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  # 1845387 11-Aug-2017 21:06
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Fred99:

 

Trump's cornered himself into a position where he's offering no prospect for negotiation unless DPRK first commits to cease their nuclear program. Given that the objective of any negotiation is to get DPRK to commit to cease their nuclear program, then there's a huge logical flaw in Trump's strategy:

 

His starting point for negotiation precludes the possibility of negotiation - but he actually can't carry out on his threats ( without bringing about armageddon - which won't do much for his already abysmal global popularity)

 

The "Art of the Deal" - what a freaking joke.  He can only negotiate by holding a gun at someone's head.  This time - it's not going to work.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Didn't see that. Although nuclear disarmament has to be a term, there cant be any question there. But an article I read tonight gave 4 options, one of them being accepting NK stays nuclear weaponed. But while NK might not commit to that, but would if there was a good deal, thats still on the table. But he must disarm. Others lets do any 30 years of this


gzt

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  # 1845428 11-Aug-2017 22:20
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Meet Trump's new racist butler, aka foreign policy advisor:

Rolling Stone: The Breitbart News headline, back in November 2014, rang like a five-alarm fire bell: MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD OVERRUNS NATIONAL CATHEDRAL IN DC. Its author, Breitbart's national-security editor, was Dr. Sebastian L. v. Gorka, who currently occupies a top White House post as "deputy assistant" to President Donald Trump.

And like just about anything Gorka has said or written, the Breitbart headline was wrong in every way. It wasn't the Muslim Brotherhood at all, and no one overran anything.

Despite his characteristic hyperventilation, the event in question was a dignified, interfaith prayer service organized jointly by the leaders of Washington National Cathedral and five mainstream Muslim organizations seeking to unite "voices of moderation."

 
 
 
 


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  # 1845433 11-Aug-2017 22:35
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gzt: The large risk for everyone is that America has a somewhat unpopular president. It has an ex-general in charge of the defense dept. America/Trump doing something stupid could easily cost many lives and destabilise the region.

 

Agree.

 

What if NK sends the 4 missiles?  


gzt

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  # 1845437 11-Aug-2017 22:53
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tdgeek: What if NK sends the 4 missiles?

They fall into the sea as planned. The other option is the USA uses a missile to missile defense system to attempt to destroy the missiles in flight. USA currently have a system of some kind installed in South Korea.

There are some associated outcomes with the second option.

USA also has a viable excuse to advance the deployment of an M2m system to Guam. This is itself strategically destabilising to some extent. It also follows that China and Russia will get to see how well it works.

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  # 1845550 12-Aug-2017 13:02
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SaltyNZ:

 

Most of their submarines date from the 50s and 60s and are unable to sail out of sight of land. There was quite a stir a couple of weeks ago when one of them sailed 100km from land for the first time in many years. I don't think anyone in the region considers them a serious threat to modern navies. To be fair, they almost certainly sank a South Korean corvette in 2010, but I suspect if there was a shooting war under way they might have found it a little more difficult. 

 

 

I have to wonder ... what is the point of having a submarine that can't sail out of sight of land?

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  # 1845551 12-Aug-2017 13:04
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MikeB4:

 

Bill English has said we will consider helping if NK attacks. hmmm what on earth with? 4 C130's and two aging Frigates and Patrol Craft that cant go to sea. 

 

 

We can line up at the border and do a really fierce haka.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  # 1845553 12-Aug-2017 13:06
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tdgeek:

 

If he did attack, he knows he will die, and his rule is over and the country is buggered. Allowing SK and maybe China to rebuild it, the dynasty ends. 

 

 

In today's reality that doesn't seem to be much of a disincentive anymore. Fanatics everywhere are eager to die for their cause, as long as they can bring everyone else down with them.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


 
 
 
 


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  # 1845574 12-Aug-2017 15:33
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tdgeek:

 

 

 

If he did attack, he knows he will die, and his rule is over and the country is buggered. Allowing SK and maybe China to rebuild it, the dynasty ends. 

 

 

 

 

Unfortunately NK has a belief that if this happened, it would result in a united Korea, and the supreme leader would have caused that unification and therefore be a martyr and fulfilled the prophecy. The dynasty's aim is to reunite Korea.

 

 

 

 North Korea's policy is to seek reunification without what it sees as outside interference

 

And considering Korea is the way it is since "outside interference" created it in WW2, it's pushing stuff uphill with a pointy stick.

 

 

 

So to get down to it, the US and GB (with some help) have created the things that are troubling us now, since WW2. Korea, Israel-Palestine, ISIS.... 

 

What an awesome track record. Maybe if they all minded their own business, the world would be peaceful.


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  # 1845575 12-Aug-2017 15:55
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People are getting very worked up over this. But the missiles in question are not a threat to the mainland US. It's doubtful they could reach as far as Alaska. A smart president would've already heard this from advisers. A smart president wouldn't be fighting fire with petrol, to be fair. The worst thing that could happen now would be for someone to tell Trump that Obama would use diplomacy and try not to fight. Given that his strategy is "do the opposite of whatever I think Obama would have done" that could prove disastrous.

