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gzt

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  Reply # 1558558 24-May-2016 11:32
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vexxxboy:

gzt:
networkn:


gzt: Like Bush Jr? I think you are dead wrong. The president is not a prime minister that can be held to account to some extent by a cabinet, and to a greater extent by a parliament. The president has undivided executive power. There are some checks and balances but the presidential office has enormous executive power.


 


 


 


Nope. The president can't declare war without support, and can't pass legislation without Senate AND House passing it first. It's the exact reason Obama couldn't get anything done during his second term, the house blocked everything he proposed. 



Nope. President can start and to a large extent fight a war without authorisation from congress. Including invasion of other countries. Also helps a bit if it is not called 'war'. It has happened many times.

On legislation we can agree. That is why Obama and all presidents before him issue executive orders to achieve policy goals. EOs can be used to amend regulation and suspend or implement existing regulation. That sounds mild but these orders essentially issue directives to federal agencies. Ie; activate all emergency detention centres and immediately round up millions of undocumented immigrants would be a perfectly valid executive order.

The office of the president is immensely powerful militarily and in an everyday sense.

POTUS holds enormous sole power.


 


again not quite , he has those executive orders by an act of congress and if they are not constitutional they can be overturned  by the supreme court, So he is limited to what he can use them for.


Wrong. The power held by the executive is granted by the constitution, not congress.

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  Reply # 1558563 24-May-2016 11:40
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gzt:
vexxxboy:

 

gzt:
networkn:

 

 

 

gzt: Like Bush Jr? I think you are dead wrong. The president is not a prime minister that can be held to account to some extent by a cabinet, and to a greater extent by a parliament. The president has undivided executive power. There are some checks and balances but the presidential office has enormous executive power.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nope. The president can't declare war without support, and can't pass legislation without Senate AND House passing it first. It's the exact reason Obama couldn't get anything done during his second term, the house blocked everything he proposed. 

 

 

 


Nope. President can start and to a large extent fight a war without authorisation from congress. Including invasion of other countries. Also helps a bit if it is not called 'war'. It has happened many times.

On legislation we can agree. That is why Obama and all presidents before him issue executive orders to achieve policy goals. EOs can be used to amend regulation and suspend or implement existing regulation. That sounds mild but these orders essentially issue directives to federal agencies. Ie; activate all emergency detention centres and immediately round up millions of undocumented immigrants would be a perfectly valid executive order.

The office of the president is immensely powerful militarily and in an everyday sense.

POTUS holds enormous sole power.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

again not quite , he has those executive orders by an act of congress and if they are not constitutional they can be overturned  by the supreme court, So he is limited to what he can use them for.

 


Wrong. The power held by the executive is granted by the constitution, not congress.

 

 

 

The War Powers Resolution requires the President notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action and forbids armed forces from remaining for more than 60 days, with a further 30 day withdrawal period, without a Congressional authorization for use of military force or a declaration of war by the United States.

 

The President can veto such things as a declaration of war by Congress and other things.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


 
 
 
 




Talk DIrtY to me
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  Reply # 1558590 24-May-2016 12:36
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What I find amazing about the US system, is that someone with no political experience at all can in theory end up in the highest office in the land. All he needs is money and fame.

 

It would be like me (alas no fame, and not that much money) knocking our PM off of his perch and becoming the prime minister at our next general election.


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  Reply # 1558591 24-May-2016 12:37
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Trump knows no rules. I bet the first thing he'd set about doing is changing the constitution ... No idea how he'll convince the vote but he has his ways

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  Reply # 1558593 24-May-2016 12:42
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joker97: Trump knows no rules. I bet the first thing he'd set about doing is changing the constitution ... No idea how he'll convince the vote but he has his ways 

 

He approves of waterboarding  wink





Sideface


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  Reply # 1558599 24-May-2016 12:50
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MikeB4:

 

The War Powers Resolution requires the President notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action...

 

 

I expect that there's lots of people whose job it is to figure out that something is a "Police Action" rather than a military one. And I'm sure there's lots of CIA forces (who happen to have arms) getting committed rather than "armed" forces.

