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dclegg
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  #1929757 5-Jan-2018 11:33
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Fred99:

 

How did "when they go low - we go high" work out as a tactic?

 



Look at how "When they go low, we go lower" is working as a tactic. Political discourse is dying because of this.
 
So I'm treating all these as allegations rather than fact. 


dclegg
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  #1929759 5-Jan-2018 11:36
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And ACK on your "Trump is evil" comment. But we do have to be careful about how this evil is fought. All it takes is one false claim for people to disbelieve all the true and completely provable ones. This is a tactic that Republicans and Trump employ often, because it is very effective. 


Fred99
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  #1929761 5-Jan-2018 11:41
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dclegg:

 

Fred99:

 

How did "when they go low - we go high" work out as a tactic?

 



Look at how "When they go low, we go lower" is working as a tactic. Political discourse is dying because of this.
 
So I'm treating all these as allegations rather than fact. 

 

 

Please provide examples of mainstream opposition going lower than Trump's lows.  I think that statement of yours needs "fact-checking".

 

Rational political discourse is effectively dead anyway - and I doubt it's coming back anytime soon. 

 

Sorry if that's defeatist, but when Trump goes down, as I expect he will - screaming and in flames, then his supporters will want blood.


dclegg
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  #1929764 5-Jan-2018 11:45
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Fred99:

 

Please provide examples of mainstream opposition going lower than Trump's lows.  I think that statement of yours needs "fact-checking".

 



It's a turn of phrase. The point is we need to keep political discourse rooted in facts. Allegations without any proof to back them up is not helpful, and results in the current political environment we have.


gzt

gzt
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  #1929765 5-Jan-2018 11:45
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No word yet if Trump will sue Ivanka for revealing the secrets of his hair.

Trump authorised Wolff to talk to anyone at any time. The 'legal action' is just for show.

kingdragonfly
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  #1929768 5-Jan-2018 11:56
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I'd like to think most Americans can distinguish accusations from fact.

But US history, and Trump himself, show this is not the case: from McCarthyism to "Birthers"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories

It's hard to feel sympathy for conservatives, when they've successfully smeared liberals with just rumors.

geekIT
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  #1929854 5-Jan-2018 13:24
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When you have a playground bully screeching incessantly to anyone who'll listen that speech-impaired classmate John Doe is a gay, mentally handicapped orphan whose syphilitic parents died of drug abuse, is it of any value for John to keep responding with hesitant and stuttering denials?

 

I don't think so.

 

Trump has created his own climate and culture, where fact-bending, truth distortion, outright lies, deceit and treachery have become the norm, and the sooner he's taken out of play, the better.

 

Right now the world needs to rid itself of Trump and his goons as quickly as possible, and if that means using his own apparatus and methods against him, so be it.

 

There'll be plenty of time later for a return to honesty and decency, but the longer that Trump's behavior is accepted as normal, the longer that healing will take.

 

 





'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.' Voltaire

 

'If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer.' Stevie Wonder - 'Superstition'

 

 


Fred99
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  #1929878 5-Jan-2018 14:03
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dclegg:

 

Fred99:

 

Please provide examples of mainstream opposition going lower than Trump's lows.  I think that statement of yours needs "fact-checking".

 



It's a turn of phrase. The point is we need to keep political discourse rooted in facts. Allegations without any proof to back them up is not helpful, and results in the current political environment we have.

 

 

Facts are so easy to find.  Political discourse in America is dominated by faith.  It's too late.

 


TLD

TLD
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  #1929886 5-Jan-2018 14:27
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Fred99:

 

He's also set his lawyers on Wolff and his publisher Henry Holt & Co.

 

The dotard and his sleazy lawyers don't seem to be aware of the Streisand Effect:

 

 

This is from about half way down this article on BBC News

 

You can't buy this kind of publicity

 

By the BBC's Anthony Zurcher in Washington

 

Donald Trump might want to familiarise himself with the so-called Streisand Effect. The lesson, most prominently learned by singer Barbra Streisand when she tried to quash photographs of her home that appeared on an obscure website, is that the more you fight against undesirable news, the more you call attention to it.

 

Thanks to his lawyer's "cease and desist" letter, Mr Trump is giving Michael Wolff and his explosive book the kind of massive publicity boost money alone can't buy.

 

The highly critical allegations are leading every news programme and newspaper front page (and burying the latest round of glowing US economic news that might otherwise garner attention).

 

Threatening lawsuits is a common tactic for Mr Trump, dating back to his days as a New York real estate mogul. Very seldom does he follow up with actual court action. In this case, such a move would be particularly risky.