 

Edit: before anyone misunderstands me, what I'm saying is that the US is safe. It's Japan and SK that really need to be guiding policy here. They are the ones who will be in the firing line if the shooting starts.





iPad Pro 11" + iPhone XS + 2degrees 4tw!

 

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.


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  # 1845580 12-Aug-2017 16:01
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This guy is bat crap crazy. Who will be next?

https://i.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/95719866/us-president-donald-trump-picks-fresh-fight-with-venezuela




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

There is no planet B

 

 


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  # 1845592 12-Aug-2017 16:34
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SaltyNZ:

 

People are getting very worked up over this. But the missiles in question are not a threat to the mainland US. It's doubtful they could reach as far as Alaska. A smart president would've already heard this from advisers. A smart president wouldn't be fighting fire with petrol, to be fair. The worst thing that could happen now would be for someone to tell Trump that Obama would use diplomacy and try not to fight. Given that his strategy is "do the opposite of whatever I think Obama would have done" that could prove disastrous.

 

Edit: before anyone misunderstands me, what I'm saying is that the US is safe. It's Japan and SK that really need to be guiding policy here. They are the ones who will be in the firing line if the shooting starts.

 

 

 

 

It seem like you are more expert than most on this topic. I am sure the Americans will be heartened by your advice.

 

They have already proven they can deliver a missile over that distance, all that remains is if they can guide it accurately and add weaponry to it that would survive the heat. 

 

But more importantly do they really have the intention, or can the world afford to have it available. We know Trump is all wind, but so far NK seems to be putting its money where its mouth is. No clue, as its just insanity.


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  # 1845630 12-Aug-2017 19:51
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Is THIS BULLS**T for real? Or is this fake news?

 

From that Conservative American website Conservative Tree comes this gem. Guam’s governor, Eddie Baza Calvo, posted a video to Facebook in which he has a more-than-three-minute phone conversation with Trump, heard on speakerphone.

 

In it Trump is heard saying

 

"Don't worry about a thing," President Trump responded. "They should have had me eight years ago...I have to say, Eddie, you're going to become extremely famous. All over the world they're talking about Guam and they're talking about you."
"And your tourism, I can say this, your tourism is going to go up like tenfold with the expenditure of no money, so I congratulate you," Trump can be heard saying over the phone. "It looks beautiful, you know I'm watching...it's such a big story in the news. It just looks like a beautiful place."

 

"Hopefully it will all work out," he said. "Nobody loves a peaceful solution more than President Trump, that I can tell you ... But we will see what happens. We think that lots of good things could happen, and we could also have a bad solution."

 

God, it must be embarrassing to be a normal American.


gzt

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  # 1845633 12-Aug-2017 20:01
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Insert with youtube tag:


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  # 1845634 12-Aug-2017 20:02
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DaveB:

 

Is THIS BULLS**T for real? Or is this fake news?

 

From that Conservative American website Conservative Tree comes this gem. Guam’s governor, Eddie Baza Calvo, posted a video to Facebook in which he has a more-than-three-minute phone conversation with Trump, heard on speakerphone.

 

In it Trump is heard saying

 

"Don't worry about a thing," President Trump responded. "They should have had me eight years ago...I have to say, Eddie, you're going to become extremely famous. All over the world they're talking about Guam and they're talking about you."
"And your tourism, I can say this, your tourism is going to go up like tenfold with the expenditure of no money, so I congratulate you," Trump can be heard saying over the phone. "It looks beautiful, you know I'm watching...it's such a big story in the news. It just looks like a beautiful place."

 

"Hopefully it will all work out," he said. "Nobody loves a peaceful solution more than President Trump, that I can tell you ... But we will see what happens. We think that lots of good things could happen, and we could also have a bad solution."

 

God, it must be embarrassing to be a normal American.

 

 

OMG

 

I checked flights and hotels, I need a US Military ID lol


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  # 1845647 12-Aug-2017 20:32
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blakamin:

 

tdgeek:

 

 

 

If he did attack, he knows he will die, and his rule is over and the country is buggered. Allowing SK and maybe China to rebuild it, the dynasty ends. 

 

 

 

 

Unfortunately NK has a belief that if this happened, it would result in a united Korea, and the supreme leader would have caused that unification and therefore be a martyr and fulfilled the prophecy. The dynasty's aim is to reunite Korea.

 

 

 

 North Korea's policy is to seek reunification without what it sees as outside interference

 

And considering Korea is the way it is since "outside interference" created it in WW2, it's pushing stuff uphill with a pointy stick.

 

 

 

So to get down to it, the US and GB (with some help) have created the things that are troubling us now, since WW2. Korea, Israel-Palestine, ISIS.... 

 

What an awesome track record. Maybe if they all minded their own business, the world would be peaceful.

 

 

Ive read some articles on possible outcomes. Ranging from let NK be a Nuclear power to full on war. They have mentioned fatalistic. When its gone too far, NK will go down fighting and as you say be the martyr. The sad thing is the citizens. I have no idea how many hate the US. I do know that every house has to have his worships pic in most rooms, and that they have anonymous people listening for anti chatter, then you disappear.

 

Read an article the other day, he lives better than a king. Jets, super yacht, multiple palaces, its unreal. His people, have often eaten the aid he bargained for .


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