 

And what happens if he doesn't notify Congress?

 

 


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  Reply # 1558600 24-May-2016 12:52
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frankv:

 

MikeB4:

 

The War Powers Resolution requires the President notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action...

 

 

I expect that there's lots of people whose job it is to figure out that something is a "Police Action" rather than a military one. And I'm sure there's lots of CIA forces (who happen to have arms) getting committed rather than "armed" forces.

 

And what happens if he doesn't notify Congress?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Breaks the law and impeached. 





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


gzt

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  Reply # 1558601 24-May-2016 12:58
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MikeB4:

gzt:
vexxxboy:


gzt:
networkn:


 


gzt: Like Bush Jr? I think you are dead wrong. The president is not a prime minister that can be held to account to some extent by a cabinet, and to a greater extent by a parliament. The president has undivided executive power. There are some checks and balances but the presidential office has enormous executive power.


 


 


 


 


 


 


 


Nope. The president can't declare war without support, and can't pass legislation without Senate AND House passing it first. It's the exact reason Obama couldn't get anything done during his second term, the house blocked everything he proposed. 


 



Nope. President can start and to a large extent fight a war without authorisation from congress. Including invasion of other countries. Also helps a bit if it is not called 'war'. It has happened many times.

On legislation we can agree. That is why Obama and all presidents before him issue executive orders to achieve policy goals. EOs can be used to amend regulation and suspend or implement existing regulation. That sounds mild but these orders essentially issue directives to federal agencies. Ie; activate all emergency detention centres and immediately round up millions of undocumented immigrants would be a perfectly valid executive order.

The office of the president is immensely powerful militarily and in an everyday sense.

POTUS holds enormous sole power.


 


 


 


again not quite , he has those executive orders by an act of congress and if they are not constitutional they can be overturned  by the supreme court, So he is limited to what he can use them for.



Wrong. The power held by the executive is granted by the constitution, not congress.


 


The War Powers Resolution requires the President notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action and forbids armed forces from remaining for more than 60 days, with a further 30 day withdrawal period, without a Congressional authorization for use of military force or a declaration of war by the United States.


The President can veto such things as a declaration of war by Congress and other things.


The War Powers Resolution was passed in 1973 after the Vietnam war and several others had already happened. It is an act of congress. It did not and does not change the constitution.

Presidents have essentially regarded this act as a minor inconvenience at best.

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  Reply # 1558605 24-May-2016 13:05
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What you guys keep missing is that the polls taken prior to election are from the POPULAR vote, which holds NO STANDING in an actual election. DELEGATES decide who goes to office, and whilst those are "elected" by the people, often the popular vote will not reflect that of the final delegate vote. 

 

Example; 

 

Last election, Obama looked like he may not get a second term by the popular vote, it was VERY close, and depending on which region was polled, his opposition held a slight lead. 

 

Actual result: Obama STORMED into office with a fairly comfortable lead. 

 

 


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  Reply # 1558628 24-May-2016 13:09
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joker97: Last i heard trump leads Clinton by 9% (6o clock news said that). That's huge. That's what Americans want at the moment.

 

 

 

It's not that simple.  This shows what I was talking about above.  Note the difference in margin in NBC/WSJ poll when they poll Trump vs Sanders as well as Trump vs Clinton.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


gzt

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  Reply # 1558629 24-May-2016 13:15
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MikeB4:

frankv:


MikeB4:


The War Powers Resolution requires the President notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action...



I expect that there's lots of people whose job it is to figure out that something is a "Police Action" rather than a military one. And I'm sure there's lots of CIA forces (who happen to have arms) getting committed rather than "armed" forces.


And what happens if he doesn't notify Congress?


 



 


Breaks the law and impeached. 


Breaks the law maybe. Then impeachment is not automatic, requires a majority vote. You are still president even if this vote is successful yay!

Next step in the process is actual trial by a Senate committee. After that, a 2/3 majority vote is required to convict and remove the president from office.

Example, Bill Clinton. Executed the office for a long time under impeachment not a problem. Not convicted. President Trump would care even less.

