an act of war, but lets be real and just shoot it down. But PRNK wills that we attacked their country. Thats the issue that means there is no means to negotiate on anything.

It could easily be, here is aid, be good, don't mess with us we wont mess with you, end of story. But he loses control as there is nothing to force the people to comply.

I believe SK already allows NK citizens. The USA does not diplomatically recognise the DPRK. There was an agreement for a ceasefire at the end of the Korean War and that is all. It is time the USA recognised NK, and made a diplomatic effort to provide the security guarantees the north seeks against invasion since the ceasefire of 1950 something.

Fred99

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#1765395 17-Apr-2017 19:02

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I think that while there's justified condemnation of KJU and the DPRK for pulling out of the NPT in particular, some of the hysteria is probably "fake news".
Israel, India, Pakistan are nuclear armed and never signed the NPT - still haven't.
Korea (peninsula) is the site of a past early cold-war era proxy war, with all three (USA/PRC/USSR) involved, never "won", it's still just an armistice.

It seems to me that when North or South have attempted discussion on unification, the debate is hijacked by the big three, PRC doesn't want a US-centric united Korea on it's border (neither does Russia probably). The US loves having a generally very pro-US Korea in the region, doesn't want that watered down. Russia doesn't like US hegemony - and wants to sell gas to Korea via a pipeline which currently would go through DPRK - who could do with the money, and given the anti-nuclear and anti-coal sentiment, could probably do with some Russian gas.

Meanwhile, DPRK is trying to make reliable solid-fuel intermediate range missiles, including submarine launched, as a "deterrent" to an expected attack - and that expected attack from the USA. They have their nuclear program, pulled out of the NPT in 2003. US president was... GWB.

The problem with Korea is for the main part perpetuated by the USA.

Trump - for all the BS argued here about him "doing nothing" - is a curse on planet earth. Also for the idiots arguing that the "brilliant US generals" will have the best plan. Curse their military plans, curse Trump's threats. The solution - if there ever will be one - is in diplomacy - something that the present POTUS has no comprehension about. He gives not the tiniest f$#$ about the people of Korea - North or South.

tdgeek

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#1766470 18-Apr-2017 06:52

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Fred99:

I think that while there's justified condemnation of KJU and the DPRK for pulling out of the NPT in particular, some of the hysteria is probably "fake news".
Israel, India, Pakistan are nuclear armed and never signed the NPT - still haven't.
Korea (peninsula) is the site of a past early cold-war era proxy war, with all three (USA/PRC/USSR) involved, never "won", it's still just an armistice.

It seems to me that when North or South have attempted discussion on unification, the debate is hijacked by the big three, PRC doesn't want a US-centric united Korea on it's border (neither does Russia probably). The US loves having a generally very pro-US Korea in the region, doesn't want that watered down. Russia doesn't like US hegemony - and wants to sell gas to Korea via a pipeline which currently would go through DPRK - who could do with the money, and given the anti-nuclear and anti-coal sentiment, could probably do with some Russian gas.

Meanwhile, DPRK is trying to make reliable solid-fuel intermediate range missiles, including submarine launched, as a "deterrent" to an expected attack - and that expected attack from the USA. They have their nuclear program, pulled out of the NPT in 2003. US president was... GWB.

The problem with Korea is for the main part perpetuated by the USA.

Trump - for all the BS argued here about him "doing nothing" - is a curse on planet earth. Also for the idiots arguing that the "brilliant US generals" will have the best plan. Curse their military plans, curse Trump's threats. The solution - if there ever will be one - is in diplomacy - something that the present POTUS has no comprehension about. He gives not the tiniest f$#$ about the people of Korea - North or South.

Diplomacy, PRNK????

The NK issue isn't a Trump issue, it was an issue long before him and will be long after him. He wont make a difference, good or bad. If he wasnt POTUS, the exact same scenario would not be the highlight it seems to be.

Fred99

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#1766473 18-Apr-2017 07:34

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I don't agree.

Trump is very much making it a Trump issue. The US is deliberately attempting to wind up KJU to provoke a reaction which will influence elections, overstating the threat from DPRK and need for the US to step up military presence.

tdgeek

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#1766480 18-Apr-2017 07:53

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Fred99:

I don't agree.

Trump is very much making it a Trump issue. The US is deliberately attempting to wind up KJU to provoke a reaction which will influence elections, overstating the threat from DPRK and need for the US to step up military presence.