 

To meet the "actual malice" requirement of US libel law, the president would open himself up to investigation from opposing lawyers seeking to prove that Wolff's allegations had substance - or, at the very least - that he had reason to believe they did.





Trevor Dennis
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Pumpedd
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  #1929918 5-Jan-2018 15:30
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TLD:

 

Fred99:

 

He's also set his lawyers on Wolff and his publisher Henry Holt & Co.

 

The dotard and his sleazy lawyers don't seem to be aware of the Streisand Effect:

 

 

This is from about half way down this article on BBC News

 

You can't buy this kind of publicity

 

By the BBC's Anthony Zurcher in Washington

 

Donald Trump might want to familiarise himself with the so-called Streisand Effect. The lesson, most prominently learned by singer Barbra Streisand when she tried to quash photographs of her home that appeared on an obscure website, is that the more you fight against undesirable news, the more you call attention to it.

 

Thanks to his lawyer's "cease and desist" letter, Mr Trump is giving Michael Wolff and his explosive book the kind of massive publicity boost money alone can't buy.

 

The highly critical allegations are leading every news programme and newspaper front page (and burying the latest round of glowing US economic news that might otherwise garner attention).

 

Threatening lawsuits is a common tactic for Mr Trump, dating back to his days as a New York real estate mogul. Very seldom does he follow up with actual court action. In this case, such a move would be particularly risky.

 

To meet the "actual malice" requirement of US libel law, the president would open himself up to investigation from opposing lawyers seeking to prove that Wolff's allegations had substance - or, at the very least - that he had reason to believe they did.

 

 

Trump doesnt care..he will just want to hurt the individuals and that seems to be happening. He is a pig afterall, and nothing new really has come out that we didnt either know or suspect. I do hope this may trigger a case against Trump for sexual misconduct.


TLD

TLD
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  #1929933 5-Jan-2018 16:25
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I was thinking that they were bringing the release date forward to get the horse out of the stable door before Trump's lawyers could bolt it, but I am not wondering if the publishers are thinking they no longer need a pre-release publicity drive, as the book has all the publicity it needs to go stellar.  It will be available from 9am ET, which I think is our 3am on Saturday.  The site I saw mentioned 'All versions' so I bet the Kindle version will be available when we get up tomorrow.  I can barely believe that I intend reading anything that Steve Bannon contributed to!





Trevor Dennis
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Fred99
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  #1930971 5-Jan-2018 18:09
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I think Bannon clumsily tried to extract himself from a very difficult situation (of his own making) by pledging allegiance to the Trumpist cause - but it looks like he's out big time.

 

As well as being named "Sloppy Steve" by Trump, it appears that (Rebekah) Mercer has condemned Bannon - which must make his position at Breitbart untenable (she owns Breitbart).

 

They will have to work fast and hard - Bannon has some loyal following, believers in "draining the swamp".  The comments section on Breitbart today are priceless - divided.

 

So, if "draining the swamp" and supporting the "(white) working class" are still an issue, Trump has betrayed those supporters (of course he would - he was always a false prophet).  Mercer/Trump can pull the rug out from under Bannon, but other far right supporters of Trump will be looking over their shoulders. Trump is the swamp - it was inevitable.

 

From hero to zero - or is Bannon a potential threat to split the GOP support base?  I despise Bannon - but respect his intellect - so IMO he's a step ahead of Trump as I don't accept that stupidity excuses true evil.

 

 

 


geekIT
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  #1931039 5-Jan-2018 20:48
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"I authorized Zero access to White House (actually turned him down many times) for author of phony book! I never spoke to him for book".

 

What on earth is the Orange Trumpkinhead talking about here?

 

"I authorized zero access..." To who?

 

Is he talking about Bannon or Wollf?

 

If it's Wollf he's referring to, how come this guy was able to spend umpteen hours sitting around the White House interviewing people?

 

I don't get it. What am I missing? 

 

 





'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.' Voltaire

 

'If you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer.' Stevie Wonder - 'Superstition'

 

 


Sideface
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  #1931043 5-Jan-2018 20:50
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geekIT:

 

"I authorized Zero access to White House (actually turned him down many times) for author of phony book! I never spoke to him for book".

 

What on earth is the Orange Trumpkinhead talking about here?

 

"I authorized zero access..." To who?

 

Is he talking about Bannon or Wollf?

 

If it's Wollf he's referring to, how come this guy was able to spend umpteen hours sitting around the White House interviewing people?

 

I don't get it. What am I missing? 

 



 

Dementia.





Sideface


Pumpedd
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  #1931059 5-Jan-2018 21:34
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Apparently Trump has demanded a copy of the book...he is demanding an ibook as he gets a headache reading!!! I guess his wife could read it to him as a bedtime story with his Bigmacs. j/k


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