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  Reply # 1558631 24-May-2016 13:29
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Trump is undesirable as a President however much of what he says is for media consumption to generate maximum headline coverage, keeping his name to the fore something that is gold to a electoral hopeful. That said, Trump is not an idiot

 

he has amassed considerable wealth, idiots seldom do this, he wants two terms as President and he is not going to go out and deliberately jeopardise that. I personally do not like his politics and racial beliefs but I also feel there is a mountain load

 

of FUD about this guy.

 

End of the day I do not believe he will be President.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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  Reply # 1558649 24-May-2016 13:45
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Breaks the law maybe. Then impeachment is not automatic, requires a majority vote. You are still president even if this vote is successful yay!

Next step in the process is actual trial by a Senate committee. After that, a 2/3 majority vote is required to convict and remove the president from office.

Example, Bill Clinton. Executed the office for a long time under impeachment not a problem. Not convicted. President Trump would care even less.

 

 

 

Clinton had an immoral affair and was basically given a formal warning. If he had declared war in a way not sanctioned in law, then he would have been very likely removed from Office. 

 

Like anything in life, the worse the offence the stronger the action taken against you.

 

 


gzt

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  Reply # 1558717 24-May-2016 15:18
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networkn:

 



Breaks the law maybe. Then impeachment is not automatic, requires a majority vote. You are still president even if this vote is successful yay!

Next step in the process is actual trial by a Senate committee. After that, a 2/3 majority vote is required to convict and remove the president from office.

Example, Bill Clinton. Executed the office for a long time under impeachment not a problem. Not convicted. President Trump would care even less.


 


Clinton had an immoral affair and was basically given a formal warning. If he had declared war in a way not sanctioned in law, then he would have been very likely removed from Office. 


Like anything in life, the worse the offence the stronger the action taken against you.


 


Not at all. The test is a majority vote to impeach. That is only the first bar. Second is a trial by Senate and a 2/3 vote to convict. No other test.

In fact in regards to the Kosovo war (Bill Clinton again) a group of congressmen took a case to court claiming exactly this violation of the war powers resolution. Clinton did not formally notify, and then Clinton exceeded 60 days.

The court told them to go back to congress. The supreme court declined to hear any appeal.

Clinton conducted a war in a way not sanctioned by the war powers resolution and nothing happened.

Even if he had fully complied with the war powers resolution the immense power the president has is more than enough to create a lot of destruction without asking congress about it for n days.



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  Reply # 1558724 24-May-2016 15:39
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MikeB4:

 

That said, Trump is not an idiot

 

 

Yet he would have made more money from his inheritance if he had put the money in bonds....

 

 

he has amassed considerable wealth, idiots seldom do this

 

 

Does he have money? No doubt. Does he have the wealth he claims (He has claimed to be worth 10 Billion dollars), thats probably as much hyperbole as Trump is usually known for.

 

Estimates that would be more believable than the man who wrote a book about how to use hyperbole in business shows that he is probably worth something between 2 and 4 Billion. Had he invested his money in the S&P 500 (so just put the money away), he would have been worth about 9 Billion today. (So no wonder he don't want anyone to connect the dots).

 

Having run a business with a lot of risk and at one point basically being bankrupt, being just half the way to the results you would have gotten putting your money in S&P 500 is nothing to brag about.

 

 

he wants two terms as President and he is not going to go out and deliberately jeopardise that.

 

 

Not sure how this follows any of the previous things you wrote?

 

 

 

 

End of the day I do not believe he will be President.

 

 

I am not a religious man, but I am praying he won't be. A man as vengeful and (apparently) childish shouldn't run anything of significance.

 

 

 

BTW: Do read up on Trump and bankruptcies. Some of the stories are pretty revolting. Not at all the mark of "a man of the people". Neither is his unwillingness to show his tax return.. 

 

 

 

Sources:

 

Bloomberg news - Here's our tally of Donald Trump's wealth

 

Washington Post - The Myth and reality of Donald Trump's business empire

 

Quora - Did Donald Trump inherit a lot of money and then increase his net worth at an unremarkable rate?

 

Mother Jones - Here's how Donald Trum treats the little people

 

 





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