Yet another planned nuclear test and yet another missile test is not provoking? All they do is provoke, to them get reduced sanctions and food and oil. While the west supports the US stance, and what is a very small response, so does China who is enforcing its own sanctions publiclly. As for overstating, PRNK can reach the US, so while they wont do anything except use that as a provocation, but the decades old response form PRNK is the US will attack at any time, which is rubbish. Its not ok for one to defend in a mild way, yet its ok for the other to maintain power and control by telling their citizens and the world that the US is all set to attack. They are just playing the US, SK, Japan, and the rest of the world off. Thats ok, there is no war threat from the west, so who cares? The west doesn't, so instead of being pro active to force a war, they go to the negotiating table and get reneged on, and ensure there is a local military presence just in case. Thats pretty mild. And it should leave the BAY PRNK madness to being another news item, been there done that so many times. But the Trump effect kicks in to make it new news, but its not

Fred99

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#1766504 18-Apr-2017 08:36

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China recognise that KJU is a particular problem/threat - because he's clearly unbalanced and threatening, and they don't like his nuclear ambitions one little bit. But they do not want the US THAAD system fully operational, and if there was to be regime change / toppling KJU in DPRK, they certainly do not want a US-centric occupation or unified Korea with foreign military presence on their border with DPRK.

China no doubt recognise that Trump is a dangerous idiot, a liar, unpredictable, and a blabber-mouth. Trump may claim that he has "cooperation" from PRC on the KJU issue, but he's mistaking good manners and diplomacy for "friendship".

Hypothetical / risk analysis, it's a situation where there's (hopefully very) low probability of "war", but a high probability that if there was war, it would be cataclysmic with long-term consequences for the region.

tdgeek

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#1766512 18-Apr-2017 08:54

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Fred99:

China recognise that KJU is a particular problem/threat - because he's clearly unbalanced and threatening, and they don't like his nuclear ambitions one little bit. But they do not want the US THAAD system fully operational, and if there was to be regime change / toppling KJU in DPRK, they certainly do not want a US-centric occupation or unified Korea with foreign military presence on their border with DPRK.

China no doubt recognise that Trump is a dangerous idiot, a liar, unpredictable, and a blabber-mouth. Trump may claim that he has "cooperation" from PRC on the KJU issue, but he's mistaking good manners and diplomacy for "friendship".

Hypothetical / risk analysis, it's a situation where there's (hopefully very) low probability of "war", but a high probability that if there was war, it would be cataclysmic with long-term consequences for the region.

The THAAD is an issue. That assumes that PRC has issues with the USA attacking China, which is pretty bizarre. If PRNK launches a missile, against the rules and agreements, then anyone has every right to shoot it down. THAAD is a defence mechanism. It would be very different if the US armed multiple missile sites in the region aimed at Pyongyang and advised that to the world. Given PRNK irrational behaviour, China needs to accept that a defense system is right and is that due to the PRNK.

Forget diplomacy, unless its ONLY between the west and China regarding PRNK. The latter has run out of points to deserve being part of a diplomatic resolvement. China has a lot of sway with NK, and you can talk to them, and they have shown they can act. But until missile tests stop, the anti missile system should be there

Fred99

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#1766633 18-Apr-2017 11:11

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THAAD won't protect South Korea from a missile barrage from DPRK. South Koreans realise that - and many don't want it because of the geopolitical and nuclear deterrent balance issues it creates. It just adds to an arms race.

Trump's USA is now rushing to get it operational - before there's a probable change from an interim conservative president to a liberal (based on current polling).

The USA are up to dirty tricks - as has become usual for a Republican led regime. Same old same old. Using and aggravating a situation with KJU and DPRK to further their own agenda.

tdgeek

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#1766687 18-Apr-2017 12:49

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Fred99:

THAAD won't protect South Korea from a missile barrage from DPRK. South Koreans realise that - and many don't want it because of the geopolitical and nuclear deterrent balance issues it creates. It just adds to an arms race.

Trump's USA is now rushing to get it operational - before there's a probable change from an interim conservative president to a liberal (based on current polling).

The USA are up to dirty tricks - as has become usual for a Republican led regime. Same old same old. Using and aggravating a situation with KJU and DPRK to further their own agenda.

Do you have any articles to support the first sentence? Re many who don't want them? And don't they work well? If there was a barrage of missiles, I think the defence strategy goes out the window, and in comes the attack strategy.

Its not Trumps USA getting it operational, it was announced by Obama, to be installed towards end 2017. Given whats going on by PRNK, no issue to see it pushed ahead.

And Democrats for bringing in THAAD. So all of USA is up to dirty tricks. Its not just Repubs or Demo's, or Trump, its national.

I would be happy if the US pulled out of every issue. NK, Syria, everywhere, no exceptions. And not lead anything offshore. Their contribution can be troops and machinery, let someone else organise it. Allow USA to focus on itself, and they can do what they like to beef up their defence, given that they will have removed themselves from decision making in global hotspots. Then we are back to the arms race.

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